Health Care Poll

[agentbad]

Well I just started working at a hospital and I can tell you the US health care system is in trouble. I have benefits from the hospital and they are some of the best in the state but since we are in the city a lot of folks come in who don't have insurance. Homeless and immigrants do receive free health care but they have to wait. Not only that but they see the new doctors that are still in training which makes them kind of guinea pigs in a way. Then there are the working class people that come in and can't afford insurance because of they're just out of the low income tax bracket. They get financial aid but they are still breaking the bank if they are really sick. Then there are all those stories I read about how kids and adults dying because insurance companies wouldn't approve or took to long to approve a procedure that would've saved their lives. Now IMO I think nationalizing the health care system would get rid of all this red tape and maybe even change our society for the better.

Wow, I was in a hurry and forgot to finish the poll when I posted this last night. The poll is fixed now if you want to vote.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Ummm, there's not much Poll in your Poll.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: PrinceofWands
Ummm, there's not much Poll in your Poll.

I think he means pulse on Health Care and it's pulse is getting weaker everyday.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

Well I'm not from America, but take my opinion for what it's worth. I live in New Zealand, where we have free health care for everyone. I think it's a great system, and you'd be very hard pressed to find New Zealanders who would like to change to an American-style private health care system.

I have some limited experience using the health care system and it works very well. About a year and a half ago I went to the emergency room because half of my face was paralysed. I was in an exam room within minutes and diagnosed with Bells Palsy, thankfully not serious. I was given a prescription for steroids and anti virals (total of $4 to fill both, including refills) and was referred to a general practitioner for a follow up visit, as well as several weeks of physio. The GP examined me a couple of weeks later, found what he thought was a pseduo pappiladema (swelling of the optic nerve) and referred me to a neurologist. The neurologist examined me and cleared me (and gave me a scrip for an infection in my eye caused by not being able to blink).

All of this cost me $6, the cost of filling my prescriptions. Something you should also keep in mind is that private health care is available to anyone who wants to pay for it. The public health care sector is in good shape, but if you for some reason would prefer private health care, no problem. Private health insurance is also available to anyone who wants it, and it is very reasonably priced.

I personally would never want to go to a private health care system.

 

[alchemize]

From what I've seen, a modification of the French version would be the best for the US. A combination of private and public insurance and care, but not nationalization.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Well I'm not from America, but take my opinion for what it's worth. I live in New Zealand, where we have free health care for everyone. I think it's a great system, and you'd be very hard pressed to find New Zealanders who would like to change to an American-style private health care system.

I have some limited experience using the health care system and it works very well. About a year and a half ago I went to the emergency room because half of my face was paralysed. I was in an exam room within minutes and diagnosed with Bells Palsy, thankfully not serious. I was given a prescription for steroids and anti virals (total of $4 to fill both, including refills) and was referred to a general practitioner for a follow up visit, as well as several weeks of physio. The GP examined me a couple of weeks later, found what he thought was a pseduo pappiladema (swelling of the optic nerve) and referred me to a neurologist. The neurologist examined me and cleared me (and gave me a scrip for an infection in my eye caused by not being able to blink).

All of this cost me $6, the cost of filling my prescriptions. Something you should also keep in mind is that private health care is available to anyone who wants to pay for it. The public health care sector is in good shape, but if you for some reason would prefer private health care, no problem. Private health insurance is also available to anyone who wants it, and it is very reasonably priced.

I personally would never want to go to a private health care system.

So, you think your mere experiences with an actual public healthcare system are anywhere near as accurate on the issue as the speculations of our right-wing ideologues?

They can tell you in great detail why your system is not possible to exist, and must actually work extremely worse than it does.

Just as they told us the Clinton 1993 tax increase on the wealthiest 2% would doom the economy and cause the deficits to skyrocket, until they did the opposite.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Well I'm not from America, but take my opinion for what it's worth. I live in New Zealand, where we have free health care for everyone. I think it's a great system, and you'd be very hard pressed to find New Zealanders who would like to change to an American-style private health care system.

I have some limited experience using the health care system and it works very well. About a year and a half ago I went to the emergency room because half of my face was paralysed. I was in an exam room within minutes and diagnosed with Bells Palsy, thankfully not serious. I was given a prescription for steroids and anti virals (total of $4 to fill both, including refills) and was referred to a general practitioner for a follow up visit, as well as several weeks of physio. The GP examined me a couple of weeks later, found what he thought was a pseduo pappiladema (swelling of the optic nerve) and referred me to a neurologist. The neurologist examined me and cleared me (and gave me a scrip for an infection in my eye caused by not being able to blink).

All of this cost me $6, the cost of filling my prescriptions. Something you should also keep in mind is that private health care is available to anyone who wants to pay for it. The public health care sector is in good shape, but if you for some reason would prefer private health care, no problem. Private health insurance is also available to anyone who wants it, and it is very reasonably priced.

I personally would never want to go to a private health care system.

Thank you for you open opinion of the system in New Zealand.

What's immigration policy like there?

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

I'd rather not derail this thread into an immigration debate to be honest.

 

[Slew Foot]

Originally posted by: agentbad
Well I just started working at a hospital and I can tell you the US health care system is in trouble. I have benefits from the hospital and they are some of the best in the state but since we are in the city a lot of folks come in who don't have insurance. Homeless and immigrants do receive free health care but they have to wait. Not only that but they see the new doctors that are still in training which makes them kind of guinea pigs in a way. Then there are the working class people that come in and can't afford insurance because of they're just out of the low income tax bracket. They get financial aid but they are still breaking the bank if they are really sick. Then there are all those stories I read about how kids and adults dying because insurance companies wouldn't approve or took to long to approve a procedure that would've saved their lives. Now IMO I think nationalizing the health care system would get rid of all this red tape and maybe even change our society for the better.

Just for reference, it sounds like you're at a county teaching hospital. Go to a private hospital and share your experience when youre done there, compare and contrast the two.

County teaching hospitals tend to be woefully inneffcient. You have tons of new docs who dont really know what theyre doing so they order more tests than necessary. Combine that with attendings doing more procedures than necessary (you have to teach the residents sometime) and with nurses, pharmacists, PT's, xray techs, etc.. who are all trying to learn, and you get a system thats overblown with waste, innefficiency, and expenditures, but that's the price of training new people.

Contrast that to a swanky private hospital, where everything runs like a well oiled machine, and youll see that health care in the US is actually pretty good.

 

[senseamp]

Originally posted by: Slew Foot

Originally posted by: agentbad
Well I just started working at a hospital and I can tell you the US health care system is in trouble. I have benefits from the hospital and they are some of the best in the state but since we are in the city a lot of folks come in who don't have insurance. Homeless and immigrants do receive free health care but they have to wait. Not only that but they see the new doctors that are still in training which makes them kind of guinea pigs in a way. Then there are the working class people that come in and can't afford insurance because of they're just out of the low income tax bracket. They get financial aid but they are still breaking the bank if they are really sick. Then there are all those stories I read about how kids and adults dying because insurance companies wouldn't approve or took to long to approve a procedure that would've saved their lives. Now IMO I think nationalizing the health care system would get rid of all this red tape and maybe even change our society for the better.

Just for reference, it sounds like you're at a county teaching hospital. Go to a private hospital and share your experience when youre done there, compare and contrast the two.

County teaching hospitals tend to be woefully inneffcient. You have tons of new docs who dont really know what theyre doing so they order more tests than necessary. Combine that with attendings doing more procedures than necessary (you have to teach the residents sometime) and with nurses, pharmacists, PT's, xray techs, etc.. who are all trying to learn, and you get a system thats overblown with waste, innefficiency, and expenditures, but that's the price of training new people.

Contrast that to a swanky private hospital, where everything runs like a well oiled machine, and youll see that health care in the US is actually pretty good.

So you think a swanky private hospital is representative of the US health care system overall? Even when you take your insurance to a swanky private hospital, guess what, the insurance company can drag their feet or refuse to pay for procedures that you need. Then what your swanky private hospital doctor says can be overridden by some bureaucrat working for the insurance company who may have an MD but has never seen you.
It happened to me when my doc ordered a CT.

 

[randym431]

Everyone should see Michael Moore's Sick-o. I love how folks in France, England, Canada and even Cuba are ask in the waiting rooms how much their visit to the doctor cost that day. They all look at Moore with a blank stare..."cost ????". Then they laugh at the US healthcare system, and they have every right too.
Simply put, a country that allows companies to profit from sick people, is pretty sick.
And remember, it was good old Richard Nixon who rally around the HMO system, where profit is brought into health care. Remember Richard Nixon? Better known as tricky Dick.

 

[Moonbeam]

I wasted years of my life making money to pay for stuff like health care. It's not fair to make it free now. If you haven't wasted your life making money it's too damn bad. Crawl off somewhere and die.

 

[Farang]

I've always had insurance so I'm not worried about it.

 

[Craig234]

Originally posted by: Farang
I've always had insurance so I'm not worried about it.

So your politics begin and end with you, and you have no concern about the rest of the human race?

Are you that much of an immoral person?

That's quite a harmful view, IMO.

 

[Farang]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Farang
I've always had insurance so I'm not worried about it.

So your politics begin and end with you, and you have no concern about the rest of the human race?

Are you that much of an immoral person?

That's quite a harmful view, IMO.

I don't see why taxpayers should be forced to pay charity. For the most part, yes, most of my politics begin and end with me. Of course they do. That is nothing to be ashamed of.

Note that this has nothing to do with Ron Paul.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

One of the big problems with our health care system is the state of our nation's overall economy. Regardless of whether we have socialized medicine or laissez-faire, we're going to have a problem because a huge percentage of the people living within the borders of the United States (Americans and illegal aliens) are poor. Someone has to pay for all of the health care of all those poor people.

I think that socialized medicine would benefit from efficiency, but the root of the problem is that only a fraction of the populace has the ability to pay for its health care. The solution is to improve the overall economy and to reduce the number of poor people. If the nation becomes a third world country, it won't matter whether we have socialized medicine or a free market.

 

[Genx87]

Originally posted by: GodlessAstronomer
Well I'm not from America, but take my opinion for what it's worth. I live in New Zealand, where we have free health care for everyone. I think it's a great system, and you'd be very hard pressed to find New Zealanders who would like to change to an American-style private health care system.

I have some limited experience using the health care system and it works very well. About a year and a half ago I went to the emergency room because half of my face was paralysed. I was in an exam room within minutes and diagnosed with Bells Palsy, thankfully not serious. I was given a prescription for steroids and anti virals (total of $4 to fill both, including refills) and was referred to a general practitioner for a follow up visit, as well as several weeks of physio. The GP examined me a couple of weeks later, found what he thought was a pseduo pappiladema (swelling of the optic nerve) and referred me to a neurologist. The neurologist examined me and cleared me (and gave me a scrip for an infection in my eye caused by not being able to blink).

All of this cost me $6, the cost of filling my prescriptions. Something you should also keep in mind is that private health care is available to anyone who wants to pay for it. The public health care sector is in good shape, but if you for some reason would prefer private health care, no problem. Private health insurance is also available to anyone who wants it, and it is very reasonably priced.

I personally would never want to go to a private health care system.

It cost you in taxes.

Nothing is free.

 

[GodlessAstronomer]

I'm well aware that the money for socialised medicine comes from taxes. I still wouldn't trade it for private health care.

 

[agentbad]

Originally posted by: WhipperSnapper
One of the big problems with our health care system is the state of our nation's overall economy. Regardless of whether we have socialized medicine or laissez-faire, we're going to have a problem because a huge percentage of the people living within the borders of the United States (Americans and illegal aliens) are poor. Someone has to pay for all of the health care of all those poor people.
I think that socialized medicine would benefit from efficiency, but the root of the problem is that only a fraction of the populace has the ability to pay for its health care. The solution is to improve the overall economy and to reduce the number of poor people. If the nation becomes a third world country, it won't matter whether we have socialized medicine or a free market.

I think making the health care system national would dramatically reduce the strain on much of our populace that can barely afford to live. Suddenly they will have money for other things like a good education which in turn will get them out of the poverty cycle.

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
I wasted years of my life making money to pay for stuff like health care. It's not fair to make it free now. If you haven't wasted your life making money it's too damn bad. Crawl off somewhere and die.

I agree that isn't fair that just because you were sick it put a burden on you to pay for treatment. Still if you had the chance to change it so other people don't have to go through the same bad experience would you? Not only that but think about your family whether it be your kids, wife, parents, etc, would you want them to suffer as you did?

A lot of people are retiring and can no longer afford good health coverage because their premiums get ridiculously high. Then if you move to a hospice or old folks home they suck you dry before the government starts paying anything. All those years of work and what do you get for it if you end up unable to help yourself. Now I have read some opinions asking why should I be responsible for the well beings of other Americans. Well your taxes already pay for the roads you drive, the cops, fire department, and even some health care. Why would it be so terrible to pay a little higher taxes to make sure you, your family, and friends will all be covered if something happens to them? Imagine the burden, the dept, that would be lifted from so many people. Suddenly you don't have to chose a job you hate because the benefits are good.

One of my coworkers was paying something like 800 dollars a month for insurance because she hadn't hit the magic number for Medicare but had a heart attack right after she retired and had to get this job at the hospital because otherwise she would go broke trying to pay her premiums. She put in years of hard work just to get a kick in the teeth when she finally got the chance to retire.

It would be nice if the states would attack the issue but I don't think anything is going to happen unless it happens on a nation wide scale.

I fixed the poll if you wanna vote. I will try and add more later.

 

[Sinsear]

Originally posted by: Craig234

Originally posted by: Farang
I've always had insurance so I'm not worried about it.

So your politics begin and end with you, and you have no concern about the rest of the human race?

Pretty much. Donate to charity if you want to. Don't keep reaching in my pocket for every victim group and socialized idea that comes around.

 

[bamacre]

Under the constitution, our government has NO right to be managing healthcare. They don't even have the right to be managing education.

Anyone who thinks it is OK to give the federal government more power than it already has is a moron. We should be cleaning up our federal government, not allowing it to make more messes.

Americans have a government vacuum attached to their wallet, and a gun to their head. This has GOT to change.

 

[FoBoT]

i already pay taxes and i already have health insurance

leave it alone

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally posted by: bamacre
Under the constitution, our government has NO right to be managing healthcare. They don't even have the right to be managing education.

Anyone who thinks it is OK to give the federal government more power than it already has is a moron. We should be cleaning up our federal government, not allowing it to make more messes.

Americans have a government vacuum attached to their wallet, and a gun to their head. This has GOT to change.

:thumbsup:

 

[Slew Foot]

So what does the US health care cost, $2 trillion a year? Divide by 300 mil, and you get 6700/person. So would you want your taxes going up by about 4K/year per person (Ive taken out about what is covered by the government already) for socialized care?

Keep in mind that socialized care isnt a free for all where you can get boob jobs and the like for free whenever you want. You still have bureaucrats deciding who gets what treatment.

 

[TheSlamma]

Originally posted by: bamacre
Under the constitution, our government has NO right to be managing healthcare. They don't even have the right to be managing education.

Anyone who thinks it is OK to give the federal government more power than it already has is a moron. We should be cleaning up our federal government, not allowing it to make more messes.

Americans have a government vacuum attached to their wallet, and a gun to their head. This has GOT to change.

:thumbsup:

I love the morons we get that complain about the current government all the time (rightfully) but then think that same government can manage a health system, it's quite laughable.