I dont like Black History Month

[AnyMal]

Originally posted by: tokamak
This boils down pretty easily for me. You see, basically, we (white people) fvcked up black people's sh!t for 400+ years, BIG TIME. Yep, that was us. Even after the Emancipation Proclamation, we CONTINUED to fvck up their sh!t for about 100 more years. Ergo, they were (are?) a race of people (at least in the United States) without the clearly defined identity that they deserve. In other words, once civil rights became a reality, African-Americans had (have?) a lot of catching up to do. To that end, concepts such as Black History Month have been invented to garner a sense of pride and identity within the community. I suggest, therefore, that you let the issue drop. The Black Community feels that there is a need for Black History Month. It quite simply affects you guys precisely nil. Whites don't always have to be in the spotlight, you know.

Your argument is both retarded and flawed. First of all, what is this "we, the white people" crap? I wasn't around when that happened and sure as heel am not going to feel guilty or apologize for it. Secondly, if any community feels the need to celebrate their own history, fine, let them. But do it withing your community and stop shoving it down my throat.

 

[myusername]

Wait a minute .. Hank Aaron was BLACK?!!?

 

[mwtgg]

Originally posted by: Darkstar757

Originally posted by: Nik

Originally posted by: Modeps
Why do we need one specific month devoted to Black History? Shouldnt it be taught no more or less than any other world history?

fixed

I hate Black History month too.

WOW

JUST WOW

Gee, what seems to be the problem?

 

[BeauJangles]

I don't mind black history month, but it seems unproductive. The day we can just say "x was a great american" and not have to attach 'black,' 'white,' 'hispanic,' etc to describe them is the day we have achieved true racial equality. The more we emphasize the difference between us the more we will see that difference.

 

[SuperTool]

My problem with it is not that it's a month, or that it's history...

 

[AStar617]

Originally posted by: Nik
While I share the opinion that accomplishments/struggles/contributions of people should be taught and remembered, I don't think race or sex should have any part of the teaching of said events. I don't see why someone NEEDS to say "this black guy did this" and "this white guy did this". What does it matter what their race is? Just drop that entire concept from the statement. "This guy did this" and "this guy did that" will suffice.

The problem is that very many of the historical figures taught during Black History Month only get considered for inclusion in a lesson plan because there is a Black History Month in the first place. If left without that "quota", unfortunately very many of these figures never get any recognition whatsoever, though their contributions to society are just as important as some of those who are regularly taught.

It's a utopian hope that one day there will be no need for the special designation, but until such time that historical figures ARE given their equal due, it's the only way for many people (particularly those from less diverse regions) to get any knowledge of the culture's roots. Sadly, the imposed "quota" has the additional effect of making Black history even less palatable for some of the naysayers during the other 11 months of the year and causing intentional "stockpiling" for February, so in a strange way I do see it as not so much a step backward, but a guaranteed lack of a step forward.

Yep, it's a messed up situation for all.

 

[imthebadguy]

i agree, we need an indian history month.......by the end of the decade it is predicted that Indians will be the most prominant minority following jews

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: AStar617

Originally posted by: Nik
While I share the opinion that accomplishments/struggles/contributions of people should be taught and remembered, I don't think race or sex should have any part of the teaching of said events. I don't see why someone NEEDS to say "this black guy did this" and "this white guy did this". What does it matter what their race is? Just drop that entire concept from the statement. "This guy did this" and "this guy did that" will suffice.

The problem is that very many of the historical figures taught during Black History Month only get considered for inclusion in a lesson plan because there is a Black History Month in the first place. If left without that "quota", unfortunately very many of these figures never get any recognition whatsoever, though their contributions to society are just as important as some of those who are regularly taught.

It's a utopian hope that one day there will be no need for the special designation, but until such time that historical figures ARE given their equal due, it's the only way for many people (particularly those from less diverse regions) to get any knowledge of the culture's roots. Sadly, the imposed "quota" has the additional effect of making Black history even less palatable for some of the naysayers during the other 11 months of the year and causing intentional "stockpiling" for February, so in a strange way I do see it as not so much a step backward, but a guaranteed lack of a step forward.

Yep, it's a messed up situation for all.

Wow, I never thought of it that way before. :Q

....:thumbsup:

 

[BigPete]

I agree, isnt it reverse discrimination? I mean whats the point? I'm not racist or anything, but Feb is just like any other month, I treat all black people the same as I would any other time. I give everyone the benefit of the doubt regardless of race, color, nationality, et al.

 

[hysperion]

Originally posted by: tokamak
This boils down pretty easily for me. You see, basically, we (white people) fvcked up black people's sh!t for 400+ years, BIG TIME. Yep, that was us. Even after the Emancipation Proclamation, we CONTINUED to fvck up their sh!t for about 100 more years. Ergo, they were (are?) a race of people (at least in the United States) without the clearly defined identity that they deserve. In other words, once civil rights became a reality, African-Americans had (have?) a lot of catching up to do. To that end, concepts such as Black History Month have been invented to garner a sense of pride and identity within the community. I suggest, therefore, that you let the issue drop. The Black Community feels that there is a need for Black History Month. It quite simply affects you guys precisely nil. Whites don't always have to be in the spotlight, you know.

What's this we sh1t? I wasn't around back then, were you? Add to that fact black people in THIS country owned slaves- (how's that for black history month). Black people in Africa were the predominant slave sellers to the slave ships- (how about that). And Southerners in this country needed cheap labor for their cotton fields so slavery was born. So, eventually a war was fought- (mainly by white northerners) to free the slaves. The north won, slaves were freed.

Unfortunately, it took awhile for the black's conditions to improve in the south due to racism. However, if we compare their conditions to where they came from in Africa, I'm sure we could find that they weren't that terrible comparitively.

If you have ever met a African Black person and ask them about African-Americans, they find it rather funny that they call themselves African's as most have never been to Africa and know little or nothing of the people there. I've been to South Africa and I met some really great black people there, so when you come back and see how some of them act over here- it turns your head. Too many Ray Lewis's and not enough Curtis Martins IMHO.
So to the above poster, you are absolutely right that white's don't need to be in the spotlight, noone does. Everyone's history should be talked about as it relates to American history as that's what we ALL are in this country. Not African-Americans- which is a joke of a name. Just Americans. Personally, I would have liked to know more of African culture but not lumped together in one month that no other minority in this country has. If you don't think Black History month is racist in itself, how about the fact Martin Luther King is the only person who still has a federal holiday dedicated to him. Not Abraham Lincoln who freed the slaves or the father of our country George Washington. They all get lumped into President's day.

Cliff notes:
-None of us (whites/asians/blacks/etc) alive today owned a slave or contributed to slavery.
-In most cases blacks sold blacks into slavery.
-Whites in the South used slaves as cheap labor, which is unfortunate.
-Whites in the North freed the Blacks in the South. It wasn't as if the Blacks freed themselves.
-Today a Black American has an ungodly higher standard of living then a Black African and the rate of HIV/Aids is much lower as well.
-Black History month needs to go and be replaced by additional African culture info throughout the year.

 

[hysperion]

Originally posted by: AStar617

Originally posted by: Nik
While I share the opinion that accomplishments/struggles/contributions of people should be taught and remembered, I don't think race or sex should have any part of the teaching of said events. I don't see why someone NEEDS to say "this black guy did this" and "this white guy did this". What does it matter what their race is? Just drop that entire concept from the statement. "This guy did this" and "this guy did that" will suffice.

The problem is that very many of the historical figures taught during Black History Month only get considered for inclusion in a lesson plan because there is a Black History Month in the first place. If left without that "quota", unfortunately very many of these figures never get any recognition whatsoever, though their contributions to society are just as important as some of those who are regularly taught.

It's a utopian hope that one day there will be no need for the special designation, but until such time that historical figures ARE given their equal due, it's the only way for many people (particularly those from less diverse regions) to get any knowledge of the culture's roots. Sadly, the imposed "quota" has the additional effect of making Black history even less palatable for some of the naysayers during the other 11 months of the year and causing intentional "stockpiling" for February, so in a strange way I do see it as not so much a step backward, but a guaranteed lack of a step forward.

Yep, it's a messed up situation for all.

You talk alot about "figures not getting recognition", and their accomplishments being just as important as other "figures". Care to give examples? Please don't use Malcolm X, MLK, GWC, Rosa Parks, etc as they would get recognition for other reasons anyways. Rosa Parks is overrated IMO. Big deal she wouldn't move on a bus- she's like the Black version of PFC Jessica Lynch....

And if you're truly for equality, why not show it by deeds and action rather then words. Personally if you are pro-Black History month- (which I do notice you have said is unfortunate in being needed so you're not completely for it). Then you should have no problem with an Asian/Mexican/Puerto Rican/Jewish/(insert others here) month as well?

Now I don't mean to be picking on what you said as alot of it I can agree with. In fact, if most Black Americans had your viewpoint- I don't think we would even have a Black History month as it wouldn't be needed- due to the fact I'm guessing your a very intelligent fairly well off guy. Sometimes it seems as if Black History month is just something we have because Jessie Jackson needs to make some money for his illegit kids and needs to gather donations for a cause because of that.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: hysperion

Originally posted by: AStar617

Originally posted by: Nik
While I share the opinion that accomplishments/struggles/contributions of people should be taught and remembered, I don't think race or sex should have any part of the teaching of said events. I don't see why someone NEEDS to say "this black guy did this" and "this white guy did this". What does it matter what their race is? Just drop that entire concept from the statement. "This guy did this" and "this guy did that" will suffice.

The problem is that very many of the historical figures taught during Black History Month only get considered for inclusion in a lesson plan because there is a Black History Month in the first place. If left without that "quota", unfortunately very many of these figures never get any recognition whatsoever, though their contributions to society are just as important as some of those who are regularly taught.

It's a utopian hope that one day there will be no need for the special designation, but until such time that historical figures ARE given their equal due, it's the only way for many people (particularly those from less diverse regions) to get any knowledge of the culture's roots. Sadly, the imposed "quota" has the additional effect of making Black history even less palatable for some of the naysayers during the other 11 months of the year and causing intentional "stockpiling" for February, so in a strange way I do see it as not so much a step backward, but a guaranteed lack of a step forward.

Yep, it's a messed up situation for all.

You talk alot about "figures not getting recognition", and their accomplishments being just as important as other "figures". Care to give examples? Please don't use Malcolm X, MLK, GWC, Rosa Parks, etc as they would get recognition for other reasons anyways. Rosa Parks is overrated IMO. Big deal she wouldn't move on a bus- she's like the Black version of PFC Jessica Lynch....

And if you're truly for equality, why not show it by deeds and action rather then words. Personally if you are pro-Black History month- (which I do notice you have said is unfortunate in being needed so you're not completely for it). Then you should have no problem with an Asian/Mexican/Puerto Rican/Jewish/(insert others here) month as well?

Now I don't mean to be picking on what you said as alot of it I can agree with. In fact, if most Black Americans had your viewpoint- I don't think we would even have a Black History month as it wouldn't be needed- due to the fact I'm guessing your a very intelligent fairly well off guy. Sometimes it seems as if Black History month is just something we have because Jessie Jackson needs to make some money for his illegit kids and needs to gather donations for a cause because of that.

IIRC, i do believe they have like "pacific asian heritage month" or something.. i remember seeing some little poster in my school about it

 

[Netopia]

Ok... some quick thoughts.

Someone mentioned reparations. Why is it that no one ever demands that Africans pay the Jews for the 400 years of captivity that the Egyptians (North Africa) kept the Jews as slaves? Another problem with reparation is that no laws were broken... the unfortunate truth is that everything was within legal bounds... also, if we did have reparation, how is it to be paid? Would a person have to prove how much of themselves came directly from others who were slaves and then paid on a percentage basis? How about who has to pay? My people (Irish... beat on by the English) didn't get here until after the Civil War, so why should ANY of my money go to pay for something neither my forebears nor myself did?

Black History Month.... I'm a little perplexed on this one. Didn't the Supreme Court say that "Separate but equal" wasn't allowed? Why then do we have a separate month for black history? I would seem to unconstitutional! And even if it was ok, why is it that we don't FIRST have Hispanic History Month, since blacks are only the second largest minority and Hispanics are the largest? And what of Asians? What is the magic number that will be crossed so that they can also have a separate month?

Hey... I've got a wild idea! We Home School, but maybe the Public School systems could learn from us. We study history. If we are studying a period, it REALL DOESN'T MATTER what the color of the person's skin was, it only matters that they had a lasting effect on history... something noteworthy enough for them to still be studied! DUH... if this country wasn't so stupidly P.C., maybe someone would get the picture! MalcomX, MLK, GW Carver... BAH... those are noobs! How come they don't teach about Hannibal the African Warrior during Black History Month!

Joe

 

[AStar617]

Originally posted by: hysperion

Originally posted by: AStar617

Originally posted by: Nik
While I share the opinion that accomplishments/struggles/contributions of people should be taught and remembered, I don't think race or sex should have any part of the teaching of said events. I don't see why someone NEEDS to say "this black guy did this" and "this white guy did this". What does it matter what their race is? Just drop that entire concept from the statement. "This guy did this" and "this guy did that" will suffice.

The problem is that very many of the historical figures taught during Black History Month only get considered for inclusion in a lesson plan because there is a Black History Month in the first place. If left without that "quota", unfortunately very many of these figures never get any recognition whatsoever, though their contributions to society are just as important as some of those who are regularly taught.

It's a utopian hope that one day there will be no need for the special designation, but until such time that historical figures ARE given their equal due, it's the only way for many people (particularly those from less diverse regions) to get any knowledge of the culture's roots. Sadly, the imposed "quota" has the additional effect of making Black history even less palatable for some of the naysayers during the other 11 months of the year and causing intentional "stockpiling" for February, so in a strange way I do see it as not so much a step backward, but a guaranteed lack of a step forward.

Yep, it's a messed up situation for all.

You talk alot about "figures not getting recognition", and their accomplishments being just as important as other "figures". Care to give examples? Please don't use Malcolm X, MLK, GWC, Rosa Parks, etc as they would get recognition for other reasons anyways. Rosa Parks is overrated IMO. Big deal she wouldn't move on a bus- she's like the Black version of PFC Jessica Lynch....

And if you're truly for equality, why not show it by deeds and action rather then words. Personally if you are pro-Black History month- (which I do notice you have said is unfortunate in being needed so you're not completely for it). Then you should have no problem with an Asian/Mexican/Puerto Rican/Jewish/(insert others here) month as well?

Now I don't mean to be picking on what you said as alot of it I can agree with. In fact, if most Black Americans had your viewpoint- I don't think we would even have a Black History month as it wouldn't be needed- due to the fact I'm guessing your a very intelligent fairly well off guy. Sometimes it seems as if Black History month is just something we have because Jessie Jackson needs to make some money for his illegit kids and needs to gather donations for a cause because of that.

Ever heard of Richard Spikes, inventor of the modern automatic transmission as well as turn signals?

Or Dr. Daniel H. Williams, the first physician to perform open heart surgery?

Or how about Dr. Charles Drew, the man responsible for determining the method of storing blood plasma? Without his research and subsequent conceptualization (then invention) of the blood bank, blood transfusions would be impossible today.

Your rather ignorant assumption that I would play the expected "trump card" of an anti-slavery/civil rights figure like MLK to answer you actually proves exactly what I'm talking about. Black history is so much more than slaves and freedom marches, but as long as teachers don't take it upon themselves to credit ALL who have made notable contributions to society, they will have required guidelines put upon them that accentuate ONLY that aspect, and they will then never strive to do any more than the minimum to explore the other aspects because according to the Board of Education, they are doing what is asked of them. Black children--rather, ALL children--need to know that as a culture our contribution to American history and lasting heritage does not end with slavery!

I'll quote you from above, with a quick fix:

In fact, if most schoolteachers and education decision-makers had your viewpoint- I don't think we would even have a Black History month as it wouldn't be needed

In the majority of instances, Black people are not the ones who are responsible with creating the universally accepted textbooks and other forms of educational media. The problem is that teachers who learned one set of "important facts" in history can be resistant to changing that set since it doesn't go along with whatever they have been taught to believe all their lives. And thus the vicious cycle continues. It only gets worse in this day and age where some teachers barely know the topics they are tasked with teaching themselves, and are entirely dependent on the all-powerful "Teacher's Edition" textbook--and whatever info is (or is not) inside--to get through their lessons. I keep hearing over and over in this thread "special allowances are not necessary, historic figures should get their due regardless of color". I agree 100%. But you know what? In reality, IT'S SIMPLY NOT HAPPENING. Until then, Black History Month is the next best thing, even as ultimately crippling to the cause as it may be.

I won't bother delving into your comparison of PFC Lynch, a member of a VOLUNTEER army in a wartime situation, to Rosa Parks, a civilian who was born into a centuries-old expectation of subservience and inferiority. And please refrain from further speculation on any actions that I have or have not undertaken on the matter. I think it's very safe to say what happens when you assume...

 

[AStar617]

Originally posted by: Netopia
How come they don't teach about Hannibal the African Warrior during Black History Month!

Joe

They absolutely should.

 

[mugs]

Originally posted by: Netopia
Someone mentioned reparations. Why is it that no one ever demands that Africans pay the Jews for the 400 years of captivity that the Egyptians (North Africa) kept the Jews as slaves?

Umm... slaves were from sub-Saharan Africa, not Egypt. But I guess they're all the same anyway.

My thoughts - either I went to school before Black History Month was a big thing (when did it start anyway?), or my all-white schools just didn't observe it. The first I heard of Black History Month is when I was in college. The extent of its impact on me there was a display outside the library. The the only knowledge I have of black history is George Washington Carver, peanuts, and the Tuskegee Institute. Oh, I read a poem by Langston Hughes once. Do we need a separate month for black history? No. It would be nice if we learned more about it with the rest of history. My "world history" class in high school was entirely about European history. The only mention of Africans, Asians and South Americans was when they came in contact with Europeans.

Black History Month doesn't inconvence anyone, quit your whining (Nik)

 

[GoingUp]

I look at black history month as kind of a "chicken-egg" phenomina.

Do we celebrate black history month because you hear so little about black history for the rest of the year, or do you hear so little about black history for the rest of the year because they have their own history month? I'm sure theres a little bit of both sides in the issue.

Anyways, I watched a fantastic program on GW Carver on the history channel a couple of weeks ago. Man was a frickin genious.

 

[BRObedoza]

every month is white history month

 

[ShadowBlade]

i agree, if theyre gonna have a month devoted to one races history, they need to have one for every races history...which is impossible.

 

[KarenMarie]

Originally posted by: Netopia
Ok... some quick thoughts.

Someone mentioned reparations. Why is it that no one ever demands that Africans pay the Jews for the 400 years of captivity that the Egyptians (North Africa) kept the Jews as slaves? Another problem with reparation is that no laws were broken... the unfortunate truth is that everything was within legal bounds... also, if we did have reparation, how is it to be paid? Would a person have to prove how much of themselves came directly from others who were slaves and then paid on a percentage basis? How about who has to pay? My people (Irish... beat on by the English) didn't get here until after the Civil War, so why should ANY of my money go to pay for something neither my forebears nor myself did?

Black History Month.... I'm a little perplexed on this one. Didn't the Supreme Court say that "Separate but equal" wasn't allowed? Why then do we have a separate month for black history? I would seem to unconstitutional! And even if it was ok, why is it that we don't FIRST have Hispanic History Month, since blacks are only the second largest minority and Hispanics are the largest? And what of Asians? What is the magic number that will be crossed so that they can also have a separate month?

Hey... I've got a wild idea! We Home School, but maybe the Public School systems could learn from us. We study history. If we are studying a period, it REALL DOESN'T MATTER what the color of the person's skin was, it only matters that they had a lasting effect on history... something noteworthy enough for them to still be studied! DUH... if this country wasn't so stupidly P.C., maybe someone would get the picture! MalcomX, MLK, GW Carver... BAH... those are noobs! How come they don't teach about Hannibal the African Warrior during Black History Month!

Joe

Out of all the posts in this entire thread, this is the one I agree with the most. As far as reperations go... I agree with everything you said. The overwhelming majority of ppl alive today either did not have slaves, were not slaves, were not decendents of slaves or were not even here when slavery was going on. And it is a great question to ask... who will pay? The ppl who had nothing to do with slavery? And who will be paid? All blacks? Only those that can prove that they were decendents of slaves? And once this money is paid... will that be the end of it? Will that do away with Afirmative action and all other race card issues?

If I am correct, the Supreme Court case you mean is Brown Vs. Board of education 1954. Originally, Plessey Vs. Ferguson 1896... The issue 14th amendment and whether separate but equal was still equal. Louisana has a law that stated that the railroad companies has to provide separate but equal accommadations for blacks and whites. This case tried to challenge that law and failed. The Court reversed itself in Brown Vs. Board of education 1954. As far as having all the rest of the races getting their own History Month...it is my opinion that they will. Hispanics already have their own sitcoms and music awards so I dont think that the rest will be far behind. I am not saying that it is or is not a good thing, just offering an opinion that it will happen. I also think that if anyone were to try to challenge any of this, saying that it is unconstitutional under the 14th amendment, they will be labeled a racist. Only some people are allowed to have special agencies. Again, my opinion.

Home schooling was a wonderful thing until the government starting putting their nose in. They are trying to pass a law that gives them the right to dictate what parents teach their kids. This will include, amoungst other things... birth control, Black History Month, and a whole bunch of other things that parents will have no say over. Didnt home schooled kids kick azz on the spelling bees and get higher grades nation wide over publically schooled kids?

Anyway... in my opinion... if ANY one, of any race, creed, religion, or anything else feels the need to have concession to make them equal, it is just sending a message that they do not see themselves as such. Personally, I dont care what color or religion someone is... they are either a good person or not. They can either do the job or not.

There is definate double standard in this country though.

 

[Pacfanweb]

Originally posted by: b0mbrman

Originally posted by: Modeps
Why do we need one specific month devoted to Black History? Shouldnt it be taught to students year round intertwined with European History et al?

Exactly. Black history is just as important as European and American history.

So why does it have its own month dedicated to it?

 

[her209]

http://www.voicesofcivilrights.org/

 

[xalos]

If people would focus LESS on the differences of people and more on the similarities the world would be a better place.

Fight Club said it best even though they said it in a negative manner.

"You are not a beautiful and unique snowflake. You are the same decaying organic matter as everyone else, and we are all part of the same compost pile."

 

[thehstrybean]

We need a Scottish History Month....GO SCOTTISH!!!









J/K...How about an alien history month?

 

[artikk]

Originally posted by: thehstrybean
We need a Scottish History Month....GO SCOTTISH!!!









J/K...How about an alien history month?