How to control the people : Keep them stupid and uninformed

[Indus]

The Neo-Darwinian view is dying. Have you heard of the "third way"? It isn't happening because modern research is bolstering that position, just the opposite.

You mean the third reich? Yeah we always knew what you were.

 

[xthetenth]

Quantify that. Your point requires this and just asserting it isn't enough.

Funny how you removed all of the post that did exactly that.

Good thing I wasn't actually talking to you because I know you pull shit like this.

 

[Moonbeam]

Please focus on your 100% claim. I am not the subject of conversation.

My thought was not that you are the subject of my conversation, but what you mean by 'knowing'. Scientific knowledge is a body of past theories about how the world works that have been verified to apply without exception experimentally. In short, a scientific leap of faith is what a logical mind does with past evidence of success. The benefits of scientific reasoning have brought profound changes in our understanding of the universe that any not indoctrinated person can see. Science does not require, in the sense of demanding, faith; it earns it via tangible evidence.

So when I say that the probabilities that molecules self organized etc. is too remote to have happened, you must establish scientifically that some other agency did it which itself must have had some agency to have caused it creating the It's turtles all the way down argument or a non verifiable notion that the creating agency had no creator itself. That then violated Occam's Razor. Having eliminated the unprovable, a scientific mind, while it may not know how something happened, seeing that it did happen, theorized how that could be leaving the knowledge of 100% certainty there is a natural explanation, and since molecules are self ordered, they did that somehow without outside mysterious creator type intervention. This is just the nature of logic built into the human brain.

Now personally, between you and me, I know that God exists, that God, human consciousness, the universe are all the same thing, so not that He stands somehow out of it. Awareness of the unity of all things is a conscious state, the most profound one I believe, the human mind can experience. It is a peak experience, that confers the sense of ultimate joy, love, and good. It's not about a mysterious being other than He is the being we all are and do not realize is there. God is when we, the ego self, is not and we, the eye, is an illusion but one of deep persistence and conviction. I think you can't have both God and your ego self so I would call belief in the man on a cloud a fairy tail of self flattery.

 

[Denly]

They are examples of probabilities that would NOT be ~100% sure given a 4 billion year old planet or 10^24 planets that have been around for 400 billion years.

You just missed the point.

I am surprised you agree Earth is +/- 4 billion years old.

 

[IronWing]

Then you'd just multiply the number of planets by the number of trials I came up with. It is estimated that there are 10^24 planets, assuming all of them are able to support molecular replication that would mean you'd have 1.26*10^53 trials in the entire universe (if all planets were 4 billion years old). Assume that each planet is 400 billion years old instead of 4 billion. That is still only going to get you up to 1.26*10^55 trials. So anything as unlikely as 1 in 10^60 is going to still be very unlikely to occur.

The probability of occurrence for events that have already happened is 1. Therefore, you're a potato.

 

[repoman0]

The probability of occurrence for events that have already happened is 1. Therefore, you're a potato.

Yep. Somebody doesn't understand conditional probability, which means they don't understand probability at all and have no business making flawed arguments based in it.

 

[repoman0]

Hey bullshit24, education is cheap these days. College not required.

https://smile.amazon.com/Probabilit...98491817&sr=8-1&keywords=probability+textbook

 

[buckshot24]

Funny how you removed all of the post that did exactly that.

Good thing I wasn't actually talking to you because I know you pull shit like this.

I clipped it because it didn't say anything about how populated the landscape was. How many useful sequences of DNA exist to nonsense sequences of DNA? Any ideas?

 

[buckshot24]

The probability of occurrence for events that have already happened is 1. Therefore, you're a potato.

A sweet potato?

 

[buckshot24]

So when I say that the probabilities that molecules self organized etc. is too remote to have happened, you must establish scientifically that some other agency did it which itself must have had some agency to have caused it creating the It's turtles all the way down argument or a non verifiable notion that the creating agency had no creator itself. That then violated Occam's Razor. Having eliminated the unprovable, a scientific mind, while it may not know how something happened, seeing that it did happen, theorized how that could be leaving the knowledge of 100% certainty there is a natural explanation, and since molecules are self ordered, they did that somehow without outside mysterious creator type intervention. This is just the nature of logic built into the human brain.

We're here therefore we evolved isn't an argument. How do you mean that molecules are "self ordered"? DNA sequences aren't "self ordered".

 

[soulcougher73]

I am surprised you agree Earth is +/- 4 billion years old.

LOL Maybe we need a list of facts he agrees with before we can attempt a discussion with him.

 

[zinfamous]

Cells don't mutate, you daft moron.

fucking cancer, how does it work? Oh right--it happens when reading buckshat posts.

 

[Jhhnn]

The probability of occurrence for events that have already happened is 1. Therefore, you're a potato.

Yep. I offered the same thing in a different way a couple of pages back. Life exists. Just because we don't completely understand its origins & ways doesn't mean God did it.

 

[xthetenth]

I clipped it because it didn't say anything about how populated the landscape was. How many useful sequences of DNA exist to nonsense sequences of DNA? Any ideas?

Cells have a lot of DNA that doesn't get read. DNA that does get read mutating in non-productive ways is frequently self-correcting. DNA that changes in beneficial ways increases its likelihood of being passed on and continuing to exist.

Trying to play straight probability games when there's such a massive and blatant bias in how DNA perpetuates itself is beyond daft.

 

[buckshot24]

Cells have a lot of DNA that doesn't get read. DNA that does get read mutating in non-productive ways is frequently self-correcting. DNA that changes in beneficial ways increases its likelihood of being passed on and continuing to exist.

Trying to play straight probability games when there's such a massive and blatant bias in how DNA perpetuates itself is beyond daft.

I wasn't playing any probability games, Moonbeam was. You then made claims about 10 coin flip results being unlikely and having relevance to living systems somehow. I'm pushing back on the assumption that the landscape of functional DNA sequences is rich instead of sparse (as it seems to be).

And I think you should update your view of DNA, because you sound like you're stuck in the 80s. We know that most of the DNA code is read now. You didn't think only the protein coding parts were important, did you?

 

[Azuma Hazuki]

And speaking of cancer, Buckyball here seems to have metastatic stage 4 Dunning-Krugeroma, which after devouring his brain (which didn't take long at all) has spread to his typing hand. Hand, singular, because the other one is constantly wanking.

Too bad there's no treatment for that, eh?

 

[buckshot24]

And speaking of cancer, Buckyball here seems to have metastatic stage 4 Dunning-Krugeroma, which after devouring his brain (which didn't take long at all) has spread to his typing hand. Hand, singular, because the other one is constantly wanking.

Too bad there's no treatment for that, eh?

Are you just a loudmouth hypocrite or are you going to start that shunning nazi campaign any day now? Please start that ASAP.

 

[buckshot24]

fucking cancer, how does it work? Oh right--it happens when reading buckshat posts.

Via the DNA mutating in cells.

 

[buckshot24]

Yep. I offered the same thing in a different way a couple of pages back. Life exists. Just because we don't completely understand its origins & ways doesn't mean God did it.

No you didn't. You misconstrued my argument and wouldn't admit your error.

 

[zinfamous]

Via the DNA mutating in cells.

and the cells mutate. It's not worth discussing these things with you, because you know nothing of what you speak.

seriously, until you address the actual reasoning, the actual source of your belief structure here, there is no point to engage you. I will weigh my 2+ decades of experience in molecular biology, genetics, and functional genomics against your lifetime of eating mudpies--or whatever the fuck it is you do with yourself--when it comes to the fact of evolution, which is, as you don't know, the cornerstone of biology. There is no field of biology without evolution, and that is a simple fact.

You can't accept whichever facts are most convenient to you, as that is not how facts work. It is not how science works. I honestly don't give a shit if you choose to make yourself obsolete and remain blissfully uninformed and completely useless to the human species, but don't dare to think that your idiocy has any place in a single educational institution. Your thought that this kind of denial exists as an educational tool is child abuse, pure and simple.

So I will continue to amend all of your posts as buckshat: serial child abuser, from this point forward.

 

[buckshot24]

LOL Maybe we need a list of facts he agrees with before we can attempt a discussion with him.

I'll give you 400 billion years. How's that?

 

[buckshot24]

Yep. Somebody doesn't understand conditional probability, which means they don't understand probability at all and have no business making flawed arguments based in it.

What arguments based off of probability have I made? Please cite them and explain why they are flawed as well.

 

[Azuma Hazuki]

What's wrong, Buckshat, is the big mean nasty lady hurting your tiny yellow-snowflake feelings? Feel free to leave if you can't handle me.

 

[bshole]

We know that most of the DNA code is read now. You didn't think only the protein coding parts were important, did you?

Who is this "we", you speak of? I always find it amusing when young earth creationists who have contributed a total of absolute nothing to science have the audacity to assume the mantle of scientific achievement (something they do with ridiculous regularity). YECs have no idea what the phrase "how DNA code is read" even means.

The absurdity of belief in a 6,000 year old world in the presence of billion year old starlight is beyond embarrassing. It is an indictment of a hopelessly crippled thinking process.

 

[repoman0]

What arguments based off of probability have I made? Please cite them and explain why they are flawed as well.

No thanks. Some people are just unteachable and incapable of debate, and you are one of them. In fact, you're too incompetent to even understand that you're making an argument based on shitty application of probability, e.g.:

Just so we're clear, I'm not making a probability argument against evolution, just showing that 4 billion years isn't enough time to make really unlikely things likely to occur. There isn't enough "coin flips".