GUYS THE BTX COOLER RUMORS ARE TRUE!!!

[LifeStealer]

RDRAM failed to older "upgraded" SDRAM technology. I suspect BTX will as well.

Prescots have their place, there are things it does better than the AMDs and its a good thing they do I don't want to be stuck with just one proccessor maker again. But let Intel back a dead horse, thats fine by me. They would be much better off investing the BTX money into more proccessor research. Especially after the 10 billion dollar plant renivation they are currently doing in Arizona.

 

[GuinnessExtraStout]

From what I understand, since intel has abandoned the Prescott as getting any more updates to their clockspeed and is going to multicore next year, those BTX formfactor are unnecessary.
Why buy one of those monstrosities for a max 3.8 ghz prescott now when there will never even be a 4 ghz prescott in the future to replace it with? The whole BTX thing is looking like a giant dead end. One that Intel abandoned right before it got too far into it, and is happy to let the people who think it is still the way to go just follow that dead road to nowhere.
Really gigantic hatsinks and fans are just retarded. Ever heard of water cooling intel?

 

[LifeStealer]

Water cooling is years from being "mainstream." I see PC makers using fridge coolers before water, safer for the average joe.

 

[GuinnessExtraStout]

Originally posted by: LifeStealer
Water cooling is years from being "mainstream." I see PC makers using fridge coolers before water, safer for the average joe.

you mean freon? little more dangerous than water no?

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: GuinnessExtraStout

Originally posted by: LifeStealer
Water cooling is years from being "mainstream." I see PC makers using fridge coolers before water, safer for the average joe.

you mean freon? little more dangerous than water no?

Is it Freon in refrigeration? Even if it is, water is much more deadly to electronics.

 

[LifeStealer]

Originally posted by: GuinnessExtraStout

Originally posted by: LifeStealer
Water cooling is years from being "mainstream." I see PC makers using fridge coolers before water, safer for the average joe.

you mean freon? little more dangerous than water no?

Water involves more parts. More parts = much greater chance of problems. Phase change and systems like it can be seperated from the case and built so that you only have a duct running up. Mobo protection would shut the board off if the phase change wasn't performing correctly. Must easier than water, just costs more. Besides, water can't cool much better than air it just moves the heat more effectively.

 

[stevty2889]

Strap a couple of those beasts to your case, and your computer will fly...!!!

 

[Zebo]

Whats going to happen when dothan comes? BTX still? this chip supposed be even cooler than A64 90nm! At 2.0Ghz or below can be passive cooled with copper. BTX less needed then.... Personally I can't wait if/when dothan comes to desktop. While it's FPU is'nt the strongest it's gaming perfromance is better than A64 at same speed and that's all I really need these super duper processors for. dual channel, 800mhz bus it, add 64 and this puppy can only get better performing.

I just can't believe Intel continuing these heat meisters and dual coreing them even this year!! BTX fad or here to stay?

 

[Vee]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Whats going to happen when dothan comes? BTX still? this chip supposed be even cooler than A64 90nm! At 2.0Ghz or below can be passive cooled with copper. BTX less needed then.... Personally I can't wait if/when dothan comes to desktop. While it's FPU is'nt the strongest it's gaming perfromance is better than A64 at same speed and that's all I really need these super duper processors for. dual channel, 800mhz bus it, add 64 and this puppy can only get better performing.

I just can't believe Intel continuing these heat meisters and dual coreing them even this year!! BTX fad or here to stay?

Dothan has some colossal performance flaws. Even much worse than the original Willamette P4 when it entered the stage. For all the fuzz about it, it's really not worth considering for a desktop PC. I'd rather have a big heatsink and solid performance throughout. I think you'll have to wait out next iteration of cores from Intel. Meanwhile, there's no shortage of good CPUs on the market.

But I, too, am very sceptical to BTX. Even if it takes on, there's a good chance it will be obsolete again, before ATX.

 

[InlineFive]

The heatsink is moderately cool but 126CFM on a 92mm fan is going to be awful.

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Vee

Originally posted by: Zebo
Whats going to happen when dothan comes? BTX still? this chip supposed be even cooler than A64 90nm! At 2.0Ghz or below can be passive cooled with copper. BTX less needed then.... Personally I can't wait if/when dothan comes to desktop. While it's FPU is'nt the strongest it's gaming perfromance is better than A64 at same speed and that's all I really need these super duper processors for. dual channel, 800mhz bus it, add 64 and this puppy can only get better performing.

I just can't believe Intel continuing these heat meisters and dual coreing them even this year!! BTX fad or here to stay?

Dothan has some colossal performance flaws. Even much worse than the original Willamette P4 when it entered the stage. For all the fuzz about it, it's really not worth considering for a desktop PC. I'd rather have a big heatsink and solid performance throughout. I think you'll have to wait out next iteration of cores from Intel. Meanwhile, there's no shortage of good CPUs on the market.

But I, too, am very sceptical to BTX. Even if it takes on, there's a good chance it will be obsolete again, before ATX.

Ya, the Dothan has been way overhyped. It is as good as A64 in some things, but in others it simply sucks in comparison. It's akin to K6-2 vs PII, with Dothan being the K6-2 and A64 being PII.

 

[Duvie]

If you look at the design it is truly more efficient. Since we design cases with the intent to pull in from front and exhaust out back, we are already establishing an air flow pattern. I have always thought the way heatsinks work either suck or blow methods are competing against this air movement, which is terribly inefficient....

That being said, I will be reluctant to swap to a new form factor anyways. ATX is fine, at least for my amd cpu it is.

Intel should spend more time developing better strained silicon and SOI processes like AMD and drop the mhz and get the IPC up. AMD went the right route, and now has room to grow.

 

[erikvanvelzen]

Guys, you are overseeing one thing: one of the most important goals of BTX is to decrease the size of your case by placing al the parts closer together with by a more efficient layout. The new BTX board are/will be smaller than ATX. I think this is a good thing. BTX also reduces cable clutter in the case (this is arguable, but I does, though not much).

 

[jm0ris0n]

Those are two scary beasts. I thought the point of oem heatsinks was to be cheap and get the job done. This sink does not look cheap !

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: erikvanvelzen
Guys, you are overseeing one thing: one of the most important goals of BTX is to decrease the size of your case by placing al the parts closer together with by a more efficient layout. The new BTX board are/will be smaller than ATX. I think this is a good thing. BTX also reduces cable clutter in the case (this is arguable, but I does, though not much).

How does it reduce cable clutter? The same cables will still be there, and if I want small I would buy a mATX or even Flex.

BTX is here for NO other reason that intel can;t make a CPU (P4 prescott) that does not run like a small space heater.

 

[Zebo]

Vee, "collosal" is'nt that a bit strong. What do you mean exactly? From what I have seen dothan @2.6 hangs with FX55 and I for one am happy to see Intel concentrating on IPC instead of marketing gimmicks like P4.

 

[Vette73]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Vee, "collosal" is'nt that a bit strong. What do you mean exactly? From what I have seen dothan @2.6 hangs with FX55 and I for one am happy to see Intel concentrating on IPC instead of marketing gimmicks like P4.

Well the 2.1Ghz P-M is around the fastest Intel has said they will release this year and it cost almost as much as a FX55, yet you HAVE to overclock the P-M just to HANG with the FX55 in SOME areas, I don;t think AMD has anything to worry about.

 

[boshuter]

Originally posted by: Shimmishim
once again you guys are proving to be a forum full of AMD fanboys...

everyone knows the prescott runs hot... any reason why people have to keep beating this point into everyone over and over again???

if amd released a processor that ran HOTTER than a prescott, would we see everyone on this forum crying... "OMG AMD PROCESSORS RUN SO HOT!!" of course not... i'm sure there'd be tons of people that'd back up amd saying stuff like... "well it's necessary blah blah blah"

put yourself into wingznuts shoes... i don't blame him at all for standing up for intel (yes he works there) but still...

my last 4 or so systems ahve been AMD but i'm realy getting tired of reading all these "prescott's run hot" threads... everyone knows that... but have you guys seen what sort of damage a 5 ghz prescott can do? go check out xtremesystems.org... at least those guys don't constantly cry and whine about prescott's running so hot...

can't we discuss something like the dual core amd chips that are just around the corner? or even the dual gpu video cards that are coming out soon?

This used to be a good forum for overclockers....... you could actualy find some intelligent discussion no matter what your preference was...... that has changed a LOT. Try finding one post about an Intel and you have all the AMD fanboys spouting the same crap over and over. It's especially pitiful when they are Elite and Life members doing most of the spouting. Who cares what you want to run? I see these "life" members taking every opportunity to say how hot the Prescotts run...... Hmmm..... I notice some even run water to cool thier A64 3000's.... what's up with that? I have 2 prescott's running at over 4ghz and I don't need water to cool them. I seriously considered going with an FX55 when I built my last system but went with the 3.6e lga775 just so I would't be lumped in with this new AMD crowd. I enjoy reading about overclocking both AMD and Intel, I just don't understand why they have this attitude that what they have is somehow better and if you don't have that you don't deserve the same respect they demand.

 

[TheStu]

One point I was trying to make a while ago about the BTX and AMD adopting it is the simple fact that is if Intel does push BTX which it looks like it may, the motherboard manufacturers will need to adopt their designs... as will the case manufacturers... I don't know how feasible it will be to make an ATX/BTX form factor case. And if you looked at Anands article on the BTX form factor case / mobo / and CPU the temps are about the same if not lower and that is with one fan cooling the North Bridge, GPU and Proc (the GPU I'm sure has its own fan as well but running some more air across it can't hurt. Yes as of right now the layout is funky but every mbo maker has their own spin of board layout within architectural constraints and therefore some of those issues can be overcome. If BTX takes off AMD would have to choose between essntially asking the case / PSU (I think the main mobo connector is different but that can probably be solved with an adapter) / and Motherboard manufacturers to make two different form factor products... especially the case manufactures... that was the point I was trying to make.

Yes AMD has been kicking 40 different kinds of ass right now and Intel appears to be stagnating but hey wasn't it reversed a few years ago?

 

[The J]

Would there even be a point to getting any aftermarket heatsinks for BTX? The way the thermal module was designed, it seems that manufacturers couldn't really do much different with it. Intel has a metal spiral in a box; ThermalTake has fins in a box. Does that really matter?

With that said, is BTX really bad? What does it matter WHY Intel wants people to adopt it, it makes for cooler-running and quieter systems. That sounds good to me. I'm sure AMD can find a motherboard arrangment they can use while at least keeping the motherboard's ability to fit well inside a BTX case. I may not be buying a BTX form-factor comoputer anytime soon, but it's not like it insulted your mother and kicked your dog or anything like that.

 

[Vee]

Originally posted by: Zebo
Vee, "collosal" is'nt that a bit strong. What do you mean exactly? From what I have seen dothan @2.6 hangs with FX55 and I for one am happy to see Intel concentrating on IPC instead of marketing gimmicks like P4.

You sometimes see the Dothan perform 3-5 times slower than P4C/E or A64.
I think this is due to it's origin as a mobile CPU. Some parts are bottlenecking when you put it into a power environment of fast DDR ram and fast hd drives.

And I agree. This is the the basis for Intel's future. But Dothan isn't, IMO, just it, yet.

I know you're an overclocker hobbyist. That's fine. But from my perspective 2.6GHz is not reasonable. I don't want to turn this into a OC debate. But I and lots of people need the engineered in proper margins. Just as I don't think the last few % performance of the top CPUs are worth the price asked, I also don't think the few% increased performance from OC is worth the risk.

OC may be fine for game only.
But I cannot accept the possibility of that some of my data or system becomes corrupted from processor errors, especially not if I don't know or don't notice. Not even Prime95 is a good enough test. I'm convinced Intel's and AMD's testing is far more exhaustive and reliable. ...- And because of my background, I firmly believe in proper margins.

So the grapevine buzz of one or other CPU's "overclockability" doesn't concern me (and many others) the least. What's important is what speed the manufacturer thinks it should run at. And as others have already noticed, Dothan is expensive. It's not competitive as desktop CPU with either P4 or A64.

 

[Avalon]

Originally posted by: boshuter

Originally posted by: Shimmishim
once again you guys are proving to be a forum full of AMD fanboys...

everyone knows the prescott runs hot... any reason why people have to keep beating this point into everyone over and over again???

if amd released a processor that ran HOTTER than a prescott, would we see everyone on this forum crying... "OMG AMD PROCESSORS RUN SO HOT!!" of course not... i'm sure there'd be tons of people that'd back up amd saying stuff like... "well it's necessary blah blah blah"

put yourself into wingznuts shoes... i don't blame him at all for standing up for intel (yes he works there) but still...

my last 4 or so systems ahve been AMD but i'm realy getting tired of reading all these "prescott's run hot" threads... everyone knows that... but have you guys seen what sort of damage a 5 ghz prescott can do? go check out xtremesystems.org... at least those guys don't constantly cry and whine about prescott's running so hot...

can't we discuss something like the dual core amd chips that are just around the corner? or even the dual gpu video cards that are coming out soon?

This used to be a good forum for overclockers....... you could actualy find some intelligent discussion no matter what your preference was...... that has changed a LOT. Try finding one post about an Intel and you have all the AMD fanboys spouting the same crap over and over. It's especially pitiful when they are Elite and Life members doing most of the spouting. Who cares what you want to run? I see these "life" members taking every opportunity to say how hot the Prescotts run...... Hmmm..... I notice some even run water to cool thier A64 3000's.... what's up with that? I have 2 prescott's running at over 4ghz and I don't need water to cool them. I seriously considered going with an FX55 when I built my last system but went with the 3.6e lga775 just so I would't be lumped in with this new AMD crowd. I enjoy reading about overclocking both AMD and Intel, I just don't understand why they have this attitude that what they have is somehow better and if you don't have that you don't deserve the same respect they demand.

I'm not sure why you were expecting an intelligent discussion in here with a thread subtitled "Intel's new monster!"

 

[zakee00]

yeah i think i made too big of a deal out of it lol, sorry

 

[The Boston Dangler]

I can't wait for BTX. It's the next logical step in PC evolution. Yes, Intel is trying to deal with hotter than hot (inefficient) chips. But overall it's a step forward. After carefully looking over available BTX info, there's very little I don't like. Less fans equals less cost, less noise, less power consumption, and less failures. Intel is including power management technologies, but a more efficient chip is needed, not band-aids. A cooler chip combined with a passively cooled video card and IT'S ON! I have a 2500 Barton at 2.2 GHz, case and chip even at 25F above room temp. My current box runs great, even better for the money, but it sounds like a helicopter full of vacuum cleaners and hair driers.

 

[AkumaX]

you guys are looking at this the wrong way: don't you WANT a cooler this big on your A64? think of how high you can o/c it on air!!!!