How to move forward with compromise

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
Here is how to solve our problem via compromise.

First off:
The house will NOT pass the Reid plan nor with the Senate pass the Bohner plan. Neither side will pass a bill that comes from the other party.

Bitch about this fact all you want and point blame at whoever you want, but that is the truth.

But here is a path to success:

The house has already passed its bill.

The Senate now needs to take the house bill and amend it to their liking. Remove the balanced budget amendment. Add more to the cap to get us past the election. Whatever it takes to get the bill through the Senate.

At that point we will have a bill that has passed both chambers in different forms and when this happens the two chambers sit down and reconcile the bill. This is how nearly every law is passed and happens ALL the time.

So now the leaders from both sides can sit together and come up with a compromise that will get through both chambers. At that point we won't need the 50-70 tea party members nor will we need the 30+ liberal progressives. All we really need is 220 votes. Say 120 Republicans and 100 Democrats.

Once that is done the bill goes to Obama and everyone can claim victory.

And I mean EVERYONE.

Obama has his bill.
The Democrats and Republicans can claim to have prevented the crisis.
The tea party types can claim that they voted for a balanced budget amendment and when it was removed the ditched the process.
The liberals can claim that they didn't vote for spending cuts etc etc.


I have no idea if this is what will happen. But it is a plan of action that should work since it works for every other bill we pass.
 
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
26,150
12,359
136
Simple. Vote to raise the debt ceiling. Now work on the budget bill as separate legislation like it's supposed to be. Don't hold the debt ceiling bill hostage. It's that simple.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2011/07/30/gIQAqdfdjI_print.html

Washington Post read my mind... ;)
Boehner was “upbeat” during a luncheon with Senate Republicans, participants said, but senators exiting the meeting readily conceded that the House bill would not survive in the Senate. Blunt said talks were focused on finding a compromise that could pass the Democratic Senate and win support from a majority of Boehner’s Republicans.

“Not all of his members, but a majority,” Blunt said.

Boehner is likely to suffer defections if he brings up a Senate-passed compromise, and he would need House Democrats to fill in the gaps — a difficult position for him politically. But GOP senators said they believe Boehner stands ready to do what it takes to avoid a default.

“I think things are moving better than they appear to be moving,” said Sen. Johnny Isakson (R-Ga.). “There’s agreement on cuts. And there’s almost unanimous knowledge that default is not in the cards. That’s the heart of the issue. The rest of it’s details.”[/quote
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
Simple. Vote to raise the debt ceiling. Now work on the budget bill as separate legislation like it's supposed to be. Don't hold the debt ceiling bill hostage. It's that simple.
Idiocy...

Seriously, where is your brain?

Why not propose that we balance the budget tomorrow?
How about we raise taxes tomorrow?
Leave Iraq & Afghanistan overnight to save some money?
Fix the economy by waving a magic wand?

Why suggest a solution that has NO chance of passing either house?
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
26,150
12,359
136
Idiocy...

Seriously, where is your brain?

Why not propose that we balance the budget tomorrow?
How about we raise taxes tomorrow?
Leave Iraq & Afghanistan overnight to save some money?
Fix the economy by waving a magic wand?

Why suggest a solution that has NO chance of passing either house?

So up unitl now, it's not been idiocy to do exactly as I suggest.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Here is how to solve our problem via compromise.

First off:
The house will NOT pass the Reid plan nor with the Senate pass the Bohner plan. Neither side will pass a bill that comes from the other party.

Bitch about this fact all you want and point blame at whoever you want, but that is the truth.

But here is a path to success:

The house has already passed its bill.

The Senate now needs to take the house bill and amend it to their liking. Remove the balanced budget amendment. Add more to the cap to get us past the election. Whatever it takes to get the bill through the Senate.

At that point we will have a bill that has passed both chambers in different forms and when this happens the two chambers sit down and reconcile the bill. This is how nearly every law is passed and happens ALL the time.
-snip-

Yes, that's correct and I've been wondering why they've departed from this norm.

Fern
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
-snip-
Boehner is likely to suffer defections if he brings up a Senate-passed compromise, and he would need House Democrats to fill in the gaps — a difficult position for him politically.

This whole debt ceiling thing may well be the downfall of Boehner as House speaker.

Fern
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
And it was all self inflicted by pandering to the party extremist.

I thought it pretty well known that 'pandering' to the other side (Dems in this case) to get a coalition was political suicide for a Speaker.

If so, he had no other option.

Fern
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
So up unitl now, it's not been idiocy to do exactly as I suggest.
Up to now the party out of power always votes against debt ceiling increases.

Harry Reid has voted against EVERY ceiling increase under a GOP controlled Senate and voted for everyone under a Democrat.
Fixed my misquote...
 
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hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
26,150
12,359
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I thought it pretty well known that 'pandering' to the other side (Dems in this case) to get a coalition was political suicide for a Speaker.

If so, he had no other option.

Fern

That was cute. You know which party and what extremists I was referring to.
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
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Up to now the party out of power always votes against debt ceiling increases.

Harry Reid has voted against EVERY ceiling increase under a GOP president and voted for everyone under a Democrat.
How did Bush get debt limit increases under a Democratically controlled House and Senate?
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
That was cute. You know which party and what extremists I was referring to.

You misunderstand me.

It was no attempt to be "cute". I knew you were referring to the TEA Party.

I'm saying he had no better choice. I say that because I assume you meant instead of "pandering" to them, he should have reached out to get a bipartisan coalition.

It's my understanding that that would have been political suicide. I.e., Hobson's choice.

Fern
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
The history of debt increases via congress research.
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL31967.pdf

The biggest increase in history was $1.9 trillion in Feb 2010.
That increase more than double the previous largest increase and no Obama wants that much plus another $600 billion.

Or think of it this way:
Prior to Obama the three highest increases in history added up to $2.6 trillion. Obama wants that much in ONE bill.
 

hal2kilo

Lifer
Feb 24, 2009
26,150
12,359
136
You misunderstand me.

It was no attempt to be "cute". I knew you were referring to the TEA Party.

I'm saying he had no better choice. I say that because I assume you meant instead of "pandering" to them, he should have reached out to get a bipartisan coalition.

It's my understanding that that would have been political suicide. I.e., Hobson's choice.

Fern

Sorry I misunderstood you.

I'm watching the house debate right now on CSPAN. This thing is never going to pass. I have never seen so much political posturing in my life. Arguing with extremists is futile.
 

Hayabusa Rider

Admin Emeritus & Elite Member
Jan 26, 2000
50,879
4,268
126
I think we should do it the same way we did it the last 100+ times.


Ok, I'm drafting you into the "shadow government" to fix this :D

I'm at the point where I believe that both sides have so much invested in not backing down they'd let the whole nation melt down before losing face. This ain't feudal Japan.
 

ProfJohn

Lifer
Jul 28, 2006
18,161
7
0
How did Bush get debt limit increases under a Democratically controlled House and Senate?
In 2007 the house did not vote on the bill.

It passed the Senate 53-42 with 26 Democrats and Republicans voting for it.
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/vote.xpd?vote=s2007-354

Interestingly everyone who ran for president did not vote on it...
This says Reid voted yes... maybe my source was wrong... will look into this.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Sorry I misunderstood you.

I'm watching the house debate right now on CSPAN. This thing is never going to pass. I have never seen so much political posturing in my life. Arguing with extremists is futile.

Sounds masochistic to me.

;)

Fern
 

her209

No Lifer
Oct 11, 2000
56,336
11
0
Sorry I misunderstood you.

I'm watching the house debate right now on CSPAN. This thing is never going to pass. I have never seen so much political posturing in my life. Arguing with extremists is futile.
Its already been voted down. The House is in recess. Its on rerun.
 

Jhhnn

IN MEMORIAM
Nov 11, 1999
62,365
14,685
136
ProJo's proposal-

"Start with a bucket 'o turds..."

Dems need to step away, let Repubs deal with the Reid proposal as they see fit.

If there's default, it'll crash the economy. If Repubs have their way, it'll crash the economy. It's important, vital, that they be made to own either outcome, for Dems to not appear to be complicit in the latter.

If it has to be default, if Repubs are willing to force that, then the public will know who to blame when granny's SS cheque doesn't appear on time, and when the foodstamps so many Americans depend on fail to materialize, not to mention the reaction of the nation's creditors when they don't get paid, either. Let the Tea Party answer to their own broke-ass constituents. Let people realize just how much they depend on a smoothly functioning govt that Repubs are attempting to destroy.
 

Carmen813

Diamond Member
May 18, 2007
3,189
0
76
Ok, I'm drafting you into the "shadow government" to fix this :D

I'm at the point where I believe that both sides have so much invested in not backing down they'd let the whole nation melt down before losing face. This ain't feudal Japan.

Yet.

You know what sucks? The VA was just going to hire me too.

Damn it.