Honda rules all. IF you get a generator or someother small equiptment ask people what engine will last the longest. 75% will answer honda. Look at all the old honda bikes out there too.
The new Honda V6 is nicely tuned, giving you about the same amount of power but not near enough torque. The Nissan V6s are great engines with good power and great torque but you also get the torque steer to go with it. I've heard about torque steer on almost all models based on that VQ engine. I guess for general driving pleasure the Nissans will be better, but the Honda is smoother and more docile, and also has the power when you want it. For fuel efficiency and emmission though, Honda wins easily.
Originally posted by: mAdD INDIAN
I'm sure it was a V6 auto...those are a dog. And I'm sure a LS1 in *ANY* gear will smoke a stock 240SX. Damn V8 with its damn stump-pulling torque!
My friend who was driving said it was a WS6 but I'm pretty sure he was joking. I can't tell the difference between the V8 and V6... does the 6 have dual exhausts (I think it was quad actually)? We were just messing around, but he lined up with the Firebird and after it started accelerating, he floored it. We were just about even and then it started to accelerate slower. The guy WAS still pushing it though. I assumed it was an auto stuck in 4th gear.
Originally posted by: rootaxs
To reiterate what Mad Indian mentioned about having to look at the dyno graph's first. Take the sheets compared in this thread between the 3.5L VQ and the CL-S's 3.2L. The CL-S does make more peak HP but that's it, it's Peak. Just before hitting redline the VQ has more spunk whether it be Torque or HP. And when you're driving down the road in the city you need the power down there.
Eli, i know this engine is not available in the US market but it's an exception to the #'s you posted nevertheless. The R34 Nur and a lot more other high performance vehicles make much more HP and TQ/Litre. I'm very sure each engine from each manufacturer can make so much more power but they prefer to detune it instead. Why? I don't know but i have my "conspiracy theories" behind it
Very impressive. Since it's "rated" at 280HP, it produces 109HP/litre and 115ftlbs/litre. But as they say, with a little tuning..
Yes, they certainly could make much more HP and TQ/litre. They are detuned in a sense... It's very hard to make an extremely reliable "racing engine". You could say the same thing about any engine. You can build a 5HP Briggs and Stratton to over 12HP..
Like I said, they have to strike a big balance between reliability and performance. It's a tradeoff. It also has to do with emissions... It seems that emission control equipment also helps keep the power down.I haven't been brainwashed by anybody. Infact, when I was compiling that list.. it was the first time I've ever heard anybody use HP and torque/litre as a comparison. Yes, that's what I said in my first post. The more power a given engine develops, the shorter it's lifespan will be, all other things being equal. That's the hardest part... finding the balance between power and reliability.
Well, the Nissan QR25 is ULEV certified while the VQ is LEV certified. But I agree, the Honda engines are more fuel efficient.
<<Well, the Nissan QR25 is ULEV certified while the VQ is LEV certified. But I agree, the Honda engines are more fuel efficient.>>
The Honda engines still best them. Selected models with the 2.4L I4 satisfies even the strictest SULEV requirement in California, while their 3.0L V6 is ULEV in the required states.
The Honda engines still best them. Selected models with the 2.4L I4 satisfies even the strictest SULEV requirement in California, while their 3.0L V6 is ULEV in the required states.
Originally posted by: NFS4
Originally posted by: SuperTool
To sum things up:
Toyota's V6 is a reliable engine IF you change oil every 4000 miles.
Nissan V6 is a reliable engine PERIOD.
Interesting...
What is the oil change interval listed for the Maxima/Altima/etc?? And how often do you change the oil in your car?
The point is, if you don't do what someone TELLS YOU TO DO, what else do you expect?
I don't know if this aws posted in teh thread, but there is a nice spreadsheet on Maxima.org that displays the oil anaylsis from various cars (from Maximas to TLs) during various intervals and driving conditions. the oil sample shows how much wear was on the engine, and some of the engines have been using 100shot of nitrous for over 100k miles, other are superchargerd, etc...
Its a nice info/reference.
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: rootaxs
Eli, i know this engine is not available in the US market but it's an exception to the #'s you posted nevertheless. The R34 Nur and a lot more other high performance vehicles make much more HP and TQ/Litre. I'm very sure each engine from each manufacturer can make so much more power but they prefer to detune it instead. Why? I don't know but i have my "conspiracy theories" behind it
Very impressive. Since it's "rated" at 280HP, it produces 109HP/litre and 115ftlbs/litre. But as they say, with a little tuning..
Actually it's rated at a tad over 400hp (where with a little tuning could go higher) and detuned to 280 due to Japan regulations. The Skyline engines are known to put over 800hp reliably so even at 400 out of the box that could still be pretty reliable... oh how i wish to own such a beautiful car. *sigh*
By the replies I have seen in this thread, it looks like a very close call. That's a good thing for the consumer when choosing a new car to buy. Personally, I don't need a mountain of power and prefer higher milage ratings. I have a V6 in my Infiniti and it's do damn expensive to drive because it guzzles gas. OTOH, I drive the snot out of my accord and the gas costs are relatively low.
Skylines are ugly...Originally posted by: rootaxs
Originally posted by: Eli
Originally posted by: rootaxs
Eli, i know this engine is not available in the US market but it's an exception to the #'s you posted nevertheless. The R34 Nur and a lot more other high performance vehicles make much more HP and TQ/Litre. I'm very sure each engine from each manufacturer can make so much more power but they prefer to detune it instead. Why? I don't know but i have my "conspiracy theories" behind it
Very impressive. Since it's "rated" at 280HP, it produces 109HP/litre and 115ftlbs/litre. But as they say, with a little tuning..
Actually it's rated at a tad over 400hp (where with a little tuning could go higher) and detuned to 280 due to Japan regulations. The Skyline engines are known to put over 800hp reliably so even at 400 out of the box that could still be pretty reliable... oh how i wish to own such a beautiful car. *sigh*
NFS4
No Lifer
- Oct 9, 1999
- 72,636
- 48
- 91
Also, when it comes to hybrids, Toyota and Honda have Nissan whooped.
When Nissan wanted to develop hybrid powertrains for their cars, who did they go to??? They signed a deal with Toyota to use THEIR technology.
Who did GM go for hybrid engine technology?? They too signed a deal with Toyota.
Where did GM go when they wanted to put a new V6 engine in their VUE sport-ute for the next model year?? They signed a deal with Honda to provide them with SOHC 3.0 liter V6 engines.
Too bad no one leans on Nissan for engines...I wonder why??
When Nissan wanted to develop hybrid powertrains for their cars, who did they go to??? They signed a deal with Toyota to use THEIR technology.
Who did GM go for hybrid engine technology?? They too signed a deal with Toyota.
Where did GM go when they wanted to put a new V6 engine in their VUE sport-ute for the next model year?? They signed a deal with Honda to provide them with SOHC 3.0 liter V6 engines.
Too bad no one leans on Nissan for engines...I wonder why??
Originally posted by: NFS4
Also, when it comes to hybrids, Toyota and Honda have Nissan whooped.
When Nissan wanted to develop hybrid powertrains for their cars, who did they go to??? They signed a deal with Toyota to use THEIR technology.
Who did GM go for hybrid engine technology?? They too signed a deal with Toyota.
Where did GM go when they wanted to put a new V6 engine in their VUE sport-ute for the next model year?? They signed a deal with Honda to provide them with SOHC 3.0 liter V6 engines.
Too bad no one leans on Nissan for engines...I wonder why??
Uh...Lola uses Nissan engines (3l VQ) in the Le Mans and various other races, Infiniti uses Nissan's V8s in IRL (I think that's the series..not sure), I believe Toyota/Nissan were sharing technology equally...finally isn't the Sentra CA the most environmentally friendly gasoline powered car in the US??
NFS4
No Lifer
- Oct 9, 1999
- 72,636
- 48
- 91
All you can give are race scenarios, like that's any good to the buying public. And Infiniti IS Nissan so that IRL reference is pretty lame.
And the "cleanest" gas cars sold in America are the Honda Insight and the Toyota Prius.
Also, Toyota is SUPPLYING Nissan with hybrid systems:
http://www.auto.com/industry/iwira3_20020903.htm
Who said anything about hte buying public? I was talkin about these company's as an engine manufacturing company for designing the best engines not specifically for consumer interest. Also, I used Infiniti since the engine is badged under Infiniti ( I know its a Nissan) and I don't see how that is lame.
And about teh Sentra CA I was talking about a gasoline engine car, not a hybrid. But yes your are right on that frnt that Honda/Toyota are leaders in that field. But I don't really give a damn about that (not now anyway) so to me its a moot point.
I care about engines that excite you and have emotion. Honda and Nissan have those engines...Toyota sadly does not (apart from the 2GZE and the older 1.6L in the Corollas). And again, i don't give a damn about what the buying public wants.
NFS4
No Lifer
- Oct 9, 1999
- 72,636
- 48
- 91
1) The point was that other companies use Honda/Toyota technology in their production models. This technology is available for customers to purchase. I don't see Nissan in any cross company powertrain deals other than Toyota supplying them with hybrid systems
2) Sentra CA? Never heard of it. I'd be willing to bet that the ULEV Civics are the cleanest
3) The only "excitement" to be had in a Honda vehicle is from an S2000, Integra, NSX, or RSX IMHO. V6 Accords don't exactly pour out emotion or excitement. Refinement, YES. You may not give a damn what the buying public wants, but they make a BIG impact on what YOU are able to buy. Don't belive me, look at what happened in the 90's to:
300ZX
RX7
Supra
240SX
MR2
All were victims of people flocking to SUV's and family sedans. While three of those cars have come back in new incarnations, the buying public is a fickle bunch and they help determine what a manufacturer WILL or WILL NOT produce. But for you to sit here and say that you don't care about what the buying public wants is a bit uninformed.
Cars up on the block next may include the Acura CL/CL Type-S due to poor sales. The point is, you can act like you're in your own little wonder land of performance and tire shredding, but you're not the only that decides what's "hip" or what's production worthy.
As far as ease of workin on, Honda
As far as the worst to work on.. Nissan.. that 2.8 can kiss my A$$ and I hope my sister in law sells hers cause I'm tired of that car.
Toyota and Honda I'd say are both pretty easy to work on, but Toyo has one thing aginst them... the 4.7 is total crap, no low end at all, and if you put any stress on the motor it's valves go to hell in under 50K
#1 Honda
#2 Toyo
#900 Nissan
As far as the worst to work on.. Nissan.. that 2.8 can kiss my A$$ and I hope my sister in law sells hers cause I'm tired of that car.
Toyota and Honda I'd say are both pretty easy to work on, but Toyo has one thing aginst them... the 4.7 is total crap, no low end at all, and if you put any stress on the motor it's valves go to hell in under 50K
#1 Honda
#2 Toyo
#900 Nissan
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