Goodbye NX, hello Switch

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zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
Can you use old Wii U pro controllers with the switch? At least with the Wii, the "classic" controller wasn't too expensive and you just plugged them into a wiimote. I remember the damn plastic wheels they had for Mariokart Wii. Ugh. Such a gimmick. I ended up with one official nintendo controller and later some cheapo brands. I think they work with the Wii U via the remotes. I bought an official pro controller for the Wii U at the start though.
And from everything I've been reading, even though the joycon is fairly comfy in the included grip, the hard edges aren't as comfortable for longer plays and if you really plan on playing in docked mode, you should buy the pro controller. I will rarely play this in portable mode so I'm pretty much going to have to buy the expensive pro controller.

The Joy-Cons can be combined with the Joy-Con grip to create a more traditional controller setup. This controller feels 85 percent as comfortable as an Xbox One or PS4 controller. The added controller grip helps fill out the palms of your hands, and you can definitely get by with a Joy-Con grip while playing most games, but there are a few drawbacks. First, the square edginess of the Joy-Cons are more noticeable than you'd like and feel a little stiff against your hands. Second, the face buttons feel a bit like 3DS buttons. Finally, the shoulder buttons are especially small and have a short throw; I missed the analog triggers found on traditional gamepads. If you plan on playing a lot of games with the Switch hooked up to your TV, I recommend buying the Pro controller, which will set you back $70.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/featu...itch-answered-our-five-biggest-questions.aspx
 

cmdrdredd

Lifer
Dec 12, 2001
27,052
357
126
Using PS Vita's price is irrelevant since that console bombed due to poor software support, expensive memory cards, and high price that curbed early adoption. Positioning the Switch against PS4/XB1 but ignoring that those consoles have hundreds of discounted games in their library is a mistake. Some gamers just want 1 console and based on how Wii U sold, there are very few console gamers left who are willing to purchase a Nintendo console only for its 1st party games.

Ouch, when you put it like that it really does seem bad indeed. I just wanted to add to your last point about most people only wanting one system. I can see this and have seen this both online with the threads about "Xbox vs PS4, which to buy?" and when told to just get both it's basically written off as impossible for them. Also most of the people I know in real life pick a console and they won't buy the other. A good friend of mine bought a PS4 a couple years ago for his son and a few months ago he started talking about the Xbox one and was told "tough, you have a PS4 and that's enough." Also I think most gamers today buy the console that more of their friends are using so they can play online. Nintendo isn't even in the conversation then.
 
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purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
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poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
$50 isn't a lot but you are looking it the wrong way. For $50 you can buy 3-4 PS4 exclusives like Uncharted Collection, Ratchet & Clank, Until Dawn, etc., and the Uncharted 4 bundle is $250. Suddenly I get 4-5 "free" games with the PS4. You think parents or gamers don't look at things like that? I can't be the only one who does.

I would think most parents this late in the "next generation" cycle have already either bought a console for their teenage kids, or they are being pushed into either the Xbox or the PS4 based on what that kid wants. I can't think of any parent of say a 12 year old boy who just walks up to Gamestop and decides a console based on the merits of that console and not because said 12 year old boy has been already asking for it by name a dozen times.

I see the Switch appealing more to parents with pre-teen and even younger kids that are shopping for basically a way to pacify those kids on plane rides or when daddy wants to get some peace and quiet. They won't compare this console to a PS4 or Xbox, they will compare it to a new iPad Mini which is $400 for the current 32GB model. I think that is how Nintendo plans to position the console, which is why its a tablet and why they showed smartphone parental controls off the bat. A placation device is preferable to a "real" console for these parents, as a real console will have more mature games and will have the kids fighting daddy and mommy for TV time when they just want to bingewatch some Netflix.

If they can build a reputation for having a decent game library that Jr wants to play without having to worry about the freemium crap where Jr runs up the credit card hundreds of dollars for some sort of digital ingame jewel (or almost as worse annoying bugging you to buy said jewels) like the iOS game market is pretty much built to do then they might have a hit. I have had more than one parent who asked me which placation device (that is what I call this genre) to get and every time I tried to suggest the 3DS the fact it had a resistive touchscreen was often a deal breaker (because parents like to justify these placation purchases under the umbrella of "the kid is learning new technology' which a resistive touchscreen is not). The Switch might finally be a second option to an iPad Mini, especially if down the road Nintendo puts out a new SKU with better battery life and no dock at a lower cost. The 3DS just needs to die first.

For all that, I would get just Zelda, Mario Kart 8 and I gotta wait until Holiday 2017 for Mario. It ends up costing $490 + $80x2 = $650 upfront for just 2 games. So clearly it's not about just $50. I can take $650 and get a new graphics card, do an entire mobo+CPU swap or spend it on Steam/PS4 games.

Yeah but no matter how much you spend on said PC you won't be able to play Zelda or Mario Kart 8 multiplayer battle mode. In fact within two years Nintendo might have more "must have" console exclusives than the Xbox One has up-to-this point. It could position itself to be the perfect secondary gaming device behind a PC or PS4.

The longer it takes for Nintendo to build a 20-30M Switch install base, the more 3rd party developers will skip developing/porting Switch games.

I would say its more accurate to say the install base is what will drive them to port current AAA games, probably watered down in some way. Indie developers are already embracing the Switch, in fact based on announcements I would say it already leapfrogged the Xbox One on that category. I for one am looking forward to games like Starbound or Yooka-Laylee on the Switch as much as any AAA title. The Switch is also a perfect way to play the better iOS and Android games that exist and can be ported.

That's why it's crucial to launch a console and have 50+ games out in the first 1-2 months.

That obviously won't happen, but we might see 40 games on there by the end of 2017:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Nintendo_Switch_games

Instead of trying to grow the install base to 20-30M asap and starting to make up $$$ on software while pricing the console at $199-249, they are trying to make $ day 1 on hardware.

Yeah they have made it clear they aren't taking a loss on the Switch. Part of that might be due to the position they are in financially.

Positioning the Switch against PS4/XB1 but ignoring that those consoles have hundreds of discounted games in their library is a mistake.

I agree with this 100%. Nintendo should have framed the Switch more as mobile device and compared it to an iPad vs comparing it to the PS4 or Xbox One. They made a decision to frame it more as a console because the 3DS is still doing well and the Wii U isn't so the Wii U is what they want replaced, but really they should have swallowed the bitter pill and announced what is clear- this console is replacing both product lines.

What I expect is the Switch will struggle early on, and then somewhere around year two they will rehash it with a SoC with longer battery life and a cheaper SKU without the dock and with the Mario game to completely cannibalize with by then will be a declining 3DS market. The problem between now and then is giving people enough to want to buy the generation 1 switch, which frankly might be a hard sell for parents wanting a placation device. Nintendo will probably end up learning some lessons the hard way, but there is no reason the Switch can't be a success in the long run if they change the value statement like they did with the 3DS after its so-so launch.
 
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poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
Can you use old Wii U pro controllers with the switch?

No. No old controllers work anymore except maybe the USB adaptor for the Wii U.

So ARMS doesn't require the motion controls to be played.

At which point I don't see why someone would buy it.

The Switch launch window games are a disaster, no way to sugar coat it. I am excited about the Switch but the only launch window games I am pro-ordering are Zelda and Redout (that I have on PC already). I should be dying to want to play 1 2 Switch or Arms but I am not, hell that Snipperclips game looks more appealing than either of them. I expect 1 2 Switch will be a MASSIVE flop that will be included with the console before the end of the year just to get rid of the cartridges they already manufactured.
 
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zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
Confirmation that the included JoyCon grip is NOT the charging grip which you will have to buy separately for $30 so the only way to charge it is to have it connected to the the Switch. While it may not be a huge issue, people forget to charge controllers all the time and only having one way to charge it and play at the same time isn't the best. This system is super nickle and diming with accessories.

nintendo_switch_joy_con_grip_charging_grip_2240.jpg


Every Nintendo Switch comes with a Joy-Con Grip, an accessory that holds two Joy-Con controllers in a form factor that resembles a standard gamepad. But that unit won’t charge the Joy-Con devices — for that, you may want to buy a separate peripheral known as the Joy-Con Charging Grip.

This may or may not have been obvious to you; the Charging Grip is listed as a $29.99 accessory on the Nintendo Switch website. Either way, Nintendo didn’t make it completely clear until a livestream on Friday morning, during which Nintendo Treehouse employees showed off the Switch hardware and various games

http://www.polygon.com/2017/1/16/14285520/nintendo-switch-joy-con-charging-grip
 
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poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
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I kept reading at places that it was included but now finally confirmation it's not. I saw a third party one for $15 on Amazon so I'll probably pick it up.

I wish Best Buy would go ahead and list all the accessories for pre-buy today because they have a $25 Visa checkout coupon for purchases over $100. A pro controller plus a charging grip would do it.
 

gus6464

Golden Member
Nov 10, 2005
1,848
32
91
Just got an email that my breath of the wild se preorder for the 13th as initial shipment sold out just got bumped to the 3rd launch.
 
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zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
Just got an email that my breath of the wild se preorder for the 13th as initial shipment sold out just got bumped to the 3rd launch.
Mine as well. I had pre-ordered that and the regular game as well just in case the SE wouldn't come in time. I canceled the regular version now.
 

zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
I will say, I am excited to play Zelda. It's been a while for many of us since Skyward Sword was new. There's literally nothing else until Mario Odyssey though for me. I'll probably get Mario Kart since I didn't have the WiiU but that's it.
 

preslove

Lifer
Sep 10, 2003
16,755
63
91
So, did I miss something, or does this "tablet" not have an android fork for web browsing and apps? They also aren't porting android games to the switch?

WTF? It's based on the shield architecture, so including that stuff would be simple. It would be a much easier sell as an ipad mini competitor if it did most of the things that tablets do...
 

zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
So, did I miss something, or does this "tablet" not have an android fork for web browsing and apps? They also aren't porting android games to the switch?

WTF? It's based on the shield architecture, so including that stuff would be simple. It would be a much easier sell as an ipad mini competitor if it did most of the things that tablets do...
No, it's all custom software and I'm glad they aren't making it android. I hate touch games and most mobile games suck in general.
 

preslove

Lifer
Sep 10, 2003
16,755
63
91
No, it's all custom software and I'm glad they aren't making it android. I hate touch games and most mobile games suck in general.

There are plenty of android ports of older games. They could have made something similar to the fire tv, with a custom fork & a highly restricted app store.
 

zerocool84

Lifer
Nov 11, 2004
36,041
472
126
There are plenty of android ports of older games. They could have made something similar to the fire tv, with a custom fork & a highly restricted app store.
But we don't need yet another Android tablet. It has to be their own thing, with real games on it when you could buy a tablet under $150 and play most Android games.
 

poofyhairguy

Lifer
Nov 20, 2005
14,612
318
126
There are plenty of android ports of older games. They could have made something similar to the fire tv, with a custom fork & a highly restricted app store.

Android is a very bloated OS that is not very optimized (unless you count barely supported Vulkan). For Switch games to look good they need to get all they can out of the hardware, which requires a leaner OS.
 

JujuFish

Lifer
Feb 3, 2005
10,999
733
136
I will say, I am excited to play Zelda. It's been a while for many of us since Skyward Sword was new. There's literally nothing else until Mario Odyssey though for me. I'll probably get Mario Kart since I didn't have the WiiU but that's it.

It's like you're speaking my mind.
 

ElFenix

Elite Member
Super Moderator
Mar 20, 2000
102,414
8,356
126
After reading some hands on reports I canceled the 1 2 Switch. It's not worth even $40.

I am excited about the size of the switch.

switch_3ds_comparison.jpg
that's a lot smaller than i expected, although i probably have a poor conception of how big the 3ds xl is.

i wonder how big this is compared to say, a lynx or gamegear?
 

purbeast0

No Lifer
Sep 13, 2001
52,834
5,713
126
If you have a Wii U, there is literally no reason to purchase a Switch just for Zelda, unless you want 180 more lines of resolution.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2017/01...ch-wii-u-versions-of-zelda-breath-of-the-wild

  • Both launch on the same day, March 3.
  • Both have a frame rate of 30fps.
  • Both versions of the game offer the same content.
  • On a TV, the Nintendo Switch version of the game renders in 900p while the Wii U version renders in 720p.
  • The Nintendo Switch version has higher-quality environmental sounds. As a result, the sound of steps, water, grass, etc. are more realistic and enhance the game’s Open-Air feel.
  • The physical copy of the Wii U version will require 3GB of available memory on the Wii U system or an external drive.
  • Some icons, such as onscreen buttons, differ between the two versions.
  • A Special Edition and Master Edition of the Wii U version are not available.

So yeah, confirmed that it's a Wii U port, just like the Wii Twilight Princess was a port of GC.
 

Ranulf

Platinum Member
Jul 18, 2001
2,331
1,138
136
You can trade your Wii u in for GameStop credit and get a switch at a massive discount.

I think the pre-orders are already sold out so... more wait time there. Thing is, if you have any exclusive games on the wii u, they aren't getting ported over. I doubt they'll let you transfer your online virtual console stuff either.
 

Chiropteran

Diamond Member
Nov 14, 2003
9,811
110
106
I'm not even sure why you quoted me, that has been known for a while now and not really relevant to my post.

It's relevant because you can't play zelda on your wii u after you trade it in, so getting the switch version is the vastly superior decision.

edit: Further, the link you provide shows that the switch version is clearly superior. Better resolution, playable on the go, and better audio.