Hybrid owners unlikely to repeat

[brainhulk]

How does it feel to drive? We are thinking of replacing my moms 99 I30 with either one of these or a Volt (Yeah I know price difference whatever, disregard that).

0-60 in 11 seconds just seems....pathetic..

stop and go in the city is perfectly fine for me. It keeps up and I have no problems. It's slow, but is adequate to get up to speed in a decent amount of time. You'll still be able to outrun a semi truck if you are worried The only time I had a problem was when I took it on a long trip and had to climb inclined highways.

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

A set of used batteries is not really comparable to a set of new batteries. Just like buying used tires are not like buying new, or brake pads, etc. Every charge-discharge cycle that they have gone through is one less than the new part would give you.

Batteries are an 8 year, 70k mile warranty (as is everything else hybrid related) on the Prius. Plus they are very low maintenance (brake pads last 100k+ miles, everything is electric, just unplug and plug in the new part, no changing of belts, etc.).

 

[brainhulk]

A set of used batteries is not really comparable to a set of new batteries. Just like buying used tires are not like buying new, or brake pads, etc. Every charge-discharge cycle that they have gone through is one less than the new part would give you.

Ok...Consumer reports say batteries last well past 200k miles. If I find one with 170k miles left for < $800, I'm happy

 

[Squisher]

I heard this earlier today. I have a hybrid and have no problem buying another. As the owner of a '08 Prius I really have two complaints. I wish there was more cargo space, which would be fixed by going to a Prius V, and wish the seats were comfier. I'm likely to look at crossover hybrids and would prefer a domestic. Ford is coming out with their C-Max later this year and that might catch my eye.

 

[GTaudiophile]

I wonder what the statistic is for buyers of Diesel-engined cars from the likes of BMW, VW, Audi, etc.

 

[vi edit]

I won't accept your first set of claims, as batteries are a wear item. Any mechanical part can fail in any vehicle. Just because VW is horrible for reliability recently doesn't mean diesel can't be nearly as reliable (though yes, the addition of a turbo which is needed, does raise overall potential cost)

Not sure what you mean by "first set of claims". We don't have diesel options for "economy" cars outside of VW. Mercedes and BMW don't count. If you wanted a high MPG vehicle 5 years ago your only options were a VW diesel or a hybrid. Sure all kinds of manufacturers have teased the idea...Mazda, GM, Ford, ect. But to date none of the have delivered. And to make the emissions requirements the tech in diesels is pretty well...high tech and expensive. These aren't rock solid, established commercial products that can put hundreds of thousand of miles on them with little worry. They are very new products that still have quirks to iron out. And expensive German ones at that.

 

[JulesMaximus]

That's because they realize how boring they are :awe:

Most cars are pretty damned boring compared to my bike. I ran up against one of the most recent V8 powered M3's last week and he was staying with me fairly well... but still in my mirrors up to well over the posted speed limit.

I'd really prefer a boring but fuel efficient car for commuting. My drive to work is almost never a race.

 

[Doppel]

The majority of hybrids out there are Priuses so it seems reasonable a majority of people surveyed who won't buy another one drive a Prius. That said, the Prius, any generation, is a terrible car. The ONLY reason is sells is because of the mileage factor and the smug factor. As a car, they are terrible. All the auto publications agree they are slow, uncomfortable, terrible to drive and full of dollar store plastics.

And yet Prius owners consistently score very high owner satisfaction numbers. You're right they sell because of mileage, that's the whole point.

To the polk study itself I could not find specific details/data backing what they say and I am quite dubious of their findings and whether they really mean what the media is trying to portray: that hybrid owners just don't care about hybrid enough that for their second car they get it. Indeed, anybody buying a vehicle in say 2006 has better options in 2011 and gas prices were nice and high, too.

A small diesel could do better, without needing batteries that add initial cost and eventual maintenance cost.

Please stop with this nonsense, it wasn't true the first time I read it nor the 100th as I read it now. There is no diesel car on the planet that comes close to the mileage of a Toyota Prius unless it's much smaller and much slower. Please just stop spreading this myth, it's absolutely false. Closest diesel competitor to a Prius is VW's lineup and their cars are spanked by the Prius. This is just a fact. Nobody wants a 60 horsepower barely-four seater that might be acceptable in England and can hardly muster a top speed of 75 mph and its diesel rating is on the Euro cycle with Euro gallons. Compare apples to apples gasoline hybrid cars are king for mileage.

 

[vi edit]

Please stop with this nonsense, it wasn't true the first time I read it nor the 100th as I read it now. There is no diesel car on the planet that comes close to the mileage of a Toyota Prius unless it's much smaller and much slower. Please just stop spreading this myth, it's absolutely false. Closest diesel competitor to a Prius is VW's lineup and their cars are spanked by the Prius. This is just a fact. Nobody wants a 60 horsepower barely-four seater that might be acceptable in England and can hardly muster a top speed of 75 mph and its diesel rating is on the Euro cycle with Euro gallons. Compare apples to apples gasoline hybrid cars are king for mileage.

City yes, highway...not so much. Diesels shine on the highway and due to the more conventional drivetrains, suspension setups, and available torque they are much more enjoyable to drive in these situations. That's where my interest lies in them. My family puts more than 25,000 miles a year on it's vehicles. About 10% of that is city driving.

 

[Via]

I did some personal research about the Prius before considering buying one last year, and at that time all 11 Prius owners I could track down still owned their vehicles.

I have to assume most hybrid drivers aren't ready to trade in yet.

 

[homercles337]

You guys need to learn to use Google.

I think everyone here is probably considered a google expert, relative to the entirety of online users. What really needs to happen, is you need to stop making shit up.

 

[Ferzerp]

Not sure what you mean by "first set of claims". We don't have diesel options for "economy" cars outside of VW. Mercedes and BMW don't count. If you wanted a high MPG vehicle 5 years ago your only options were a VW diesel or a hybrid. Sure all kinds of manufacturers have teased the idea...Mazda, GM, Ford, ect. But to date none of the have delivered. And to make the emissions requirements the tech in diesels is pretty well...high tech and expensive. These aren't rock solid, established commercial products that can put hundreds of thousand of miles on them with little worry. They are very new products that still have quirks to iron out. And expensive German ones at that.

Well of course not, not when innovation is being driven via legislation instead of private R&D. Why develop diesel when you are disincentivized to do so? Hybrid drivetrains have never been a good solution, but they got political support, and so development in other areas suffered.

 

[AstroManLuca]

I did some personal research about the Prius before considering buying one last year, and at that time all 11 Prius owners I could track down still owned their vehicles.

I have to assume most hybrid drivers aren't ready to trade in yet.

Good point. That implies that the people who HAVE traded in their hybrids are doing so because they want a different style of car, not because their current car has gotten worn out and needs replacing.

 

[NetWareHead]

There is no diesel car on the planet that comes close to the mileage of a Toyota Prius unless it's much smaller and much slower. Please just stop spreading this myth, it's absolutely false. Closest diesel competitor to a Prius is VW's lineup and their cars are spanked by the Prius. This is just a fact. Nobody wants a 60 horsepower barely-four seater that might be acceptable in England and can hardly muster a top speed of 75 mph and its diesel rating is on the Euro cycle with Euro gallons. Compare apples to apples gasoline hybrid cars are king for mileage.

I have a VW Jetta TDI and I get more than the rated mileage the VW advertises. I regularly get on the highway anywhere from 40-55 mpg average depending n my speed, hilly-ness of the road and how heavy my foot is. It surely doesn't feel like a "60 horsepower" car, actually the engine has some balls under the hood and it roars nicely under acceleration. The car hauls if you step on it and shines on the highway with gobs of low-end torque which make downshifting unnecessary. Even going uphill in 6th gear, I just push the pedal and impressively accelerate uphill where most 4 banger gasoline engines would strain and require a downshift. I did get it with a 6 speed manual tranny so that may have something to do with the performance I enjoy.

To be clear I did not buy the car for performance reason, rather for fuel economy reasons, but the unexpected performance is welcome and its a more enjoyable car to drive than the Prius. Prius last time I checked only comes in auto. To say the Jetta does not even make it to 75 mph is just dumb, again, have you driven one before?

The Jetta is also a normal car with normal looks and normal sized with a spacious trunk and easily holds 4 people. When you buy a Prius, it looks like a Prius and has that Prius futuristic styling. Might be fine for some people but I think its rather ugly and stands out.

 

[unokitty]

My perception is that automotive hybrids violate Occam's Razor.

And that their marketplace success represents a triumph of marketing over rationality. Or as a J.D. Power analyst has stated:

"The Prius stands out as the badge of honor for people who are environmentally focused..."

Its clear that that "badge of honor" is worth something to a certain group of consumers. And that explains why Toyota has succeeded where others have failed. That is, the fact that there is no non-hybrid Prius makes that car an instantly recognizable badge.

My personal preference would be for a more economical choice of a simpler vehicle that has a piston engine only. My expectation is that when you have one piston engine and one electrical engine, you have twice as many places for things to go wrong...

While its not for me, I do admire Toyota's success marketing the Prius.

Uno

 

[BrunoPuntzJones]

I have a VW Jetta TDI and I get more than the rated mileage the VW advertises. I regularly get on the highway anywhere from 40-55 mpg average depending n my speed, hilly-ness of the road and how heavy my foot is. It surely doesn't feel like a "60 horsepower" car, actually the engine has some balls under the hood and it roars nicely under acceleration. The car hauls if you step on it and shines on the highway with gobs of low-end torque which make downshifting unnecessary. Even going uphill in 6th gear, I just push the pedal and impressively accelerate uphill where most 4 banger gasoline engines would strain and require a downshift. I did get it with a 6 speed manual tranny so that may have something to do with the performance I enjoy.

To be clear I did not buy the car for performance reason, rather for fuel economy reasons, but the unexpected performance is welcome and its a more enjoyable car to drive than the Prius. Prius last time I checked only comes in auto. To say the Jetta does not even make it to 75 mph is just dumb, again, have you driven one before?

The Jetta is also a normal car with normal looks and normal sized with a spacious trunk and easily holds 4 people. When you buy a Prius, it looks like a Prius and has that Prius futuristic styling. Might be fine for some people but I think its rather ugly and stands out.

It's not really an automatic, it uses a "power split device" which is run by the three motors.

http://eahart.com/prius/psd/

No way to make it a manual, it's just one set of gears.

 

[jagec]

My personal preference would be for a more economical choice of a simpler vehicle that has a piston engine only. My expectation is that when you have one piston engine and one electrical engine, you have twice as many places for things to go wrong...

And yet, the Prius continues to be more reliable than a large percentage of simpler-engined vehicles.

The principle of "fewer parts=more reliability" is a good first approximation, but proper engineering can render it irrelevant.

Hell, EFI is vastly more complex than carburetion, but it has proven to be a very reliable, low-maintenance solution.

 

[SearchMaster]

I wonder if there are more non-hybrid drivers considering the switch to hybrid than hybrid drivers considering a switch away from it?

Also consider that the Prius is the only hybrid that really does it well, Honda's offerings are okay...mainstream sedans like the Fusion and Camry with hybrid options provide a nice bump but nowhere near the Prius in efficiency or popularity. So in a lot of ways, you're asking primarily Prius drivers if they want another Prius as their next car - very few people buy the same model consecutively.

 

[xSkyDrAx]

Most cars are pretty damned boring compared to my bike. I ran up against one of the most recent V8 powered M3's last week and he was staying with me fairly well... but still in my mirrors up to well over the posted speed limit.

I'd really prefer a boring but fuel efficient car for commuting. My drive to work is almost never a race.

It's all relative and a matter of preference. A jet fighter pilot would say the same about riding a bike but for some people it's not practical.

And while your daily commute may not be a race there is certainly something to be said between driving, say, a 335i to work vs a prius or something small and under powered.

Of course the price you pay between the two may not be worth it to you but to some people it is. Some people don't like having to stomp the pedal to go up a hill or to pass someone or to accelerate onto a freeway without 15 seconds of fear that someone might smash into your butt because you're still climbing from 40mph. Or they just might enjoy how the car handles and feels and responds vs a more economical car.

If it weren't for you bike and if you had a prius and say a yaris I'm sure you wouldn't be having much fun and your daily commutes (and then some) would be a drag :hmm:

 

[JulesMaximus]

It's all relative and a matter of preference. A jet fighter pilot would say the same about riding a bike but for some people it's not practical.

And while your daily commute may not be a race there is certainly something to be said between driving, say, a 335i to work vs a prius or something small and under powered.

Of course the price you pay between the two may not be worth it to you but to some people it is. Some people don't like having to stomp the pedal to go up a hill or to pass someone or to accelerate onto a freeway without 15 seconds of fear that someone might smash into your butt because you're still climbing from 40mph. Or they just might enjoy how the car handles and feels and responds vs a more economical car.

If it weren't for you bike and if you had a prius and say a yaris I'm sure you wouldn't be having much fun and your daily commutes (and then some) would be a drag :hmm:

Yeah, about $2,300 a year in added fuel expense. Oh, and the knowledge that if there was no traffic I could race just about anyone on the road and come out winning.

 

[Ferzerp]

I have to say that despite loathing everything about the prius. At the current prices, I have to admit it is a pretty good choice for a great many people.

 

[Thump553]

I bought a Prius in early 2008 (before the gas price runup) and will definately buy another when we need a replacement-in another five or ten years.

If the current market is like it was in mid-2008 (and I suspect it is, in another thread I saw Prius with the shortest inventory time for Feb 2012-two days) I strongly suspect the dealers are charging way above list and loading the Prius down with dealer installed "options" making it a financially bad deal. I think that is the point of this study current hybrid owners won't overpay for their replacements.

 

[glen]

Woman dies after Prius stuck on train train tracks:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...le.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/04/11/BA241O1QHP.DTL&tsp=1

 

[SpatiallyAware]

Woman dies after Prius stuck on train train tracks:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/artic...le.cgi?f=/c/a/2012/04/11/BA241O1QHP.DTL&tsp=1

The girl turned ONTO the tracks. She tried to drive on the tracks like it was a road.


The fail in this is the stupid, not the prius.

 

[Doppel]

I have a VW Jetta TDI and I get more than the rated mileage the VW advertises. I regularly get on the highway anywhere from 40-55 mpg average depending n my speed, hilly-ness of the road and how heavy my foot is. It surely doesn't feel like a "60 horsepower" car, actually the engine has some balls under the hood and it roars nicely under acceleration. The car hauls if you step on it and shines on the highway with gobs of low-end torque which make downshifting unnecessary. Even going uphill in 6th gear, I just push the pedal and impressively accelerate uphill where most 4 banger gasoline engines would strain and require a downshift. I did get it with a 6 speed manual tranny so that may have something to do with the performance I enjoy.

To be clear I did not buy the car for performance reason, rather for fuel economy reasons, but the unexpected performance is welcome and its a more enjoyable car to drive than the Prius. Prius last time I checked only comes in auto. To say the Jetta does not even make it to 75 mph is just dumb, again, have you driven one before?

The Jetta is also a normal car with normal looks and normal sized with a spacious trunk and easily holds 4 people. When you buy a Prius, it looks like a Prius and has that Prius futuristic styling. Might be fine for some people but I think its rather ugly and stands out.

I realize that due to lack of paragraphs I was quite unclear. I agree the VW diesels drive nicer than a Prius. In my next breath talking about 60 hp cars I was trying to preempt the seemingly inevitable examples people bring up of little 2200 lb pseudo-cars that are common in Europe with no power and very tiny, which the North American VWs are not.