Have to laugh: GM's Archaic Assembly Line...

[Jumpem]

if you want that money spent on the car you shouldn't be buying GM

Indeed. I would have ethical problems buying a vehicle from a company part owned and operated by the UAW.

 

[JulesMaximus]

rofl yea dude.

I had that impression a while back when I was watching the car factory shows from each manufacturer and I saw all the BMW/Porsche/Audi ones first, after that I watched the Corvette one and lawl'd. No disrespect to the Corvette, it's one of my favorite cars, but the assembly line and the people working there...lol.

Ultimate Factories.

Yeah, I've seen those shows too and the Corvette (ZR1 IIRC) assembly line looked pitiful compared to every other car manufacturer they've showcased and they showcased Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Mercedes, and even Ducati. The Ferrari factory is state of the art.

 

[Jumpem]

Ultimate Factories.

Yeah, I've seen those shows too and the Corvette (ZR1 IIRC) assembly line looked pitiful compared to every other car manufacturer they've showcased and they showcased Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Mercedes, and even Ducati.

All of the foreign manufacturers seem to employ skilled and knowledgeable technicians. The american manufacturers look they just went to the metro area, grabbed a bunch of people from the bus hub, and gave them a wrench.

 

[JulesMaximus]

All of the foreign manufacturers seem to employ skilled and knowledgeable technicians. The american manufacturers look they just went to the metro area, grabbed a bunch of people from the bus hub, and gave them a wrench.

LOL!!! :thumbsup::biggrin:

I noticed that too. Teeth missing, tattoos, horrible speaking skills... You would think that they'd pick some of the more photogenic employees and spruce up the place a bit? Maybe they did though...

 

[mpo]

Volt Assembly at Poletown looks okay here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3dZfvTLbBE&feature=player_embedded

What can I say, it looks like a factory.

 

[justfrank]

Heh, they're actually quite a bit more reliable. "German engineering" is not the same as reliability; many German cars are over-engineered and require frequent, expensive repairs.

Having worked in dealers that sold BMW, MB, Audi and Porsche, I can attest to that. I like those makes but they're costlier to buy, own and generally require more maintenance, repairs than your average US cars. Parts for most imports are also far costlier.
The times I've needed parts for my US made cars, they seem almost free compared to those of my imports.

 

[cliftonite]

Just another Germany ball-washing thread from OP.

 

[NutBucket]

lol atleast now i know who here actually builds a quality product at work..

the OP is mostly right, it doesn't have to have a hardwood floor but a clean production facility is a must.
It's a fundamental lean/5s directive, cleaner produces a higher quality product.

Again, we're talking about mass produced cars, NOT flight hardware.

 

[OS]

LOL dude...toyota told us that.

That's where lean manufacturing comes from.

 

[mafia]

The Phaeton? You mean the car that Volkswagen cancelled in America after 2 years because no one here had any interest in spending $80k base price on a Volkswagen, or $95k+ for the W12 version? Maybe if they hadn't wasted all that money on a fancy looking factory, they could have sold the car for less, and someone might have actually bought one.

Of other interest, I don't see any Beetle or Passat's on that assemby line. Where's the picture of that plant?

The only thing laugh worthy here is how stupid this thread is.

You kidding me? It's because in America people care about the badges. In fact, the Phaeton is better than probably 95% of "luxury branded" cars. The VW Phaeton is a bargain because it is basically a Bentley Continental GT/Flying Spur with VW badges. So your getting a 150k+ car for 80k.

http://jalopnik.com/254379/jalopnik-fantasy-garage-volkswagen-phaeton-w12

http://video.ultimatestreet.com/video/13953/the-new-volkswagen-phaeton (video of Top Gear review)

 

[foghorn67]

LOL dude...toyota told us that.

That's where lean manufacturing comes from.

Lean manufacturing is a bs cult that people think applies to everyone. It works for many, but there are other great schools of thought that bring efficiency to production.
Right now, it's more of a money making scheme for execs to walk into unsuspecting companies and demand outrageous bonuses by coming up with bs metrics. They are called bull$&&! Artists. I have seen it many times.

 

[bryanW1995]

QFT. Honestly, only a bunch of retarded engineers will come up with engine designs like the W8, and only a retarded management will give the a-ok to produce them, like the ones from Volkswagen AG. BMW and Mercedes don't come up with crap like that.

I find this comment hilarious considering that vw made $21 Billion last year. Apparently they have a few non idiots. And GM quality is excellent, generally better than Europeans and other domestics though weaker than Japanese.

 

[mafia]

I find this comment hilarious considering that vw made $21 Billion last year. Apparently they have a few non idiots. And GM reliability is excellent, generally better than Europeans and other domestics though weaker than Japanese.

*fixed*

 

[bryanW1995]

Indeed. I would have ethical problems buying a vehicle from a company part owned and operated by the UAW.

So it's ok to buy a Toyota that is basically Japan motors, inc, but it's not ok to buy an American car because the workers partially own the company? I'm very anti union, but your argument reflects a very poor understanding of the global auto market.

 

[Apex]

Wanna see even more archaic?

No assembly line at all, stuff just sits around, and the poor workers need to physically move themselves around, part to part, station to station:

Pagani:

Koenigsegg:

Spyker:

 

[Jumpem]

So it's ok to buy a Toyota that is basically Japan motors, inc, but it's not ok to buy an American car because the workers partially own the company? I'm very anti union, but your argument reflects a very poor understanding of the global auto market.

I would have trouble purchasing anything that indirectly gives money to the UAW. Other countries internal politics don't concern me. That said, I wouldn't buy a Toyota either.

 

[pcgeek11]

I have been working in the German auto industry for 17 years and I agree the Germans have a way of way over engineering everything they build. This in turn makes it ten times harder to repair/troubleshoot.

 

[Squisher]

Where they build the Cadillacs in that same facility it doesn't look anything like the pics of where they do the Volt. The Cadillac assembly area looks just as modern as any of the pics in of the VW and BMW in the OP.

 

[Doppel]

I have been working in the German auto industry for 17 years and I agree the Germans have a way of way over engineering everything they build. This in turn makes it ten times harder to repair/troubleshoot.

Isn't over-engineer in this context really a kind way of saying badly engineer? A complex approach may solve a problem but if the same problem can be solved simply with a more reliable approach--as if finally figuring out the combination to a lock and everything comes into perspective--that is the better way to do it.

 

[justfrank]

Isn't over-engineer in this context really a kind way of saying badly engineer? A complex approach may solve a problem but if the same problem can be solved simply with a more reliable approach--as if finally figuring out the combination to a lock and everything comes into perspective--that is the better way to do it.

No doubt. With modern BMWs and MBs, one can't even check the oil level with a dipstick anymore. Way over the top.

 

[alphatarget1]

I find this comment hilarious considering that vw made $21 Billion last year. Apparently they have a few non idiots. And GM quality is excellent, generally better than Europeans and other domestics though weaker than Japanese.

Just because they made a lot of money doesn't mean they build reliable products. VWAG and their subsidiaries build a lot of cool cars, but I would never buy a VW because of perceived/actual reliability. Google "Audi intake carbon buildup" and "DSG transmission problems". A fancy factory cannot hide engineering faults in their products.

 

[Ferzerp]

Actually, one could make the argument that they are able to make such a profit but cutting corners and selling their product for more than it's worth based on a reputation that has severely faltered since they began that practice

 

[InfinitySquared]

No doubt. With modern BMWs and MBs, one can't even check the oil level with a dipstick anymore. Way over the top.

Sure, and using a map is better than sat nav, and horses are much better than cars, and flying will never catch on, and that stupid paper stuff, what are they thinking?! Don't even get me started on 'books'. :whiste:

 

[Ferzerp]

Sure, and using a map is better than sat nav, and horses are much better than cars, and flying will never catch on, and that stupid paper stuff, what are they thinking?! Don't even get me started on 'books'. :whiste:

The problem with your analogies are that in the case of a technology failure, we have the lower tech options to fall back on. If there isn't a port for a dipstick, your only option is the tech. Tech and sensors may fail. A dipstick cannot fail. My car still has an oil dipstick, but the tranny has no dipstick (though if I remember correctly, one can be added). That's problematic.

If your gps nav fails, you can always pull out a map. You can't fall back on a dipstick if it doesn't exist though.

 

[justfrank]

Sure, and using a map is better than sat nav, and horses are much better than cars, and flying will never catch on, and that stupid paper stuff, what are they thinking?! Don't even get me started on 'books'. :whiste:

Not long ago I changed oil on a used MB w/o a dipstick. After 20+ minutes, the inst cluster oil level indicator said that not enough time had elapsed in order to check the oil level. Seriously?!

What if you're on a long cruise, stop for gas and want to check your oil? What, wait 1/2 hour or so? A dipstick's easy, the oil's either full (or close) in a few minutes or it's not. Shouldn't ever be more difficult than that and what's the point, so that a Jiffy lube guy won't overfill it as if that's a huge problem?