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I Miss Republicans

db

Lifer
Dec 6, 1999
10,256
271
126
"I Miss Republicans.

"No, seriously. Remember Republicans? Sober men in suits, pipes, who'd nod thoughtfully over their latest tract on market-driven fiscal conservatism while grinding out the numbers on rocket science. Remember those serious-looking 1950's-1960's science guys in the movies -- Republican to a one.

"They were the grown-ups. They were the realists. Sure they were a bummer, maaaaan, but on the way to La Revolution you need somebody to remember where you parked the car. I was never one (nor a Democrat, really, more an agnostic libertarian big on the social contract, but we don't have a party ...), but I genuinely liked them.

"How did they become the party of fairy dust and make believe? How did they become the anti-science guys? The anti-fact guys? The anti-logic guys?

"I'm not talking McCain, Hagel, Snowe, or Lugar, here, the cool hard-ass Republicans who still operate in the real world. I'm talking specifically about the guys running the party right now."

...the rest
(posted in 2004 and still a good read!)
 

judasmachine

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2002
8,515
3
81
Originally posted by: db
"I Miss Republicans.

"No, seriously. Remember Republicans? Sober men in suits, pipes, who'd nod thoughtfully over their latest tract on market-driven fiscal conservatism while grinding out the numbers on rocket science. Remember those serious-looking 1950's-1960's science guys in the movies -- Republican to a one.

"They were the grown-ups. They were the realists. Sure they were a bummer, maaaaan, but on the way to La Revolution you need somebody to remember where you parked the car. I was never one (nor a Democrat, really, more an agnostic libertarian big on the social contract, but we don't have a party ...), but I genuinely liked them.

"How did they become the party of fairy dust and make believe? How did they become the anti-science guys? The anti-fact guys? The anti-logic guys?

"I'm not talking McCain, Hagel, Snowe, or Lugar, here, the cool hard-ass Republicans who still operate in the real world. I'm talking specifically about the guys running the party right now."

...the rest
(posted in 2004 and still a good read!)
I've lamented the old school conservatives myself.

 

yllus

Elite Member & Lifer
Aug 20, 2000
20,583
430
126
I think those people gave up on the increasingly pointless mess that is politics and went strictly into business.
 

Jamie571

Senior member
Nov 7, 2002
267
0
0
Don't forget they were church goers with strong moral beliefs.

Argue with me all you want I knew many engineers (my Grandfather one of them) that worked at Oak Ridge National Labs that fit your description to a letter along the statement I just wrote.

They would get together for dinners when I was a kid; those guys were the people I wanted to be when I grew up. They got me interested in engineering and investing.

I still keep in contact with the few that are alive today. They honestly never bring up politics anymore.
 

db

Lifer
Dec 6, 1999
10,256
271
126
I grew up around people just like that. I respected them, even when I didn't agree with their politics.
But good God in Heaven, the aware ones must be shaking their heads right now, wondering what happened.


re John Dean's book _Conservatives Without Conscience_:

" With 2 1/2 years still left for this administration, the true radicalism of the administration and its followers has become unavoidably, depressingly clear, and it is equally clear that this movement has not reached anywhere near the peak of its extremism. Dean?s central thesis explains why that is so.

"Dean contends, and amply documents, that the "conservative" movement has become, at its core, an authoritarian movement composed of those with a psychological and emotional need to follow a strong authority figure which provides them a sense of moral clarity and a feeling of individual power, the absence of which creates fear and insecurity in the individuals who crave it. By definition, its followers? devotion to authority and the movement?s own power is supreme, thereby overriding the consciences of its individual members and removing any intellectual and moral limits on what will be justified in defense of their movement." Link

John Dean on Countdown
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,520
0
0
Originally posted by: Jamie571
Don't forget they were church goers with strong moral beliefs.

Argue with me all you want I knew many engineers (my Grandfather one of them) that worked at Oak Ridge National Labs that fit your description to a letter along the statement I just wrote.

They would get together for dinners when I was a kid; those guys were the people I wanted to be when I grew up. They got me interested in engineering and investing.

I still keep in contact with the few that are alive today. They honestly never bring up politics anymore.
It's certainly not just Republicans who have changed...being a church goer with strong moral beliefs just isn't what it used to be any more either. I'm way too young to remember it, but from what I gather, deeply religious Americans used to stand for more liberal values on a whole raft of issues...from civil rights to helping the poor.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
66,633
3,433
126
Originally posted by: db
I grew up around people just like that. I respected them, even when I didn't agree with their politics.
But good God in Heaven, the aware ones must be shaking their heads right now, wondering what happened.


re John Dean's book _Conservatives Without Conscience_:

" With 2 1/2 years still left for this administration, the true radicalism of the administration and its followers has become unavoidably, depressingly clear, and it is equally clear that this movement has not reached anywhere near the peak of its extremism. Dean?s central thesis explains why that is so.

"Dean contends, and amply documents, that the "conservative" movement has become, at its core, an authoritarian movement composed of those with a psychological and emotional need to follow a strong authority figure which provides them a sense of moral clarity and a feeling of individual power, the absence of which creates fear and insecurity in the individuals who crave it. By definition, its followers? devotion to authority and the movement?s own power is supreme, thereby overriding the consciences of its individual members and removing any intellectual and moral limits on what will be justified in defense of their movement."

-
Yup, early days among the lemmings.
 

daveymark

Lifer
Sep 15, 2003
10,576
1
0
If McCain, Hagel, Snowe, and Lugar are hard ass republicans, then Leibermann and Zell Miller are hard ass democrats.
 

LumbergTech

Diamond Member
Sep 15, 2005
3,624
1
0
Originally posted by: Frackal
This country needs to expunge the (IMO) cancer known as neo-conservatism

we can only do it by being reasonable individuals ourselves...we cant let them drag us into their lunacy...we need to reach out to people in a respectful manner no matter how much we hate what they do because it will ultimately stop the bs
 

GroundedSailor

Platinum Member
Feb 18, 2001
2,502
0
76
Originally posted by: Rainsford
It's certainly not just Republicans who have changed...being a church goer with strong moral beliefs just isn't what it used to be any more either. I'm way too young to remember it, but from what I gather, deeply religious Americans used to stand for more liberal values on a whole raft of issues...from civil rights to helping the poor.
Yup. What happened to the true good values that any religion stood for? What happened that caused good folk to turn lemmings? Part of the problem is the self-perpetuating nature of organized religion.

People need to recognize what is going on and wake up to reality.




 

RightIsWrong

Diamond Member
Apr 29, 2005
5,650
0
0
/Stepping up on soapbox

This is an exercise in futility. There are no more Republicans like past Republicans and there are no more Democrats like past Democrats. Unlike everyone else's "Good ol' day" sentiments in this thread, I think that it is a very good thing that times have changed and evolved. So many things have improved in our lives that we need to take a step back and try to take in the whole picture.

What we are missing is that, in today's world of instant access to information, these same people would be shown to be almost as "immoral" or maybe even more in some instances. But that is the beauty of today's world....we have the information (or access to it somewhere) to make the best choices for our country and our future. We have become lazy as a general population with regards to putting in the time needed to be informed and have ended up, as Moonie would say, a reflection of what we have become. Who didn't know that Bush was a lousy businessman who ran multiple companies into the ground prior to 2000? No one. Who didn't know that Gore had a 7000 sq. ft. house while preaching the benefits of conserving energy and resources prior to 2000? No one. That is, if we would have taken the time to research one of the most important social responsibilities that we have.

Those pining for the good ol' days can have their Utopian fantasies about how life was. Me, I'm living in the moment today and not really liking what I see when I do. I'm sure when the country has completely hit the skids I will look back and reminesce about how good the 90's were (when I was finally hitting the age to be aware of my true surroundings). It's human nature though to forget the bad and only focus on the good when doing so. Not everything was rosy in the 50s and 60s and things sure as hell weren't rosy during the 90s. Were there things that were or might have been perceived as better...you betchya. But don't get caught up in all of the feel good stuff while completely annexing reality from the equation.

We can make some changes in November if you want to get back to those good ol' days. You have to put in the time and work to make you own informed choices and to encourage the same from others that you know. Don't vote for a party, vote for a person.....the person that will serve us as a country instead of them as a party.

/Stepping down from soapbox
 

Scarpozzi

Lifer
Jun 13, 2000
24,875
881
126
I wouldn't have a problem with Republicans if they stopped harping on the abortion issue. I really believe anyone who votes based on the morality of this instead of economic beliefs need to lose their right to vote. As for big business, I dislike how Republicans allow lobbyists to come in and buy their vote and support companies that basically monopolize or oligapolize markets leaving the common man out in the cold. Now...I'm not saying we should say "screw the big business"....I'm just saying I prefer to give smaller companies a fair shake and keep the big guys from running over everyone else, as is their nature. (which is a good thing too)

I would like to see a government come in that allows airlines to fail and stops wasting money on foreign aide that doesn't help anything. There is simply too much waste in the government of today.
 

Mursilis

Diamond Member
Mar 11, 2001
7,760
11
81
Originally posted by: Scarpozzi
I wouldn't have a problem with Republicans if they stopped harping on the abortion issue. I really believe anyone who votes based on the morality of this instead of economic beliefs need to lose their right to vote.
Who are you to tell othere people how to order their priorities?!? Lots of people are 'single issue' votes, whether that issue is abortion, the Iraqi war, gay marriage (both con AND pro), etc. I may or may not agree with that approach, but I'm not arrogant enough to think they shouldn't be allowed to vote because of it
 

amish

Diamond Member
Aug 20, 2004
4,298
6
81
Originally posted by: Frackal
This country needs to expunge the (IMO) cancer known as neo-conservatism
what this country needs is a multiple party system. the two party system that we currently have is crap. 80% of the population don't consider themselves fully republican or democrat. south park said it best, we are choosing between a giant duche and a turd sandwich. and i don't think the status quo will ever change until the system changes.
 

BladeVenom

Lifer
Jun 2, 2005
13,541
16
0
They are all just a bunch of self serving politicians. The R or D is just there so people can try to pretend they have a real choice.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
29,678
3,232
126
Originally posted by: GroundedSailor
Originally posted by: Rainsford
It's certainly not just Republicans who have changed...being a church goer with strong moral beliefs just isn't what it used to be any more either. I'm way too young to remember it, but from what I gather, deeply religious Americans used to stand for more liberal values on a whole raft of issues...from civil rights to helping the poor.
Yup. What happened to the true good values that any religion stood for? What happened that caused good folk to turn lemmings? Part of the problem is the self-perpetuating nature of organized religion.

People need to recognize what is going on and wake up to reality.
Yup. What happened to the true good values that any democracy stood for? What happened that caused good folk to turn lemmings? Part of the problem is the self-perpetuating nature of centralized government.

Perhaps you can see how true your statement stands for government, and not only religion? The world as a whole has changed a lot and not necessarily for the better. We need to be more open minded and think for ourselves, than following blindly into what any means of organized control would force upon us. Be it religion or government.
 

5150Joker

Diamond Member
Feb 6, 2002
5,563
0
71
www.techinferno.com
Today it's Democrats that are fiscally conservative and socially conscious while the Republicans are for big government, imperialism, massive spending, reduction of freedoms and war. So the old Republicans are still around, they're just in the Democrat party now.
 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
29,678
3,232
126
Originally posted by: 5150Joker
Today it's Democrats that are fiscally conservative and socially conscious while the Republicans are for big government, imperialism, massive spending, reduction of freedoms and war. So the old Republicans are still around, they're just in the Democrat party now.
You?re as blind as ever if you think the Democratic party would do anything fiscally conservative. They and the Republican party both make up government. They will do nothing to shrink themselves, and will do everything to grow themselves.

Of course, when you refer to fiscally conservative I can only imagine you?d tax everyone to death to balance an ever expanding budget.
 

Stunt

Diamond Member
Jul 17, 2002
9,717
1
0
Originally posted by: 5150Joker
Today it's Democrats that are fiscally conservative and socially conscious while the Republicans are for big government, imperialism, massive spending, reduction of freedoms and war. So the old Republicans are still around, they're just in the Democrat party now.
I am a Conservative party member in Canada and I 100% agree the true conservatives are indeed in the Democratic party. If I were an American I would be completely disgusted by the fiscal managment of my nation and would never call a republican a conservative at all. They aren't conservative in any way; spending, government control, military, rights and freedoms.

The problem is, Democrats have aligned themselves (in my opinion for funding) with the wrong people. Some of these liberal extremist groups are much worse than the anti-abortion movement. Sure you'll get less funding, but who gives a rat's ass, when push comes to shove the lefties will vote with you anyway. Become the party of ideas, reason and logic. Unfortunately both parties are absolutely hopeless right now.
 

TheSlamma

Diamond Member
Sep 6, 2005
7,628
4
81
My fav are the new upper-middle class white people who live in the suburbs who go to churches with 1200 other people (per session) and hold their hands up in the air like they want to catch something.. true freakshows of our day.
 

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