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I got the Holy Ghost today!!!!!
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I've heard it a dozen times man. My dad is a religious fanatic. He's taught me exactly how not to live my life.
Just let me ask you this; Of all the thousands of religions that have been around in the last few hundred thousand years, and the dozens around today... How do you know you've picked the right one?
Afterall, from the point of view of a Muslim, you just encountered some form of Satan.
🙂
PowerEngineer
Diamond Member
As reluctant as I am to rain on your parade...
I'm not really surprised that you might convince yourself that you've experienced something after "seeking" it for six months, knowing that your girl friend is tied up in it, and the whole congregation is expecting it. The group exerts a lot of psychological pressure on you to conform (join) the group by sharing this experience. I think you can find many other examples of similar group coerced behaviors.
And just because you have experienced something, doesn't make your interpretation of that experience true or correct. Whatever it was you were experiencing, I don't think you were actually talking to "God". Just like I don't believe people who claim they have been kidnapped by aliens actually were. I don't doubt that you are telling us what you believe happened, but that belief doesn't make it real. Ask the LSD users who were absolutely convinced they could fly.
That's what really scares me about this -- in a democracy we depend on the majority to decern the best course of our country, and a sizable number of us hold to what seem to me to be irrational beliefs that must distort our perception of reality. And because of the nature of faith, I will never be able to convince you that rationality matters!
I just hope "God" never tells all of you that it's time for the US to trigger Armageddom! 😉
P.S. -- If I'm all wrong about this, then God had better knock me out of my chair with that beam of light he used on Paul! :laugh:
I'm not really surprised that you might convince yourself that you've experienced something after "seeking" it for six months, knowing that your girl friend is tied up in it, and the whole congregation is expecting it. The group exerts a lot of psychological pressure on you to conform (join) the group by sharing this experience. I think you can find many other examples of similar group coerced behaviors.
And just because you have experienced something, doesn't make your interpretation of that experience true or correct. Whatever it was you were experiencing, I don't think you were actually talking to "God". Just like I don't believe people who claim they have been kidnapped by aliens actually were. I don't doubt that you are telling us what you believe happened, but that belief doesn't make it real. Ask the LSD users who were absolutely convinced they could fly.
That's what really scares me about this -- in a democracy we depend on the majority to decern the best course of our country, and a sizable number of us hold to what seem to me to be irrational beliefs that must distort our perception of reality. And because of the nature of faith, I will never be able to convince you that rationality matters!
I just hope "God" never tells all of you that it's time for the US to trigger Armageddom! 😉
P.S. -- If I'm all wrong about this, then God had better knock me out of my chair with that beam of light he used on Paul! :laugh:
thawolfman
Lifer
Sweet! I got laid today!!!!!!!
Wait what? :Q
Wait what? :Q
NikPreviousAcct
No Lifer
Just because you cannot believe that they happened doesn't mean that they did not happen.
ThePresence
Elite Member
I am not a Christian, so I am certainly skeptical of what you experienced, but I say do whatever you gotta do to make yourself a happier person.
sorry for being rude earlier, its just even as a Christian i'm skeptical of this. the apostles were given the ability to speak in tongues, but it was for a purpose. those tongues weren't gibberish, they were the different languages of the day, the languages of the people in the crowd that could hear them in their own tongue. this sounds like a useless gift, people just speaking gibberish for the heck of it. why arent they out as missionaries spreading the word in others' native tongues? that would seem to me to be the purpose....right?
NikPreviousAcct
No Lifer
So you should be limited to speaking or praying in your native language?
ThePresence
Elite Member
Well, that's just the thing. Belief is not based on evidence, or it wouldn't be belief. If you see the evidence black and white in front of your eyes, then it's knowledge not belief. If the evidence existed than God would not test us with requiring our belief in him. It would be obvious, so we would all have the KNOWLEDGE. Hope that makes a bit of sense, I'm really tired.
Alright, let's check out some verses on speaking in tongues:
Ok, let's look at the original Pentecost:
The first question I ask is, what was the reason that these apostles all of a sudden could speak many languages, by miraculous means? It was so that they could spread the word of God to other nations. If I could suddenly speak Swahili with out having studied it, I would be speaking in tongues as the apostles did. There is no mention in the bible that I could find of any apostles babbling off in some unintelagiable language that was not an actual earthly language. Many Religions claim to transfer ppl to some higher level of communications with a deity, nature or whatever. The idea of suddenly being "overcome" by the spirit and speaking in some quacked language doesn't sound like something a Christ that was a true God would cause, if every other religion can do the same thing. Would it feel any less real to those experiencing i? No, I believe it is just something that humans are capable of doing to themselves if they are short on oxygen. Think about it, hyperventalate long enough from either chanting, singing praise and worship music, or breathing in a brown paper bag and you will say all sorts of things that will feel inspired.
Summary: The apostles and the early believers could speak in tongues (other languages) so they could spread the gospel to ppl groups that did not speak their language.
1 Corinthians 14:
I like this last passage, especially the Rules for orderly worship found in verses 27-28. I would ask you how many people were speaking in "tongues" at the service you were at? 3, 4, 5, 20? Was there someone interpretting for each of them? If not, the action had no place in the church, assuming that this passage speaks of "tongues" as something other than another earthly language, for the sake of evangelism, but rather speaks of being able to babel in a deistic language.
Finally, what is your focus as a Christian? True, the bible says that believers are to search out the "Greater gifts", but to what point? To worship God, or to edify yourself? How about to reach "the lost" (even though I don't like that term). The problem I have with the entire apostolic movement, and to a vast extent modern Christianity is that it is very self-serving. It has ceased being about "What can I do for God" and changed into "What can God do for me?"
I'm reminded of one further passage:
Reading that Passage, I am reminded that God's first priority is for us to obey him. All that we do in worship, in outreach, in prayer is quite secondary to living a life of obediance to him. God doesn't require that we have to be 100% perfect to be a christian, however he does require that we try. Speaking in tongues is completely fruitless if we don't live a life of obediance between Sundays.
Anyway, that's my thoughts on this topic, I hope it made some sense.
Ok, let's look at the original Pentecost:
The first question I ask is, what was the reason that these apostles all of a sudden could speak many languages, by miraculous means? It was so that they could spread the word of God to other nations. If I could suddenly speak Swahili with out having studied it, I would be speaking in tongues as the apostles did. There is no mention in the bible that I could find of any apostles babbling off in some unintelagiable language that was not an actual earthly language. Many Religions claim to transfer ppl to some higher level of communications with a deity, nature or whatever. The idea of suddenly being "overcome" by the spirit and speaking in some quacked language doesn't sound like something a Christ that was a true God would cause, if every other religion can do the same thing. Would it feel any less real to those experiencing i? No, I believe it is just something that humans are capable of doing to themselves if they are short on oxygen. Think about it, hyperventalate long enough from either chanting, singing praise and worship music, or breathing in a brown paper bag and you will say all sorts of things that will feel inspired.
Summary: The apostles and the early believers could speak in tongues (other languages) so they could spread the gospel to ppl groups that did not speak their language.
1 Corinthians 14:
I like this last passage, especially the Rules for orderly worship found in verses 27-28. I would ask you how many people were speaking in "tongues" at the service you were at? 3, 4, 5, 20? Was there someone interpretting for each of them? If not, the action had no place in the church, assuming that this passage speaks of "tongues" as something other than another earthly language, for the sake of evangelism, but rather speaks of being able to babel in a deistic language.
Finally, what is your focus as a Christian? True, the bible says that believers are to search out the "Greater gifts", but to what point? To worship God, or to edify yourself? How about to reach "the lost" (even though I don't like that term). The problem I have with the entire apostolic movement, and to a vast extent modern Christianity is that it is very self-serving. It has ceased being about "What can I do for God" and changed into "What can God do for me?"
I'm reminded of one further passage:
Reading that Passage, I am reminded that God's first priority is for us to obey him. All that we do in worship, in outreach, in prayer is quite secondary to living a life of obediance to him. God doesn't require that we have to be 100% perfect to be a christian, however he does require that we try. Speaking in tongues is completely fruitless if we don't live a life of obediance between Sundays.
Anyway, that's my thoughts on this topic, I hope it made some sense.
MournSanity
Diamond Member
my problem is my prior experience with this stuff. i believe in Christianity because i see the lives that have been changed and i see the peace and love in their hearts that is the result of that. i have known people from pentecostal and apostolic denominations who claimed to speak in tongues and i knew they were not changed men, so i have my doubts =\
Tinkerhell
Golden Member
Explain something to me: Why do you call Jesus the Lord?
Falloutboy
Diamond Member
you sure that "spirit" wasn't just gas from the mexican dinner you had?
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