I no longer consider myself a christian

[thecoolnessrune]

If you told me that the sky was obviously blue, I'd have to go outside to check to make sure nothing had changed.

lulz.

You mind-reading capabilities are worse than your ability to substantiate the abundance of silly claims you laid against me already in this thread.

Like you, we can all have opinions of each other. You have yours, I have mine.

But you're still here because none of this matters to you, at all, of course, and your feathers are totally unruffled. Please, do tell us again.

My feathers are totally unruffled. None of this matters to me, or in the grand scheme of things, no one else.

For someone that claims to care so little about what we think, you spend an inordinate amount of time writing about it.

Pretty much the definition of neffing isn't it?

You're still projecting...

You're still in denial...

...as is obvious right here. You do not speak for everyone, and I know for a fact that what you claim is not true.

Factual? Really now.. Sounds like a great opportunity to lay out a nice link to a post where someone here in any religion thread has told you in any related capacity, that as a religious person, he sees and understands your points as being correct, whereas his are wrong, and thus is now changed.

Totally baseless assertion and contradicted by my personal experience.

Too bad your personal experience is just as baseless as mine... Guess what? We can both claim that

That would appear to be your goal, which you are projecting on to others.

That is contradicted by my "personal experience."

I'm adequately secure in the knowledge that it is obvious who has done the lion's share of the bitching in this thread.

You're the only one getting in a twist cause someone won't play your game :biggrin:

"Theory's"?

Desperation is a stinky cologne, ol' chap. Might I suggest a bath?

I don't need to know what other people think of you. I'm quite able to form my own opinions. If you are not so able, then I am sorry for you.

Quite able to. I've formed my opinion of you but am not stupid enough to believe that how you come across here is representative of your true nature.

Maybe you need a new hobby.

Considering you are arguing with me over all of it not to mention spending time trying to change people's minds over the internet... Perhaps you should look into a new one as well. :biggrin:

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

My feathers are totally unruffled. None of this matters to me, or in the grand scheme of things, no one else.

Obviously false, but keep fucking that chicken.

Pretty much the definition of neffing isn't it?

Not as far as I am aware, and that does not invalidate my implication.

You're still in denial...

I have repeatedly invited you to correct these woeful misgivings you believe that I have, and you have been heretofore unable. Forgive me if your claims come across more than a little impotent after that.

Factual? Really now.. Sounds like a great opportunity to lay out a nice link to a post where someone here in any religion thread has told you in any related capacity, that as a religious person, he sees and understands your points as being correct, whereas his are wrong, and thus is now changed.

I'm not aware of a means of posting links to private messages, nor do I think the content of such messages are really any of your business. It is amusing to see your claim move from "nobody cares" to "no religious person has admitted to seeing and understanding [my] points as being correct, whereas his are wrong, and this is now changed," however.

Too bad your personal experience is just as baseless as mine... Guess what? We can both claim that

I don't think you understand what "baseless" means.

That is contradicted by my "personal experience."

If you say so. Your behavior clearly contradicts you, however.

You're the only one getting in a twist cause someone won't play your game :biggrin:

What game is that? All I ever did was note the irony of your hypocrisy, and that launched you into this whole defensive exchange, throughout which you've incessantly wailed and whinged about me, but never actually absolved yourself of your blatant hypocrisy. I don't care if you choose to take a position in the religious discussion or not, but if you did, I would subject it to the same scrutiny as any other. How that amounts to me being allegedly upset that you won't do so is, frankly, beyond me. I guess you have to be a certain kind of retard for that to make sense.

Desperation is a stinky cologne, ol' chap. Might I suggest a bath?

Hey, you were the one that tried to get all grammar Nazi on me when I made a simple typo, so don't get all butthurt when it's thrown back in your face. Note that I never made your grammatical error the basis of any argument the way you did.

Quite able to. I've formed my opinion of you but am not stupid enough to believe that how you come across here is representative of your true nature.

No, I'm sure you're much stupider.

Considering you are arguing with me over all of it not to mention spending time trying to change people's minds over the internet... Perhaps you should look into a new one as well. :biggrin:

I enjoy this. This is what I choose to do, and I do it quite well. By all means, let's continue.

 

[totalnoob]

Factual? Really now.. Sounds like a great opportunity to lay out a nice link to a post where someone here in any religion thread has told you in any related capacity, that as a religious person, he sees and understands your points as being correct, whereas his are wrong, and thus is now changed.

This virtually never happens during a debate, however debates do plant seeds in people's minds that they later reflect on, and this can ultimately lead to them changing their views. Of course there are no stats for this sort of thing, but I can tell you for a fact that debating religion and trying to defend my my faith online over the past few years is what ultimately led me to lose it. I never conceded this or thanked one of my atheist/agnostic opponents for the arguments they made or the sources they referred me to. They have no idea that I was deconverted as a result of those interactions, but I can say with certainty that this was true in my case.

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

This virtually never happens during a debate, however debates do plant seeds in people's minds that they later reflect on, and this can ultimately lead to them changing their views. Of course there are no stats for this sort of thing, but I can tell you for a fact that debating religion and trying to defend my my faith online over the past few years is what ultimately led me to lose it. I never conceded this or thanked one of my atheist/agnostic opponents for the arguments they made or the sources they referred me to. They have no idea that I was deconverted as a result of those interactions, but I can say with certainty that this was true in my case.

To be sure, I began my journey as an Evangelical Christian, and (humorously) thanks to a particular religious discussion forum I approached in attempt to explore my faith, I wound up an atheist.

But nothing anyone says on the internet matters to anyone, ever. Just ask thecoolnessrune.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

To be sure, I began my journey as an Evangelical Christian, and (humorously) thanks to a particular religious discussion forum I approached in attempt to explore my faith, I wound up an atheist.

But nothing anyone says on the internet matters to anyone, ever. Just ask thecoolnessrune.

I'm waiting for indisputable data that shows you personally changed someone's mind about religion in your direct discussion with them. You're the one who has been touting the idea of necessary facts, and yet the only thing you base your facts on is "personal experience". Sorry but if you wrote a paper and said that all of your evidence in your paper is based on "personal experience", I highly doubt you'd get too far. But as you've already said you don't think it's anyone's business, and thus it must not be important enough. You know why? Because it's the internet, not some scientific review board. If someone takes you seriously, that's great, but you *expect* them too, which is laughable really

You also try some simple game of trying to press your imagined self-superiority by saying i'm "stupider" (your words, not mine) than you for simply not seeing things your way. But no one wants to say they're wrong on the internet

You have this silly god-complex about you (irony!) that leads you to believe that just because you don't believe something I say (such as how my feathers aren't ruffled), it must be false.

Let's see it this way, if I just suddenly typed out a bunch of obscenities in all caps, does that change my current disposition? No, it doesn't. You can't know my disposition because you aren't here. You have no *evidence*. Yet you still firmly believe your correct.. That sounds a little hypocritical considering that you claim you try to combat faulty reasoning.

If you think you do this well, then that's a personal opinion of yours that likely may be incorrect, considering that as what's written above shows you to be little more than a hypocrite. And if you're a hypocrite, how can you be trusted? But that would put you in the same boat as me, and your poor psyche couldn't handle that now could it.. :hmm:

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

I'm waiting for indisputable data that shows you personally changed someone's mind about religion in your direct discussion with them.

Did I claim to have done this? Please, quote my claim.

You're the one who has been touting the idea of necessary facts, and yet the only thing you base your facts on is "personal experience".

My personal experiences are factual enough for me.

Sorry but if you wrote a paper and said that all of your evidence in your paper is based on "personal experience", I highly doubt you'd get too far.

This charge is absolutely hilarious coming from a person who has ignored every single demand to substantiate his claims in this thread.

But as you've already said you don't think it's anyone's business, and thus it must not be important enough.

It isn't really. To anyone with an IQ greater than his shoe size it isn't much of a leap to expect that readers-along learn new things and adjust their beliefs accordingly when these discussions come about.

You know why? Because it's the internet, not some scientific review board. If someone takes you seriously, that's great, but you *expect* them too, which is laughable really

You should reallly stop trying to tell me what my own motivations are, because I know them better than you do, and you are far off-base. I understand that other people will have different reactions and opinions about the posts I make, and I know that the majority of people do take the things I say into consideration on some level.

Why would it be laughable to expect to be taken seriously, anyway? Just because you aren't smart enough to assimilate legitimate facts when presented to you on an internet message board does not meant that nobody else is. As I've said before, and I'll say again, you're clearly projecting.

You also try some simple game of trying to press your imagined self-superiority by saying i'm "stupider" (your words, not mine) than you for simply not seeing things your way. But no one wants to say they're wrong on the internet

I have no idea what you're talking about. Please try to write more coherently.

You have this silly god-complex about you (irony!)

... that leads you to believe that just because you don't believe something I say (such as how my feathers aren't ruffled), it must be false.

No, it appears to be false because your behavior indicates that it is false. People who do not have their panties in a wad do not continue in a thread for the better half of a dozen meticulously dissected posts, urging his opponent to "go cry more" or calling him a "noob" or a "bitch" or nitpicking typos as if they were grammatical mistakes when they do not have their panties in a wad about something. I've been very clear about this all along, but for obvious reasons of mental handicap you are unable to gather it.

Let's see it this way, if I just suddenly typed out a bunch of obscenities in all caps, does that change my current disposition?

It would by all appearances reflect it.

No, it doesn't. You can't know my disposition because you aren't here. You have no *evidence*.

The string of cap-laden obsceneties is evidence. Please learn what evidence is.

Yet you still firmly believe your correct..

Until I'm presented with new evidence which would modify my conclusion it is the only reasonable position to take.

That sounds a little hypocritical considering that you claim you try to combat faulty reasoning.

I don't think you would know the difference between sound and faulty reasoning if one of them shat on your head while the other penetrated your favorite posterior phallus recepticle.

If you think you do this well, then that's a personal opinion of yours that likely may be incorrect, considering that as what's written above shows you to be little more than a hypocrite.

In your tiny mind, perhaps. I've been completely consistent throughout this exchange -- which incidentally began with your own blatant hypocrisy.

And if you're a hypocrite, how can you be trusted?

If you are a bird, why don't you fly?

But that would put you in the same boat as me, and your poor psyche couldn't handle that now could it.. :hmm:

I'm quite adept at acknowleding and accepting facts, and the fact is that you and I are definitely not in the same boat.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

But here you are still talking about all this. If you were really trying to help you would have noticed this obvious trolling and ignored it. But you're not here to help remember? You're here for self-validation.

You aren't providing evidence because you are going off *assumptions*. This is obvious. You have no proof about you changing anyone's life, you have no proof about anyone caring about what you post, you have no proof of my feather's being ruffled. You make cognitive leaps of what you *want* to be true. What was that word you used? Oh yes, projecting.

So while we're all projecting here, if I see this pen on my desk, and don't remember putting it there, God must have put it there, because my door has been locked all day. The logic is perfect! Or at least, it is according to your own ramblings

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

But here you are still talking about all this.

Yes, I am. I enjoy this. I thought I was quite clear about it. What part of that did you fail to grasp? The "I"? The "enjoy"? Or was it "this"?

If you were really trying to help you would have noticed this obvious trolling and ignored it.

Non-sequitur. I frequently engage obvious trolls because they can be made to be examples. Didn't you see how long I carried on with PhinneasJWhoopee?

But you're not here to help remember? You're here for self-validation.

Quite clearly false, and still you fight the impossible battle of trying to convince me that you know my own motivations better than I do myself. Good luck with that.

You aren't providing evidence because you are going off *assumptions*. This is obvious.

I'm not providing evidence because the evidence I have doesn't lend itself to linking in a forum post, but none of the claims I've made stretch the limits of credulity for reasonable people, however. Obviously, you are not among that group.

You have no proof about you changing anyone's life, you have no proof about anyone caring about what you post, you have no proof of my feather's being ruffled. You make cognitive leaps of what you *want* to be true.

I'm quite happy to let my claims stand on their own merits and allow people to believe or disbelieve them as they so choose. It should be easily apparent that you certainly care what it is that I say, else you wouldn't have gotten your panties all wadded up in the first place. That covers 2 out of the 3 anyway.

What was that word you used? Oh yes, projecting.

Yes, I did, and I'm quite confident you fail to comprehend its meaning.

So while we're all projecting here, if I see this pen on my desk, and don't remember putting it there, God must have put it there, because my door has been locked all day. The logic is perfect! Or at least, it is according to your own ramblings

It is strange to me that for at least a few lines in each of your posts you spruik of a string of words that at least appear to be Engish, but seem to have only a tenuous connection to eachother, and virtually no connection to the subject matter at hand. Are you having difficulty focusing your thoughts? I suggest you work harder to contribute more meaningful arguments if you intend to continue.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

I'm having no problems focusing thoughts, you merely have trouble seeing past your own veil Don't worry about it.

Again you say I misunderstand your motivations, and yet attempt to understand mine (along with that painful desire within your soul to stir me up. I assume that's what gets you off )

You yourself say that you haven't provided any evidence, and yet you're expecting me, as someone who has far less vested interest in this than you do, to do so instead? Quit being so silly :biggrin:

 

[Taejin]

ITT: people quoting line by line thus no one else giving a flying fuck

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

I'm having no problems focusing thoughts

Your incoherent ramblings suggest otherwise.

...you merely have trouble seeing past your own veil Don't worry about it.

If being unable to decipher the nonsensical blatherings of a demonstrated idiot is wearing a veil, then I suppose I do.

Again you say I misunderstand your motivations, and yet attempt to understand mine

Where did I purport to know your motivations? Please, as before and always, show me where I have said anything which could be construed this way.

(along with that painful desire within your soul to stir me up. I assume that's what gets you off )

You assume wrongly.

You yourself say that you haven't provided any evidence

I said that there is ample evidence to falsify at least two of the three claims you've made, and it isn't really a stretch for a reasonable person to realize the falsity of the third. Of course, you've moved the goalposts so many times, I doubt that you even have an idea of which claims I'm speaking.

...and yet you're expecting me, as someone who has far less vested interest in this than you do, to do so instead? Quit being so silly :biggrin:

The claims you have made are about things I have allegedly said or done in this thread. If such evidence existed it would be incredibly easy to supply. That you persistently fail to supply that substatiation can only lead one to conclude that your charges are false, and you are simply being dishonest.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

ITT: people quoting line by line thus no one else giving a flying fuck

But it makes our bitching more specific and thus better!

 

[dud]

I am ambivalent to this whole issue ...

 

[thecoolnessrune]

The claims you have made are about things I have allegedly said or done in this thread. If such evidence existed it would be incredibly easy to supply. That you persistently fail to supply that substatiation can only lead one to conclude that your charges are false, and you are simply being dishonest.

Substantiate with indisputable evidence that your words specifically about religion have changed the mind of anyone here reading them.

Else you're being dishonest, as you yourself said that it is fact that you've changed people here. You believe that your words matter here and are changing peoples lives. So you should have no problem providing proof. Because that's what learned people do when they make statements like that.

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

Substantiate with indisputable evidence that your words specifically about religion have changed the mind of anyone here reading them.

Where have I claimed this? Please, quote me directly.

Else you're being dishonest, as you yourself said that it is fact that you've changed people here.

Did I? Where I say that?

You believe that your words matter here and are changing peoples lives.

Of course my words matter. If they didn't matter they wouldn't have garnered so much attention from the likes of you. Are you not now different than you were before you read them? Do you not now have new opinions about me and the subjects we've discussed? Don't be so naive. You don't realize the history I have discussing these subjects on public forums. Hell, if I did feel so inclined I could probably dig up more than a handful of threads on this forum alone wherein I brought to light common misconceptions and errors of fact or reasoning. If you're not naive then you're clearly obtuse.

So you should have no problem providing proof. Because that's what learned people do when they make statements like that.

I imagine that's precisely why you yourself don't do what you demand of me.

 

[Taejin]

might as well piss into this pool even though its been stale for awhile!

good for you OP! I view religion as a lie, and as an infectious meme that's evolved rather splendidly as an idea, but really has run its course. every follower that drops religion, for _whatever_ reason is another small step forward for mankind!

 

[Cerpin Taxt]

Oh and feel free to get around to substantiating these little gems any time...

You responded to a lot of posts where you stated you "didn't care" as well. Sorry man, you're in the same place I am in that regard, whichever way you want to swing it.

Please show me "lots" of these posts. Show me any, for that matter.

You choose to think of things a certain way and then try to push that there's no way you can be wrong. You'll continue to post drivel like above in an attempt to hide your own backpeddling.

You have an open and standing invitation to prove me wrong, and what in the world have I backpedaled from? You appear to be simply tossing accusations out hoping something will stick.

Mk dude You have shown clearly that you do not have any such capability to reason when you attempt to build up this list of simple fallacies, but balk when your own list of simple fallacies is shown to you.

Which fallacies were those? By all means, please be specific. Where are all those examples I demanded to back up the claims you've already made? Do you have any concern for the truth at all, or do you believe that simply hurling enough false accusations is eventually tantamount to making a true one?

I'm waiting for indisputable data that shows you personally changed someone's mind about religion in your direct discussion with them.

Did I claim to have done this? Please, quote my claim.

 

[videogames101]

I can't prove to you that God exist, but God has proven to me that he exist, it didn't require another person to tell me he exist, and that is all that matters.

Cool story bro, unfortunately personal experience is the worst kind of evidence. =(

The thing is, the human mind is so easily manipulated that despite whatever you think you've experienced, what actually happened and the conclusions you can draw from that are so limited in their scope that it's a waste of item to even consider personal experience as a form of evidence when formulating any belief, although if it's a trivial belief then who really cares. For something like an omnipotent being, or an afterlife, you'll want a second opinion. =D

 

[thecoolnessrune]

I imagine that's precisely why you yourself don't do what you demand of me.

You seem to have a short memory. After all, I said that this is simply fun for me. Providing any such evidence beyond a cursory glance is rather boring and I have what I justify to be better things to do with my time

But by all means feel free to supply evidence, or don't. My credibility matters not when I don't have a position one way or another in this thread. However your credibility comes into question when you make all these reaching assumptions about other people based on your "personal experience" without you know.. any proof

 

[videogames101]

You seem to have a short memory. After all, I said that this is simply fun for me. Providing any such evidence beyond a cursory glance is rather boring and I have what I justify to be better things to do with my time

But by all means feel free to supply evidence, or don't. My credibility matters not when I don't have a position one way or another in this thread. However your credibility comes into question when you make all these reaching assumptions about other people based on your "personal experience" without you know.. any proof

Saying that you don't care doesn't make you more right, nor does it make you look any smarter.


Btw, doesn't everyone know that every word they read affects them?

 

[thecoolnessrune]

Saying that you don't care doesn't make you more right, nor does it make you look any smarter.
Btw, doesn't everyone know that every word they read affects them?

I completely agree. However I think it would be kind of odd if a person wrote words on these forums for the mere ideal of words affecting someone by contact. Obviously by the idea of "change" people expect that there words are reaching beyond that, which is where the challenge comes in. It is silly to expect to be listened to by people of opposite ideals on this particular venue. In a proper debate forum or in publishing a peer-reviewed article I would expect a serious tone, but certainly not here. And I certainly wouldn't be posting assumptions and posting them as fact by hiding behind "personal experience" and "it's false because I say it's false" methodologies.

 

[videogames101]

I completely agree. However I think it would be kind of odd if a person wrote words on these forums for the mere ideal of words affecting someone by contact. Obviously by the idea of "change" people expect that there words are reaching beyond that, which is where the challenge comes in. It is silly to expect to be listened to by people of opposite ideals on this particular venue. In a proper debate forum or in publishing a peer-reviewed article I would expect a serious tone, but certainly not here. And I certainly wouldn't be posting assumptions and posting them as fact by hiding behind "personal experience" and "it's false because I say it's false" methodologies.

You are attacking a straw man.

That is all.

Also, you'll respond by saying you are not, but let me preempt that and respond by saying we'll have to agree to disagree. Man, free will is great.

 

[thecoolnessrune]

Also, you'll respond by saying you are not, but let me preempt that and respond by saying we'll have to agree to disagree. Man, free will is great.

On this, we agree

 

[ctark]

So here I am almost exactly 5 years later and I stumble upon this thread I started. A few observations and thoughts.

1. I'm ashamed I called someone a lovely human.

2. I'm still an atheist/agnostic. Some would argue they are different, but really they are essentially the same. Most of my friends are atheist. All of my family knows my stance, it has been the cause of some divide, mostly do to my choosing. I no longer have a relationship with my grandparents. Religion isn't the only reason, but it played a big part in my decision that I was just done with that part of my life. They are really conservative southern baptist Christians. I decided I didn't want my future kids getting their heads filled with their bat shit insane idea's about the world. (I'm engaged now)

3. I went from a staunch right wing republican to a someone who is a Bernie Sanders supporter. I wouldn't call myself a liberal. I don't necessarily like political labels. I like to separate each issue as its own issue and make a reasoned decision not based on what group i identify with believes in. Once you put all the religion BS aside and out of your mind it really opens up your view of the world and you think about things a different way. I liken my personal experience with religion as a sickness. It crept into every crevice of the way I acted and thought. When I was a "christian", I never acted the part. I had the belief part, but I didn't follow the "rules". But even so, it drastically changed the way I thought and acted in certain situations.

4. I'm no longer afraid to be wrong. I like to debate and I like to listen to others and exchange thoughts. I like listening to the greatest minds of our times (Richard Dawkins, NGD, L. Krauss) just to name a few. I generally feel like I care more about my fellow man and the world as a whole now that I don't have this fear of some invisible sky man that watches everything I do.

5. I never considered myself racist in the traditional sense. But being brought up the way I was, it would be next to impossible for some of my families discriminatory habits and remarks not to rub off on me. I have never been the type of person that would openly discriminate against someone in public, or do an action against that person because the color of their skin. To give an example, I would say I would not have had an open mind to the discrimination that some minorities face today in this country of ours. The reason I didn't have an open mind is because of how I was raised, and that racism kind of crept into that part of my life when dealing with the social issues of another race. To be more clear, I was essentially in denial that real issues existed and that it wasn't just as easy as "blacks commit more crimes". I suppose I'll always fight against that instinct, but now I'm aware of it. I think deep down we are all a little discriminatory against others not like ourselves. I think half the battle is knowing that about yourself.

6. I'm still not a troll.

7. The reason I decided to bump this thread is that maybe someone else is just coming into where I was 5 years ago. Plus its just kind of cool to see what a difference 5 years makes. I now see that Christianity does not have the monopoly on morality. I can now hold my own against any bible toting southerner ready to argue with me about religion or politics. Overall I feel like a more intelligent person, while still knowing that I'm ignorant about a lot of things. But things like logic and the scientific method have given me the tools necessary to solve many of life's little problems and queries.

 

[brianmanahan]

holy necro