Huge Unreal Tournament 3 patch in the works

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: CP5670I agree, and have said the same thing in previous threads on this. Even if UT3 had gotten everything right in terms of the interface and so on, it was always going to be a niche game online. The basic style of gameplay, with its fast pacing and a lot of emphasis on movement, is unforgiving to noobs and has fallen out of fashion over time. This is the same reason why 6DOF games like the Descent series died out after the 90s.

I'm far from convinced of this. If UT3 had been done perfectly and released at a strategically chosen time and marketed properly, it would be much, much more popular and could have attracted people who were new to the series. I really have a difficult time believing that today's gaming teens and twentysomethings just don't have an interest in fast-paced FPS. I highly doubt that male neurobiology has changed that radically in just a few years.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
Can you name a worthwhile arena-style shooter that came out in the past few years?

No, but for what's it's worth, I can't name any arena-style shooters that came out in the past few years because no one is making them anymore, which only further proves my point: they're not popular or in-demand. The only reasonable exception would be Halo, but I'll come back to that...

UT3 is unpopular because everything that surrounds the game play (which itself is not perfect) was god-awful when it was released back in November of 2007. UT3's lack of popularity is NOT a sign of the times as you contend.

This is where you lose me and where we'll just have to agree to disagree. I don't believe people are going to let a menu system turn them off if the gameplay that they want is there. I think many UT99 die-hards are confused about what they want. UT3 delivers gameplay that is on par with UT99.

On the other hand, UT3 is very much unlike UT2k3 and UT2k4, so Epic lost a lot of the fans they acquired in those years. Of course, that's quite ironic, because they isolated a lot of '99 fans with those releases. It's like Epic is constantly trying to chase the last generation they lost.

I'll agree with one point: Onslaught was far more fun than Warfare; why they dicked with that is absolutely beyond me (actually it's not, but the pessimist in me tells me that Cliff had issues with the fact that UT2k4's most popular mode was actually a third party mod and not Epic's own creation, so they left their footprint on it in UT3 with Warfare). Regardless, UT99 had ZERO vehicles, so we can debate the vehicles and the vehicle gametypes all day long, but logically speaking, they're irrelevant when comparing the game with UT99.

I really have a difficult time believing that today's gaming teens and twentysomethings just don't have an interest in fast-paced FPS.

Not surprisingly, I'm with CP5670 on this, too. UT's fast-paced gameplay - especially vanilla CTF, TDM, and DM - are absolutely unforgiving. UT (UT99, especially) is about map mastery, lightning fast reflexes, precision aim and prediction, pick-up management, and even skilled key binding. The thought and preparation that goes into a successful match is unparalleled. Some games are easy to pick up but difficult to master (COD4 comes to mind), and are quite engrossing because of it. UT is difficult to pick up and an absolute bitch to master, especially if you're competing with diehards with 10 years under their belt. I've tried getting friends and family interesting in UT over the years, and it's impossible because they get skinned and eaten alive.

... which of course brings us back around to Halo: if you think about it, it's an idiot's arena shooter. It's a dumbed down UT. I'll concede that perhaps between my opinion that these shooters are out of style and your opinion that it's not, is the truth. But Halo is one thing that UT is not: noob-friendly. It runs about 25% as fast as UT, so you don't need to be hopped up on Red Bull and crack to stand a chance.

 

[zerocool84]

I enjoy UT3 very much so. The gameplay is still fun as hell and it has great graphics. the shitty UI and sometimes not even being able to log-on still pisses me off but in the end, it's still fun and there are some great user created maps.

 

[coreyb]

I still play UT99, it just feels right compared to any of newer versions. My favourite game of all time.

 

[n7]

Wow.

This is hugely awesome.

The sad part is that this is how it should have been released...why we had to wait this long for them to make this game how it shoulda been shipped...eh.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally posted by: coreyb
I still play UT99, it just feels right compared to any of newer versions. My favourite game of all time.

Come to irc.GameRadius.net #speedpug and learn how to play UT99 CTF 5-v-5 pickup games matches. Like a clan match but without fixed teams or schedules--lots of fun and beats playing on public servers.

 

[Fox5]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: CP5670I agree, and have said the same thing in previous threads on this. Even if UT3 had gotten everything right in terms of the interface and so on, it was always going to be a niche game online. The basic style of gameplay, with its fast pacing and a lot of emphasis on movement, is unforgiving to noobs and has fallen out of fashion over time. This is the same reason why 6DOF games like the Descent series died out after the 90s.

I'm far from convinced of this. If UT3 had been done perfectly and released at a strategically chosen time and marketed properly, it would be much, much more popular and could have attracted people who were new to the series. I really have a difficult time believing that today's gaming teens and twentysomethings just don't have an interest in fast-paced FPS. I highly doubt that male neurobiology has changed that radically in just a few years.

Times progress.

Deathmatch gave way to counterstrike style rounds.
Counterstrike gave way to battlefield style team games.
Battlefield style team games may give way to more specialty games like left 4 dead and gears of war.
Call of Duty 4 is pretty much classic deathmatch though.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

Subscribed

Thanks Epic - you f*ckers

Love this game

 

[Shadow Conception]

I'm guessing there's no PS3 patch?

 

[L337Llama]

It's been a while since I did any UT3. It was fun, but there weren't enough people playing it. And some of the new vehicles felt gimmicky. Though I am now tempted to try it out again. I loved 2k4.

 

[evident]

hopefully it will get more people playing this game again! i actually thought it was pretty fun, but the lack of any servers with people on it is killing it for me

 

[evident]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: jbourne77I think the heart of the problem is that arena-style shooters are no longer in fashion. Arena style shooters came about as the first FPS's. They were simple, required no story line, etc.

Can you name a worthwhile arena-style shooter that came out in the past few years? Is it possible that arena style shooters are no longer in fashion simply because there haven't been any good ones for a long time? UT 2004 wasn't too bad but many UT99 fans wouldn't regard it as good, so I'm not sure that that would count. Other than UT99 and Quake 3, what were the good arena-style shooters?

i would LOVE for another great arena shooter to come out. i remember playing Q2, UT99 and Q3 and there hasn't been any experience like that in a LONG time. screw CS, COD and all these realistic shooters, they are so boring and slow paced to me. bring on the rocket launchers and railguns!!!!

 

[CP5670]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
I'm far from convinced of this. If UT3 had been done perfectly and released at a strategically chosen time and marketed properly, it would be much, much more popular and could have attracted people who were new to the series. I really have a difficult time believing that today's gaming teens and twentysomethings just don't have an interest in fast-paced FPS. I highly doubt that male neurobiology has changed that radically in just a few years.

The PC gaming landscape in general has changed though, for whatever reason. It's really unfortunate, but a lot of genres and subgenres that used to be popular 10 or 15 years ago are hardly ever seen today. I mentioned 6DOF FPSs earlier, and adventure games, space sims and FPS/RTS hybrids (like the Battlezone games) are more examples of this.

screw CS, COD and all these realistic shooters, they are so boring and slow paced to me. bring on the rocket launchers and railguns!!!!

:thumbsup:

 

[soccerballtux]

Text

I hope they fix the FOV problems. The way they have it implemented, when you game widescreen, it doesn't add to the sides of the monitor, it cuts off the top and bottom of a 4:3 image. So basically, 4:3 and 5:4 players are more advantaged than 16:10 (or greater) players.

One user has a 3x 1280x1024 setup and his game looks like this. Poor guy! He has about half the vertical view that a 16:9 player has!

They need to fix the server browser too back to 2k4's style or something. Currently you have to disconnect from the game, wait 5 seconds for the menu to load, find a server, and then start connecting-- in 2k4 you could bring up the menu any time and start downloading in the background while you continued playing on your current server. If you notice the patch notes, they mentioned they're changing the menu so that when you click "Main Menu" while in a game it returns you to the server browser instead of the main menu. So, it doesn't look like that "major UI overhaul" means much where it matters.

Merged with existing topic
-PC Gaming Moderator
KeithTalent

 

[toyota]

I just started up UT3 and took some screenshots and that doesnt appear to be completely the case. at the same fov of 90 the 1920x1080 added a little more to the sides over 1280x960 but yeah it does appear that 1280x960 had a little more height. I didnt spend a lot of time on this but putting the fov just slightly higher than 90 gave the 1920x1080 the same height the 1280x960 had at 90 and of course made 1920x1080 even wider than it already was.

 

[zerocool84]

I really enjoy the game, comtrary to all the hate but I hope the menu overhauls are well implemented. Also it pisses me off that the damn game sometimes decides to log in and sometimes it doesn't.

 

[Dkcode]

Originally posted by: soccerballtux
Text

I hope they fix the FOV problems. The way they have it implemented, when you game widescreen, it doesn't add to the sides of the monitor, it cuts off the top and bottom of a 4:3 image. So basically, 4:3 and 5:4 players are more advantaged than 16:10 (or greater) players.

One user has a 3x 1280x1024 setup and his game looks like this. Poor guy! He has about half the vertical view that a 16:9 player has!

They need to fix the server browser too back to 2k4's style or something. Currently you have to disconnect from the game, wait 5 seconds for the menu to load, find a server, and then start connecting-- in 2k4 you could bring up the menu any time and start downloading in the background while you continued playing on your current server. If you notice the patch notes, they mentioned they're changing the menu so that when you click "Main Menu" while in a game it returns you to the server browser instead of the main menu. So, it doesn't look like that "major UI overhaul" means much where it matters.

I hope they fix the aspect ratio problems. Its totally unacceptable that a modern game cheats the widescreen resolutions like it does.

At least you have the option to change the FOV.

I really hope they do a good job of the interface though.

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

The new patch is out now or this is a double post?

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
The new patch is out now or this is a double post?

The latter.

Text

 

[soccerballtux]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: jbourne77This is one reason why UT3 is very UT99-like, so we're left wondering if UT3 is so panned because of its interface or, perhaps, a less obvious reason.

------

If you take the interface out of the picture, there's really nothing to complain about with regard to UT3. The gameplay is rock solid and the maps are great. Yet it's still unpopular. I contend it's simply a sign of the times.

UT3 is unpopular because everything that surrounds the game play (which itself is not perfect) was god-awful when it was released back in November of 2007. UT3's lack of popularity is NOT a sign of the times as you contend.

The UT99 pro community actually liked the UT3 game play in the UT3 Demo. It wasn't as good as UT99 but there was excitement and people were looking forward to the retail release. When they discovered that the retail release of UT3 = Beta Demo, they completely lost interest. When this game was released, server admins had all sorts of difficulties (wouldn't work on Linux based servers I thin), the server browser didn't work very well, and you couldn't even add Favorites. Last I checked, the user interface was still clunky and slow. The list of what is wrong with everything that surrounds the UT3 game play is long and extensive. The Mapvote menu is also inferior compared to what UT 2004 currently has and you cannot set taunts and communication comments to keybinds. Also, you have to wait to load the Main Menu and you have to leave servers to pull up the server browser to check activity on other servers (after waiting to load the Main Menu).

Basically, going from UT 2004's or even UT99's user interface and server browser to UT3 was like downgrading from a souped up Lexus to a stripped down Kia.

UT3's game play is also far from perfect. The game lacks first-person view for vehicles which is a big problem for flying vehicles, the vehicle that lays the mine pods that cannot be destroyed is retarded in part because of the mine pods, you cannot throw weapons, and the translocator is still limited. I played UT3's Warfare game pretty heavily for the first three months after UT3's release and finally gravitated back to playing UT 2004's Onslaught which I find to be more fun. I agree that the feel of UT3's movement is pretty good and whenever I load the game up I find myself thinking, "What a shame."

Wow you just listed about 10 problems I've been having but didn't realize, specifically 1st person vehicle view (like flying as you said) and weapon throwing.

There also aren't any Avril ammo packs to pick up. You have to die to go get more ammo.

 

[Stuxnet]

Originally posted by: soccerballtux

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper

Originally posted by: jbourne77This is one reason why UT3 is very UT99-like, so we're left wondering if UT3 is so panned because of its interface or, perhaps, a less obvious reason.

------

If you take the interface out of the picture, there's really nothing to complain about with regard to UT3. The gameplay is rock solid and the maps are great. Yet it's still unpopular. I contend it's simply a sign of the times.

UT3 is unpopular because everything that surrounds the game play (which itself is not perfect) was god-awful when it was released back in November of 2007. UT3's lack of popularity is NOT a sign of the times as you contend.

The UT99 pro community actually liked the UT3 game play in the UT3 Demo. It wasn't as good as UT99 but there was excitement and people were looking forward to the retail release. When they discovered that the retail release of UT3 = Beta Demo, they completely lost interest. When this game was released, server admins had all sorts of difficulties (wouldn't work on Linux based servers I thin), the server browser didn't work very well, and you couldn't even add Favorites. Last I checked, the user interface was still clunky and slow. The list of what is wrong with everything that surrounds the UT3 game play is long and extensive. The Mapvote menu is also inferior compared to what UT 2004 currently has and you cannot set taunts and communication comments to keybinds. Also, you have to wait to load the Main Menu and you have to leave servers to pull up the server browser to check activity on other servers (after waiting to load the Main Menu).

Basically, going from UT 2004's or even UT99's user interface and server browser to UT3 was like downgrading from a souped up Lexus to a stripped down Kia.

UT3's game play is also far from perfect. The game lacks first-person view for vehicles which is a big problem for flying vehicles, the vehicle that lays the mine pods that cannot be destroyed is retarded in part because of the mine pods, you cannot throw weapons, and the translocator is still limited. I played UT3's Warfare game pretty heavily for the first three months after UT3's release and finally gravitated back to playing UT 2004's Onslaught which I find to be more fun. I agree that the feel of UT3's movement is pretty good and whenever I load the game up I find myself thinking, "What a shame."

Wow you just listed about 10 problems I've been having but didn't realize, specifically 1st person vehicle view (like flying as you said) and weapon throwing.

There also aren't any Avril ammo packs to pick up. You have to die to go get more ammo.

That's not a bug, that's by design. Take Suspense, for instance: if there were ammo packs for the Avril, you wouldn't be able to get anywhere with a vehicle. The 2 Avrils are easily accessible by everyone, and because of the steady-state weapon pickup, there's no competition for the gun. Ammo pick-up would make it way unbalanced.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

I think the thing with the Avrils is a map-specific issue and not a lack of the possibility of having an ammo pickup. My guess is that someone could make a custom map with numerous Avril ammo pickups.

 

[Stuxnet]

Is there an echo in here?

 

[BTRY B 529th FA BN]

I've tested the beta for this and ZOMG its all about the PC - User interface is 10 fold better - look out for the 1.4 release, it'll blow your socks off!!!

Startup
Opening login screen
Holy S*it! vid options galore!!!
Favs Server interface

 

[Zenoth]

Originally posted by: BTRY B 529th FA BN
I've tested the beta for this and ZOMG its all about the PC - User interface is 10 fold better - look out for the 1.4 release, it'll blow your socks off!!!

Startup
Opening login screen
Holy S*it! vid options galore!!!
Favs Server interface

VERY nice, thanks for the preview. I'll be sure to leave L4D for some time when 1.4 comes out, I really miss my good ol' UT99 / 2004 days of team fragging and flag capturing, although I "like" UT3 I never really got addicted to it, but that patch may well just make UT3 actually better than UT2004, which is ain't saying nothing at least for me.