Got Back from Japan

[Passions]

Originally posted by: Narmer

We ugly Americans are the ones keeping the peace so show some respect when we ask why our young men and women should die for your country and why you can't talk with your neighbors, let alone your own ally?

I have to ask, Narmer, how old are you and what is your nationality?

 

[Mo0o]

There's nothing left to say, the gf's father already thinks he's a jackass, the damage is done.

 

[bennylong]

Originally posted by: Dacalo

Originally posted by: Narmer
BTW, are all East Asians like the Japanese?

Do East Asians like Japanese? If I put it bluntly no. It's more directed toward politicians and the nation itself, rather than individuals.

Japanese are as popular in East Asians as American are in the Middle East.

 

[The Green Bean]

Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
Sounds like you had a great trip. I would love to visit Japan.

 

[Journer]

i didnt read any post other than OP:

anyways...OP your a moron...he prolly hates you now and thinks your an ass. on the other hand, Japan rocks, i cant wait till i get to go.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: Eghck

Originally posted by: deathkoba

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: deathkoba

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: deathkoba
Here's a clue from your local ATJap: Most Japanese people do not talk politics, not even older generations and quite frankly don't understand how it affects them. Most people are too immersed in their utopia surroundings that such reality does not exist. You've probably came across as a total ass and he's probably thinking that there's something seriously wrong with you in all honesty.

He's not an ass. He's a really great man but, like you said, they never talk politics and he was born in 1934 so he took no part in the war but he felt it greatly because of his family. But, to me, it's unforgivable considering how imperial Japan acted and why these people don't want to discuss it with their neighbors. It's sad for them to move forward on the political front.

I said YOU came across as an ass to him. In fact most would.

Well, he apologized profusely afterwards. I may be an ass but I could see that this is something that's been bothering him for quite a long time. Besides, Japanese people are in a serious need of discussing these things. I will try to be direct towards any Japanese I meet in the future.

I guess you still don't get it. He apologized because he didn't like you. They aren't direct and often express the opposite of what you might be thinking. Dumbass.

I would listen to deathkoba. It would probably be better for you NOT to confront them on issues that may be sensitive to them.

Originally posted by: Narmer
You don't even know the man I'm talking about and yet you're so passionate about it. This guy may be a great person but he's very un-Japanese in many ways. And if you think I'm such a dumbass, it isn't my people who are getting kidnapped by a third-world sh!thole lead by a paranoid leader named Kim Jung-Il. You know what your Japanese leaders do when they kidnap Japanese people, your leaders get on all fours, kowtows to Lil Kim, and begs him to release your people. What kind of sh!t is that? HE'S KIDNAPPING JAPANESE CIVILIANS AND YOU CAN'T DO SH!T ABOUT IT. And I'm the dumbass for discussing the obvious? Well, it this shows what he meant when he said that today's Japanese just care about themselves and not their country. You're an example of that.

Its possible he apologized to you for getting getting angry but its also possible he doesn't like to talk about those things. Even if it is obvious, doesn't mean it can't be uncomftorable for someone. I just think in general, you taking a direct approach towards brigning up those subjects may get you started on the wrong foot with certain people.

You may be right but my interest isn't in making people feel good. It's in discussing genuine concerns. I've never gotten the opinion of real Japanese and I wanted to while I was there, irreguardless of their way. I wanted to know how they felt about these things because it's so important. Japan really needs to reform its constitution and take a more active role in it's own security. A good friend of mine is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations, and they supported a more assertive Japan in one of their Foreign Affairs articles two or three years. I hope the next American Administration takes that seriously.

I like Japan. My opinion to my gf's father was that America and Japan should become equals. This will help both nations deal with the emerging power in the region, China. Whether or not they like to talk politics, if they don't address these issues, someone else will for them.

:roll:

wtf is irreguardless?

also, mb educate yourself a bit before making such comments. you obviously know very little about asian culture.

japan does not have a military because the US didn't want them to arm themselves after WWII. not a bad thought overall.

it's not like japan can change that on their own. it's not like you talking about it is going to change things.

also, it's amazing how arrogant you are being, do you honestly think you are the only person in all of japan that has ever had some of the thoughts you have? they have all been thought out and discussed and they also realize the problems are MUCH more complicated than you understand them to be.

basically you are ignorant made some oversimplified comments and insulted your father in law.

way to go.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: Dacalo

Originally posted by: Narmer
BTW, are all East Asians like the Japanese?

Do East Asians like Japanese? If I put it bluntly no. It's more directed toward politicians and the nation itself, rather than individuals.

wrong question, narmer was asking if all East Asians are LIKE (similar to) japanese and not whether or not east asians like (have good feelings toward) japanese.

and the answer to Narmers question is, China -> Korea -> Japan.

that is the lineage of japanese culture. so yes, the three countries are very similar.

you take an educated korean and an educated japanese and most any chinese person that can read his own language and they can communicate in written chinese. both korean and japanese languages are based on chinese. a decently educated korean person in korea will know in excess of 10,000 chinese characters. i believe it is very similar in japan.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: deathkoba

Originally posted by: Narmer

Originally posted by: deathkoba
Here's a clue from your local ATJap: Most Japanese people do not talk politics, not even older generations and quite frankly don't understand how it affects them. Most people are too immersed in their utopia surroundings that such reality does not exist. You've probably came across as a total ass and he's probably thinking that there's something seriously wrong with you in all honesty.

He's not an ass. He's a really great man but, like you said, they never talk politics and he was born in 1934 so he took no part in the war but he felt it greatly because of his family. But, to me, it's unforgivable considering how imperial Japan acted and why these people don't want to discuss it with their neighbors. It's sad for them to move forward on the political front.

I said YOU came across as an ass to him. In fact most would.

Well, he apologized profusely afterwards. I may be an ass but I could see that this is something that's been bothering him for quite a long time. Besides, Japanese people are in a serious need of discussing these things. I will try to be direct towards any Japanese I meet in the future.

right, maybe you should go to china and hand some of this book out
http://www.amazon.com/Mao-Story-Jung-Chang/dp/0679422714
since a good number don't know what a total monster he was (on par with hitler and stalin) and frankly still see him as a good man.

like it or not japan is a free country, they can have debate and publish books etc. in china, they censor even google, never mind the journalists and dissidents in jail. never mind they took billions in low/no interest loans/grants from the japanese to build their country and still oppress their people.

 

[Aikouka]

You know what's always bothered me and it seems to inherently come up when discussing Japan's involvement in WW2 (not the mainland Asia portion 😛). A lot of people seem to believe that Japan was entirely unprovoked. If you go back about 100 years before the start of World War 2, you will find your answer to why they hated America so much (still having a bit of trouble; Google "Commodore Perry"). If you say, "Well, that was a 100 years ago!" Realize who you're talking about... a country full of pride that was stomped on and bullied by a larger more powerful nation (i.e. the US). It's pretty obvious that the brash actions 100 years earlier left a mark... a scar if you will.

Oh and now I know what to do in Osaka! Oh, I'm a bit interested in that Skyline thing.. as long as it's not the horrid G35... that car is NOT a Skyline. I can't wait for the GT-R to come back in 2007 (2008 for us over here).

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: Aikouka
You know what's always bothered me and it seems to inherently come up when discussing Japan's involvement in WW2 (not the mainland Asia portion 😛). A lot of people seem to believe that Japan was entirely unprovoked. If you go back about 100 years before the start of World War 2, you will find your answer to why they hated America so much (still having a bit of trouble; Google "Commodore Perry"). If you say, "Well, that was a 100 years ago!" Realize who you're talking about... a country full of pride that was stomped on and bullied by a larger more powerful nation (i.e. the US). It's pretty obvious that the brash actions 100 years earlier left a mark... a scar if you will.

Oh and now I know what to do in Osaka! Oh, I'm a bit interested in that Skyline thing.. as long as it's not the horrid G35... that car is NOT a Skyline. I can't wait for the GT-R to come back in 2007 (2008 for us over here).

ya, that's great justification. :roll:

people on this thread are saying, oh ya, we should just forgive and forget what japan did during the war (killing 10's of millions of CIVILIANS) and this happened only 70 yrs ago, and yet japan can justify their actions during the war because of what perry did 100 yrs before that?

:roll:

you must be japanese.

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: Aikouka
You know what's always bothered me and it seems to inherently come up when discussing Japan's involvement in WW2 (not the mainland Asia portion 😛). A lot of people seem to believe that Japan was entirely unprovoked. If you go back about 100 years before the start of World War 2, you will find your answer to why they hated America so much (still having a bit of trouble; Google "Commodore Perry"). If you say, "Well, that was a 100 years ago!" Realize who you're talking about... a country full of pride that was stomped on and bullied by a larger more powerful nation (i.e. the US). It's pretty obvious that the brash actions 100 years earlier left a mark... a scar if you will.

Oh and now I know what to do in Osaka! Oh, I'm a bit interested in that Skyline thing.. as long as it's not the horrid G35... that car is NOT a Skyline. I can't wait for the GT-R to come back in 2007 (2008 for us over here).

ya, that's great justification. :roll:

people on this thread are saying, oh ya, we should just forgive and forget what japan did during the war (killing 10's of millions of CIVILIANS) and this happened only 70 yrs ago, and yet japan can justify their actions during the war because of what perry did 100 yrs before that?

:roll:

you must be japanese.

yeah, last time i check Perry didn't launch babies into the air to use as target practice after he landed in japan

 

[Aikouka]

Actually, my heritage is German and Irish (drunken nazi?) and I've lived in this country for my entire life as have many generations of my family before me. Just because I don't take my country's side in something they did does not mean I am one of "them."

If you'd actually look up what happened, it's kind of funny in a way. America tried to control the trade of another country... just like England tried to control our trade (or more specifically, the tariffs). Double standards? No way, this is America, we make the %#$ing standards.

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: Aikouka
Actually, my heritage is German and Irish (drunken nazi?) and I've lived in this country for my entire life as have many generations of my family before me. Just because I don't take my country's side in something they did does not mean I am one of "them."

If you'd actually look up what happened, it's kind of funny in a way. America tried to control the trade of another country... just like England tried to control our trade (or more specifically, the tariffs). Double standards? No way, this is America, we make the %#$ing standards.

i would say japan overreacted just a little bit.

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: Mo0o
i would say japan overreacted just a little bit.

Eh, I'm not saying that what they did was the best course of action, but I don't think it was entirely unjustified as many people may think. I don't know what their leaders thought, but I know that they gave in to America's demands back in the 1800's, because they knew they didn't have the power to force the Americans out (and America refused to leave). It's quite possible that their plan was to wait for the right moment to attack, I don't know. If that was the case, that may've been why it was 100 years later as we were spread out in Europe fighting the Nazi front and Japan may've suspected that we were too busy to fight on two fronts entirely. Thus providing the best time to retaliate.

Like I said, I don't know what their leaders thought, but that'd seem the most logical to me. Personally, I prefer less violent approaches 😛.

 

[Feldenak]

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: Mo0o
i would say japan overreacted just a little bit.

Eh, I'm not saying that what they did was the best course of action, but I don't think it was entirely unjustified as many people may think. I don't know what their leaders thought, but I know that they gave in to America's demands back in the 1800's, because they knew they didn't have the power to force the Americans out (and America refused to leave). It's quite possible that their plan was to wait for the right moment to attack, I don't know. If that was the case, that may've been why it was 100 years later as we were spread out in Europe fighting the Nazi front and Japan may've suspected that we were too busy to fight on two fronts entirely. Thus providing the best time to retaliate.

Like I said, I don't know what their leaders thought, but that'd seem the most logical to me. Personally, I prefer less violent approaches 😛.

Umm...the US didn't get directly involved in WWII until after Pearl Harbor.

 

[Aikouka]

Ahh true, good call 😛. After awhile, all that history turns into a huge jumbled mess. So if you see me talking about Kennedy and the Teapot Dome Scandal, it's more jumbled-ness 😛.

But based on that, they probably thought they had accrued enough forces to actually do something... which they umm kind of did if you count killing Sunday School picnics many years later 😛.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: Mo0o
i would say japan overreacted just a little bit.

Eh, I'm not saying that what they did was the best course of action, but I don't think it was entirely unjustified as many people may think. I don't know what their leaders thought, but I know that they gave in to America's demands back in the 1800's, because they knew they didn't have the power to force the Americans out (and America refused to leave). It's quite possible that their plan was to wait for the right moment to attack, I don't know. If that was the case, that may've been why it was 100 years later as we were spread out in Europe fighting the Nazi front and Japan may've suspected that we were too busy to fight on two fronts entirely. Thus providing the best time to retaliate.

Like I said, I don't know what their leaders thought, but that'd seem the most logical to me. Personally, I prefer less violent approaches 😛.

I'm pretty sure most of China, Korea, and S.E. Asia think it was pretty unjustified. There is a reason the Chinese go batsh!t crazy every time a Japanese PM visits the Yasukuni Shrine.

Japan attacked the US because we were standing in their way to creating an Asian empire uner their rule. This endeavor was euphemistically known as the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. The attack on Pearl Harbor and our other Pacific positions was an attempt to remove our influence from the region and compell us to resume shipments of strategic materials Japan needed to complete it's conquest (mostly oil and steel).

 

[Descartes]

You sound like an ass. You fit the stereotypical perception of Americans as presumptuous, arrogant and exceedingly nationalistic. Congratulations for offending your gf's father in a country in which you were a guest; I seriously can't even fathom having the audacity to act as you have to your hosts in a foreign country.

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Descartes
You sound like an ass. You fit the stereotypical perception of Americans as presumptuous, arrogant and exceedingly nationalistic. Congratulations for offending your gf's father in a country in which you were a guest; I seriously can't even fathom having the audacity to act as you have to your hosts in a foreign country.

As far as the OP is concerned, I would have to agree.

It is important to know when to shut your cake hole when traveling abroad.

 

[randomlinh]

drrr... since when was the TL an accord?

 

[Aikouka]

Originally posted by: K1052
I'm pretty sure most of China, Korea, and S.E. Asia think it was pretty unjustified. There is a reason the Chinese go batsh!t crazy every time a Japanese PM visits the Yasukuni Shrine.

Japan attacked the US because we were standing in their way to creating an Asian empire uner their rule. This endeavor was euphemistically known as the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. The attack on Pearl Harbor and our other Pacific positions was an attempt to remove our influence from the region and compell us to resume shipments of strategic materials Japan needed to complete it's conquest (mostly oil and steel)

I thought I mentioned that I wasn't discussing the Asian portion with my reasoning, especially since my reasoning wouldn't even apply to them 😛.

Also, your reasoning sounds awkward (not saying it's necessarily wrong)... but why would a nation that has fought in the past simply buckle down after having a single installation bombed? That makes less sense than a wookie on Endor (gotta keep it a little zany to avoid this becoming a P&N matter 😛)!

 

[Mo0o]

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: K1052
I'm pretty sure most of China, Korea, and S.E. Asia think it was pretty unjustified. There is a reason the Chinese go batsh!t crazy every time a Japanese PM visits the Yasukuni Shrine.

Japan attacked the US because we were standing in their way to creating an Asian empire uner their rule. This endeavor was euphemistically known as the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. The attack on Pearl Harbor and our other Pacific positions was an attempt to remove our influence from the region and compell us to resume shipments of strategic materials Japan needed to complete it's conquest (mostly oil and steel)

I thought I mentioned that I wasn't discussing the Asian portion with my reasoning, especially since my reasoning wouldn't even apply to them 😛.

Also, your reasoning sounds awkward (not saying it's necessarily wrong)... but why would a nation that has fought in the past simply buckle down after having a single installation bombed? That makes less sense than a wookie on Endor (gotta keep it a little zany to avoid this becoming a P&N matter 😛)!

did you ever study any of this? japan was trying to cripple the US's pacifc fleet in 1 strike because they knew they couldn't beat the US navy in a prolonged war

 

[K1052]

Originally posted by: Aikouka

Originally posted by: K1052
I'm pretty sure most of China, Korea, and S.E. Asia think it was pretty unjustified. There is a reason the Chinese go batsh!t crazy every time a Japanese PM visits the Yasukuni Shrine.

Japan attacked the US because we were standing in their way to creating an Asian empire uner their rule. This endeavor was euphemistically known as the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere. The attack on Pearl Harbor and our other Pacific positions was an attempt to remove our influence from the region and compell us to resume shipments of strategic materials Japan needed to complete it's conquest (mostly oil and steel)

I thought I mentioned that I wasn't discussing the Asian portion with my reasoning, especially since my reasoning wouldn't even apply to them 😛.

Also, your reasoning sounds awkward (not saying it's necessarily wrong)... but why would a nation that has fought in the past simply buckle down after having a single installation bombed? That makes less sense than a wookie on Endor (gotta keep it a little zany to avoid this becoming a P&N matter 😛)!

You cannot remove Japan's involvment in Asia from consideration since it was the primary reason they attacked the US.

The idea was to knock out most of the Pacific Fleet at anchor in Pearl and cripple the US second strongest position (attack on the Philippines on Dec 8). If successful the US would likely had to have sued for peace under unfavorable terms or leave the now vulnerable US mainland open to attack.

 

[Passions]

Originally posted by: Descartes
You sound like an ass. You fit the stereotypical perception of Americans as presumptuous, arrogant and exceedingly nationalistic. Congratulations for offending your gf's father in a country in which you were a guest; I seriously can't even fathom having the audacity to act as you have to your hosts in a foreign country.

Descartes, you forget what he wrote:

Originally posted by: Narmer

We ugly Americans are the ones keeping the peace so show some respect when we ask why our young men and women should die for your country and why you can't talk with your neighbors, let alone your own ally?

Ugly Americans are keeping the peace!!!!

 

[50cent1228]

kool i wanna go there