Have any of the Evolution threads here changed your views?

[FrustratedUser]

Originally posted by: Tominator

You just missed the point. If 100% of our DNA is identical to monkey we would be monkeys.

And maybe you missed mine...There is no credible link from monkey to man. The huge posters in every public school in the United States showing how we evolved from apes is a huge lie! Instead of separation of church and state, we need separation of fact from fiction!

So the similarity in DNS between monkey and human is not proof enough? It is just a coincidence?

 

[Ornery]

"Evolution threads"

Why don't you guys ever have "Origin of life" threads? You jump right past that and start arguing about evolution. Where does LIFE come from? Answer THAT first! Ya can't? Well then, what theories have you got? At this point God is as good a theory as any others.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

They've proven that nobody here can respect anyone else's opinion

nik

 

[Siddhartha]

Originally posted by: Tominator

You just missed the point. If 100% of our DNA is identical to monkey we would be monkeys.

And maybe you missed mine...There is no credible link from monkey to man. The huge posters in every public school in the United States showing how we evolved from apes is a huge lie! Instead of separation of church and state, we need separation of fact from fiction!

Genetically, we are extremely related, compared to snakes, to the apes. The last time I read we share 99% of our DNA sequence with chimps. If you did a genetic based family tree, we primates share a common ancestor. The debate between Creationism and Evolution comes down to how long did it take for everything we see around us to happen. Did it take 10,000 years or billions of years?

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: Dr Smooth

Originally posted by: Tominator

You just missed the point. If 100% of our DNA is identical to monkey we would be monkeys.

And maybe you missed mine...There is no credible link from monkey to man. The huge posters in every public school in the United States showing how we evolved from apes is a huge lie! Instead of separation of church and state, we need separation of fact from fiction!

Genetically, we are extremely related, compared to snakes, to the apes. The last time I read we share 99% of our DNA sequence with chimps. If you did a genetic based family tree, we primates share a common ancestor. The debate between Creationism and Evolution comes down to how long did it take for everything we see around us to happen. Did it take 10,000 years or billions of years?

Incorrect. The Bible clearly states that man was created from the word of God, not evolving from apes.

nik

 

[GtPrOjEcTX]

Originally posted by: FrustratedUser

Originally posted by: Tominator

You just missed the point. If 100% of our DNA is identical to monkey we would be monkeys.

And maybe you missed mine...There is no credible link from monkey to man. The huge posters in every public school in the United States showing how we evolved from apes is a huge lie! Instead of separation of church and state, we need separation of fact from fiction!

So the similarity in DNS between monkey and human is not proof enough? It is just a coincidence?

Proof that we evolved from one to the other? No. How about this idea... Maybe we were just designed/created similar. DNA btw.

 

[jaydee]

Originally posted by: FrustratedUser

Originally posted by: Tominator

You just missed the point. If 100% of our DNA is identical to monkey we would be monkeys.

And maybe you missed mine...There is no credible link from monkey to man. The huge posters in every public school in the United States showing how we evolved from apes is a huge lie! Instead of separation of church and state, we need separation of fact from fiction!

So the similarity in DNS between monkey and human is not proof enough? It is just a coincidence?

My spoon and fork are ~99% similar in chemical composition; therefore forks evolved from spoons?! Oh we even have a missing link: the spork!

 

[Tominator]

I never need to quote the Bible when discussing evolution or how life began. It is obvious science has a lot more to learn before coming to any conclusion that is not refutable using other science.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: LordMaul

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: jspeezy

I have no beef with those who think God created life. I just have a problem with those who consider creationism a science and try to force it into schools.

-BDAWG

I'm not sure why any logical person would want to keep Creationism out of schools? I think since there is obviously a large population of seemingly illusional people arguing based on the bible, that the school is the best place to analyze this popular belief system along with evolution objectively. As if both were just different ways of percieving reality, both just theoretical models, both not 100%proven. This way, starting from a young age kids can see both sides and begin to think critically about the two. Now teaching evolution as pure fact, or teaching "creation science" as pure fact, that I would agree is inherently wrong. Everyone is so paraonoid about "separation of church and state" that they don't even want to bring up the bible in a classroom setting. I think that if the two are looked at as popular, sometimes conflicting theories, that they can be argued down over the years logically, and help to bring about the real truth. Since that is the relation of the two sides, both creationists and evolutionists sincerely want to bring about the truth. What better way to bring about truth than through logical argument? Where both sides are equally taught and equally known by the student, so that the student can deliberate on his/her own? This would really help solve the ignorance problem we have been experiencing on AT these past few days.

Evolution is scientific theory, whereas Creationism is distortion of religious dogma. Not only that, but Creationism focuses upon the Judeo-Christian concept of how the the world was supposedly created, and this promotes favoritism and tacit Federal endorsement of one particular (type of) religion over others. Therefore, Creationism does not belong in public school.

Then, therefore, Evolution doesn't not belong in public schools either. It focuses on athiesm, telling kids that the creation of earth had nothing to do with any sort of God, that God had no part in any of it, and it was all done by random actions of the universe. Therefore, it's Federal endorsement of NOT believing in a religion, meaning athiesm.

actually evolution does not include or exclude god. only the ignorant would make such a statement.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo

Originally posted by: LordMaul

Originally posted by: Astaroth33

Originally posted by: jspeezy

I have no beef with those who think God created life. I just have a problem with those who consider creationism a science and try to force it into schools.

-BDAWG

I'm not sure why any logical person would want to keep Creationism out of schools? I think since there is obviously a large population of seemingly illusional people arguing based on the bible, that the school is the best place to analyze this popular belief system along with evolution objectively. As if both were just different ways of percieving reality, both just theoretical models, both not 100%proven. This way, starting from a young age kids can see both sides and begin to think critically about the two. Now teaching evolution as pure fact, or teaching "creation science" as pure fact, that I would agree is inherently wrong. Everyone is so paraonoid about "separation of church and state" that they don't even want to bring up the bible in a classroom setting. I think that if the two are looked at as popular, sometimes conflicting theories, that they can be argued down over the years logically, and help to bring about the real truth. Since that is the relation of the two sides, both creationists and evolutionists sincerely want to bring about the truth. What better way to bring about truth than through logical argument? Where both sides are equally taught and equally known by the student, so that the student can deliberate on his/her own? This would really help solve the ignorance problem we have been experiencing on AT these past few days.

Evolution is scientific theory, whereas Creationism is distortion of religious dogma. Not only that, but Creationism focuses upon the Judeo-Christian concept of how the the world was supposedly created, and this promotes favoritism and tacit Federal endorsement of one particular (type of) religion over others. Therefore, Creationism does not belong in public school.

Then, therefore, Evolution doesn't not belong in public schools either. It focuses on athiesm, telling kids that the creation of earth had nothing to do with any sort of God, that God had no part in any of it, and it was all done by random actions of the universe. Therefore, it's Federal endorsement of NOT believing in a religion, meaning athiesm.

actually evolution does not include or exclude god. only the ignorant would make such a statement.

You find me a professor who believes in evolution as the sole explanation for the origins of life and I will show you an athiest. And, since professors are *never* bias (

)... he'll always include athiestic ideas into his teaching and disregard anyone who believes differently.

nik

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: Tominator
I never need to quote the Bible when discussing evolution or how life began. It is obvious science has a lot more to learn before coming to any conclusion that is not refutable using other science.

 

[djheater]

Originally posted by: XZeroII
Going either way...from believing in evolution to not, or from not believing to believing. I'm just curious what we've accomplished with probably 10mb of storage space on the server

Often conversations are more about the exchange of ideas than they are about changing ideas....

We can lear a lot by listening, when we choose to hear.

 

[0roo0roo]

You find me a professor who believes in evolution as the sole explanation for the origins of life and I will show you an athiest. And, since professors are *never* bias ( )... he'll always include athiestic ideas into his teaching and disregard anyone who believes differently.

nik

your lack of logic is painful.


all athiests believe in evolution, therefore all people who believe evolution is likely are athiest? false on two notes. not all athiests believe in evolution anyways.


kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.



most professors are religious. therefore they will always include religious ideas into their teachings and disregard anyone who believes differently= false.

what next? all scientists are athiests?

try again little one.

 

[stev0]

imo, by reading the religion threads that go on here, all it has done has just strengthened my beliefs of evolutionism.

 

[dmcowen674]

Schools in Georgia teach creationism and mention that some guy named Darwin had a theory or two.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
your lack of logic is painful.

Okay.

all athiests believe in evolution, therefore all people who believe evolution is likely are athiest? false on two notes. not all athiests believe in evolution anyways.

Okay, there's evolution and there's creationism in the popular theory. If you're not one, you're the other. Those are the only two being taught today.

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.

most professors are religious. therefore they will always include religious ideas into their teachings and disregard anyone who believes differently= false.

Did I say that most professors are religious? No. Where did you get this bit of poo?

what next? all scientists are athiests?

Uh, no. That would mean that no Christian scientist exists because no Christian can be an athiest. Where do you get YOUR logic?

try again little one.

Okay.

nik

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

Jews believe in a god that hasn't come to earth to save them yet

nik

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

Jews believe in a god that hasn't come to earth to save them yet

nik

so now you're claiming Jews and Muslims don't believe in the same God we do, that of David and Moses?

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

Jews believe in a god that hasn't come to earth to save them yet

nik

so now you're claiming Jews and Muslims don't believe in the same God we do, that of David and Moses?

IIRC, the Jewish belief is that Christ wasn't God; that the prophecy hasn't come to pass yet.

Am I confusing them with someone else? That's possible. I'm groggy.

nik

 

[0roo0roo]

Okay, there's evolution and there's creationism in the popular theory. If you're not one, you're the other. Those are the only two being taught today.

sorry, there are the neithers and other theories. its not as black and white as you would like it to be.
besides the fact that you missed the point i was making, which was that not all athiests believe in evolution.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.

err... simple examples: muslims believe in god. muslims are not christian. diests believe in god, diests are not christian. so sorry you are wrong, it was a desperate attempt on your part though.

Did I say that most professors are religious? No. Where did you get this bit of poo?

you said.
Originally posted by Ffmcolbalt
And, since professors are *never* bias ( )... he'll always include athiestic ideas into his teaching and disregard anyone who believes differently.

so pointed out since most professors are religious since most people are religious, using your logic they must include religious ideas into their teachings and disregard anyone who believes differently. its your logic, not mine.

Uh, no. That would mean that no Christian scientist exists because no Christian can be an athiest. Where do you get YOUR logic?

oh wow, you understood your own illogic as illogical. yet you ascribe your illogic to me because i pointed it out. that is some strong denial.

Okay.

nik

did your teacher ever tell you they were tired of trying?



you know, your type of illogic could be seen as bigotry.

 

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

Jews believe in a god that hasn't come to earth to save them yet

nik

so now you're claiming Jews and Muslims don't believe in the same God we do, that of David and Moses?

IIRC, the Jewish belief is that Christ wasn't God; that the prophecy hasn't come to pass yet.

Am I confusing them with someone else? That's possible. I'm groggy.

nik

did i mention Christ in my post? i think not. you can claim that Jews or Muslims are misguided, but denying that they worship the same God is pretty insulting.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

Jews believe in a god that hasn't come to earth to save them yet

nik

so now you're claiming Jews and Muslims don't believe in the same God we do, that of David and Moses?

IIRC, the Jewish belief is that Christ wasn't God; that the prophecy hasn't come to pass yet.

Am I confusing them with someone else? That's possible. I'm groggy.

nik

did i mention Christ in my post? i think not. you can claim that Jews or Muslims are misguided, but denying that they worship the same God is pretty insulting.

Is Christ not God? I think so. What I claim, insulting or not, might be the truth. If they don't accept Christ as their savior and that He died for their sins, they can't be saved. They're worshipping a false hope, maybe? I dunno. Like I said, I'm totally out of it in the middle of my paid vacation. Now, it's quite possible that I'm thinking of another group, but I was pretty sure that it was the jewish culture that believed as such.

nik

 

[BDawg]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

kinda like...
all christians believe in god, therefore all people who believe in god are christian. = false.

All Christians believe in God. All who believe in God are Christians. How is that wrong? Now, if I had said that all Christians believe in a god and all who believe in a god are Christian, I would have been wrong. I guess that makes me right. Again.


nik

you're missing out on the fact that Jews and Muslims belive in the same God, and they would not call themselves Christians. and a lot of Christians wouldn't call Catholics Christian either.

Jews believe in a god that hasn't come to earth to save them yet

nik

so now you're claiming Jews and Muslims don't believe in the same God we do, that of David and Moses?

IIRC, the Jewish belief is that Christ wasn't God; that the prophecy hasn't come to pass yet.

Am I confusing them with someone else? That's possible. I'm groggy.

nik

did i mention Christ in my post? i think not. you can claim that Jews or Muslims are misguided, but denying that they worship the same God is pretty insulting.

Is Christ not God? I think so. What I claim, insulting or not, might be the truth. If they don't accept Christ as their savior and that He died for their sins, they can't be saved. They're worshipping a false hope, maybe? I dunno. Like I said, I'm totally out of it in the middle of my paid vacation. Now, it's quite possible that I'm thinking of another group, but I was pretty sure that it was the jewish culture that believed as such.

nik

The Jews don't need Jesus. They're Gods chosen people. I believe they're saved regardless.

 

[PowerEngineer]

Originally posted by: BDawg
I have changed my views.

Before, I thought that people didn't believe in evolution because of faith. Now, I know they have reasons that make absolutely no sense.

And the difference between "before" and "now" is what? (Sorry...I couldn't stop myself)

More seriously, the problem in all debates between science and religion is their diametrically opposite methods of thought.

In scientific thinking, truth is taken to be the simplest explanation consistant with all the facts. Hopefully it leads to predictions that can be checked. In any event, all it takes is one contrary fact to prove it untrue, and make a new room for a new explanation. In this sense, there is no such thing as absolute scientific truth.

In religious thinking, truth is taken from some unquestionable religious source. No facts are really required. If facts are considered, the believers only accept ones that do not contradict their truth. After all, anything that seemingly contradicts an absolute religious truth can't really be a fact.

This is why "debating" with believers in creationism is essentially futile. Anything presented in favor of evolution can be completely discounted without any real thought on the believer's part. God said it, he believes it, end of story.

Now a scientific thinker must always examine the arguments for creationism. It's just possible that someone might come forward with some new facts that really do debunk evolution. Actually, it happens all the time; that's why the explanation for evolution is being continually modified over time (always trying to better fit the new facts). I expect that the explanation for evolution twenty years from now will be significantly different than what it is today. But that's exactly what makes it science!

Bottom line: there's no real hope of changing many minds -- and no hope at all of changing the minds of the creationists.