Haswell model specs leaked

[ShintaiDK]

Wat.

Are you not familiar with predatory pricing?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predatory_pricing

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robinson%E2%80%93Patman_Act

The act doesnt state in any way that you cant sell your products at low price to everyone. Also the act is US only.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Richland needs to fill in the gap for only 1-2 quarters and then Kaveri will be launched in mobile sector,with much bigger jumps in CPU and GPU performance.

Thats...a very optimistic prediction.

 

[GillyBillyDilly]

In a few years, maybe in 2014, will see Intel vs Nvidia vs AMD vs Samsung vs Qualcomm vs Apple vs Whatever else. Everyone is doing "cpu" and "gpu" now. We will get better products with all that competition. I think.

That is the problem. Intel can't affort competition. They rely on their monopoly. All those fabs, labs, employees. They are structured to supply the whole world. The desktop and server revenues are still goog enough to keep them afloat. But in a few years when ARM chips become good enough for those markets, what then?

 

[ShintaiDK]

That is the problem. Intel can't affort competition. They rely on their monopoly. All those fabs, labs, employees. They are structured to supply the whole world. The desktop and server revenues are still goog enough to keep them afloat. But in a few years when ARM chips become good enough for those markets, what then?

Sofar ARM have always been behind the curve and "never enough". And software aint gonna be less demanding in the future.

 

[itsmydamnation]

Sofar ARM have always been behind the curve and "never enough". And software aint gonna be less demanding in the future.

Really, how many people compain about the perf of there smart phones or andriod tablets/ipad. There seems to be lots of issue inventing here, phone and tablets are largely an information ingesting device there performance has been "adequate" since about the 3GS.

Or better yet what is this "lack" of CPU power stopping?

I cant wait for surface pro, yet im perfectly aware ( part of my job is designing BYOD infrastructure and polices) that my needs are in the vast minority.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Really, how many people compain about the perf of there smart phones or andriod tablets/ipad. There seems to be lots of issue inventing here, phone and tablets are largely an information ingesting device there performance has been "adequate" since about the 3GS.

Or better yet what is this "lack" of CPU power stopping?

I cant wait for surface pro, yet im perfectly aware ( part of my job is designing BYOD infrastructure and polices) that my needs are in the vast minority.

Even Android 4.0 raised the bar and was unable to run on alot of phones. Apps also demands more and more CPU performance. Just like more and more memory is needed.

 

[MightyMalus]

Thats...a very optimistic prediction.

Trinity>Richland seems like a nice jump.(From still unknown reasons, I might add.)

Kaveri tho, is based on steamroller, the gpu is GCN and a lower process.
Its completely "different" than Richland. Its the upgrade, not the update.

The "jump" should not be small, at all. If Richland comes thru, as advertised. I expect Kaveri to perform quite well indeed.

That is the problem. Intel can't affort competition. They rely on their monopoly. All those fabs, labs, employees. They are structured to supply the whole world. The desktop and server revenues are still goog enough to keep them afloat. But in a few years when ARM chips become good enough for those markets, what then?

Chaos!

Hardware won't matter much, in the future, I think. Well, the day that network speeds reach higher levels and become more available to everyone. Wont matter. That's far off, but it will happen. Someday. That's why "online tech" has a future.

In a sense it is already like that, with ARM chips. Tablets for example. If all you do is consume media, browse the internet and don't do anything work related, why get an expensive piece of hardware? Just need a pretty screen and a connection, right?

ARM chips are already pushing 4K resolutions at 30fps. How much can the human eye see? When we get there, "better" hardware will matter even less.

 

[itsmydamnation]

Even Android 4.0 raised the bar and was unable to run on alot of phones. Apps also demands more and more CPU performance. Just like more and more memory is needed.

thats a meaningless generic statement, i could just as easily say android is poorly optimised for those SOC configurations. 3GS and iphone 4 with there single core cortex 8 and 9 run IOS 6 just fine for example.

 

[GillyBillyDilly]

Trinity>

Chaos!

Hardware won't matter much, in the future, I think. Well, the day that network speeds reach higher levels and become more available to everyone. Wont matter. That's far off, but it will happen. Someday. That's why "online tech" has a future.

In a sense it is already like that, with ARM chips. Tablets for example. If all you do is consume media, browse the internet and don't do anything work related, why get an expensive piece of hardware? Just need a pretty screen and a connection, right?

ARM chips are already pushing 4K resolutions at 30fps. How much can the human eye see? When we get there, "better" hardware will matter even less.

Good point.

 

[Homeles]

Thats...a very optimistic prediction.

How so?

Really, how many people compain about the perf of there smart phones or andriod tablets/ipad. There seems to be lots of issue inventing here, phone and tablets are largely an information ingesting device there performance has been "adequate" since about the 3GS.

Or better yet what is this "lack" of CPU power stopping?

I cant wait for surface pro, yet im perfectly aware ( part of my job is designing BYOD infrastructure and polices) that my needs are in the vast minority.

I'd be more than happy to complain to you about my Droid 2. The thing is a piece of garbage that consistently chokes while web browsing. Definitely should have done my research first... could have waited a month and gotten something much better.

 

[ShintaiDK]

How so?

To expect Richland will be replaced after 3-6 months?

 

[inf64]

To expect Richland will be replaced after 3-6 months?

Richland is just a Trinity rebadged (same die, new model number,new codename,clock speed bump-for all intents and purposes it's a same product). So why is it hard to believe AMD will replace what practically is clock bumped Trinity introduced in Q1 2012 with Kaveri in late 2013?

 

[BrightCandle]

In the last few years intel has gone from playing in the >100W category of CPU to releasing a 7W CPU. Its lower power CPU meets or exceeds the performance of the existing solution using less cores, already. They only just got to the lower power category. I dont worry for Intel, I worry for ARM who are aren't prepared for the competition they are about to face.

ARM might be a great design company but they can't get fabs to build whole new capabilities into the silicon to out compete Intel.

ARM processors do when you dont need real performance, but when you do they are the last thing you need. Everyone I know has issues with the smoothness of smart phone interfaces they are a long way from being quick enough. IMO Intel is most likely going to eat ARMs market not the other way around. The only advantage ARM may soon have is that its a more open design that can be modified and SOCs produced more easily.

 

[GillyBillyDilly]

In the last few years intel has gone from playing in the >100W category of CPU to releasing a 7W CPU. Its lower power CPU meets or exceeds the performance of the existing solution using less cores, already. They only just got to the lower power category. I dont worry for Intel, I worry for ARM who are aren't prepared for the competition they are about to face.

ARM might be a great design company but they can't get fabs to build whole new capabilities into the silicon to out compete Intel.

ARM processors do when you dont need real performance, but when you do they are the last thing you need. Everyone I know has issues with the smoothness of smart phone interfaces they are a long way from being quick enough. IMO Intel is most likely going to eat ARMs market not the other way around. The only advantage ARM may soon have is that its a more open design that can be modified and SOCs produced more easily.

I read somewhere the other day that x86 arch has peaked. That's why we have been seeing yearly improvements of only 5-10 percent for the past decade or so, whereas ARM has just started rising and we are seeing yearly improvements of about 100 percent, and if this trend continues it won't be long until they reach acceptable performance for heavy tasks too. So unless Intel has some tricks up it's sleeves, it won't be as simple as you predict to kick off ARM.

 

[Haserath]

I'd be more than happy to complain to you about my Droid 2. The thing is a piece of garbage that consistently chokes while web browsing. Definitely should have done my research first... could have waited a month and gotten something much better.

+1000

Droid 3 isn't any better. Not only is it slow, it crashes quite a bit/reboots automatically sometimes, the camera is awful and the app crashes too...

Why can't they just stick with default android. It's motorola's fault... I tried my brother's Nexus(the first nexus phone), and it was much better.

Stick to stock Android(Nexus devices) or iOS and it will be so much better.

 

[piesquared]

How in the world is intel going to compete with Qualcomm in the smartphone market? Once they figure that out, they'll have the daunting, impossible task of taking on...Samsung.

 

[Nemesis 1]

How in the world is intel going to compete with Qualcomm in the smartphone market? Once they figure that out, they'll have the daunting, impossible task of taking on...Samsung.

What year you living in . everone here allready knows how medfield performs. Stunning first phone by intel . OK now go back to sleep

 

[Acanthus]

The act doesn't state in any way that you cant sell your products at low price to everyone. Also the act is US only.

Pretty much every nation in the EU has a variation of the same law.

Selling products at a price near or below cost to destroy competition is anticompetitive.

It would be easy to prove for Intel because the company has a policy with minimum margins to determine entering / exiting a market.

 

[Haserath]

I read somewhere the other day that x86 arch has peaked. That's why we have been seeing yearly improvements of only 5-10 percent for the past decade or so, whereas ARM has just started rising and we are seeing yearly improvements of about 100 percent, and if this trend continues it won't be long until they reach acceptable performance for heavy tasks too. So unless Intel has some tricks up it's sleeves, it won't be as simple as you predict to kick off ARM.

Except x86 is ahead of them. They already have all of the performance features, so they can focus on reducing power while keeping performance.

Hence active idle states and platform power reductions with Windows 8 and Haswell.

To expect Richland will be replaced after 3-6 months?

AMD needs a faster release cycles to catch up. Their APU is only competitive to Intel if they keep their graphics faster. Otherwise, it's a waste.

 

[Nemesis 1]

That is the problem. Intel can't affort competition. They rely on their monopoly. All those fabs, labs, employees. They are structured to supply the whole world. The desktop and server revenues are still goog enough to keep them afloat. But in a few years when ARM chips become good enough for those markets, what then?

COMPLETE and Utter Nonsense, People say I speak jibberish. Intel can pull this off only if its superior product. This isn't about X86 anymoe -what year is this? Intel is covering the entire market in 2013 with 2 cores Haswell and Silvermont. Thats just the facts , Intel is pulling a henry Ford

 

[piesquared]

What year you living in . everone here allready knows how medfield performs. Stunning first phone by intel . OK now go back to sleep

OK, done! Thanks that was refreshing. Samsung isn't just producing chips like the Exnyos 5 Octa, which they introduced at an event that just finished with Bill Clinton, they own their entire hardware ecosystem. Coming soon with bendable displays! Noone will be able to touch that, and no doubt Samsung won't be keen to license that tech out in the near term. Intel will have to rely on sky high margins to fund these multibillion dollar projects. Their margins will surely begin to fall.

Another interesting aspect is AMD, Samsung, Qualcomm, ARM, Texas Instruments, MediaTek, and imagination being founding members of HSA.

 

[piesquared]

COMPLETE and Utter Nonsense, People say I speak jibberish. Intel can pull this off only if its superior product. This isn't about X86 anymoe -what year is this? Intel is covering the entire market in 2013 with 2 cores Haswell and Silvermont. Thats just the facts , Intel is pulling a henry Ford

Wasn't silvermont delayed to 2014?

 

[Nemesis 1]

Wasn't silvermont delayed to 2014?

Hay . You believe whatever you want thats fine , Its a good delivery. Dream about anti competive . The 2core haswell is a low cost SoC design . Dream away about 1 variant of a cheap going into highend desktop . Completely differant chip using haswell cores

 

[GillyBillyDilly]

COMPLETE and Utter Nonsense

I like such posts.

Considering all pros and cons for both sides, I would say they have both equal chances for the future. It will only come down to execution, execution and execution. Give a genius dirt and he will make it into gold.

 

[ShintaiDK]

Pretty much every nation in the EU has a variation of the same law.

Selling products at a price near or below cost to destroy competition is anticompetitive.

It would be easy to prove for Intel because the company has a policy with minimum margins to determine entering / exiting a market.

No its not. And there is nothing in your links that even suggest its even remotely illegal.

If Intel wants to sell every 1$ 3770Ks they can do it and its within the law. What they cant do is demand some terms with the low price. Like dont try and sell any AMD or ARM CPUs.