Get healthy or else, say employers (Obamacare)

[BoberFett]

I worked for a large corporation who's boardroom policies directly harmed other's health. They got bigger bonuses as a result.

Quit?

You've talked about your company in the past, sounds like a terrible place to work. My sister was the pharmacist at a Walgreens, absolutely hated it. She quit and went to a clinic pharmacy, enjoys much better hours and overall working conditions.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Quit?

You've talked about your company in the past, sounds like a terrible place to work. My sister was the pharmacist at a Walgreens, absolutely hated it. She quit and went to a clinic pharmacy, enjoys much better hours and overall working conditions.

Jobs are scarce, so moving on isn't easy unless it's unemployment. The point is that if companies can punish workers for things under their control then those who create policy adverse to health ought to be similarly held personally accountable. Having people die should not create a reward for them.

 

[Strk]

The nerve of insurance companies being able to benefit people trying to be healthy!

 

[shira]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/13/us-usa-healthcare-wellness-insight-idUSKBN0KM17C20150113









I think on the surface, it sounds like a neat program. Trying to get people healthy is a good thing right? Then it get implemented and its creepy as hell. "Company-supplied pedometer", online health questionnaires, docking pay for not wearing a pedometer, and the general feeling of awkwardness that your employer is keeping tabs on your body and it directly correlates to pay regardless of job performance.

What bothers me most is that they aren't giving value to some people, they are actually penalizing them. Some companies have decided to dock pay for not participating, so the person is much worse off than before these programs were implemented. I can get behind a reward system where the person gets incentives for participating, but cutting healthcare to some of the people that need it most seems strange.

I understand how smoking and morbidly obese people hurt health programs, but its still a strange situation to be in with your employer.

So let's me get this straight:

Employees can choose to participate in wellness programs. If they do, they'll get financial benefits. If they don't they won't. It's completely up to the employee to decide what they want to do.

The alternative: No one is given incentives to engage in welness activities, and there are no incentives. Which means that premiums will be the same for everyone. SO the healthy will need to subsidize the unhealthy to an even greater extent than they already do.

And this is a BAD thing?

 

[bshole]

If it's not your company, it'll be your government.

What, you think Uncle Sam won't bring the hammer down on people if and when we get universal healthcare?

Why would they? In the long run, if they are providing health care and retirement, it will be cheaper for them to have an unhealthy populace that dies off at 55-75. My grand dad lived into his upper 90's, over 30 years on social security and medicare, that can't be cheap.

 

[senseamp]

I love how the right wants to pretend that employers who pay for health insurance have no incentive to push their employees to be healthy. It's all the government's fault

 

[senseamp]

Jobs are scarce, so moving on isn't easy unless it's unemployment. The point is that if companies can punish workers for things under their control then those who create policy adverse to health ought to be similarly held personally accountable. Having people die should not create a reward for them.

Who do you want to hold them personally accountable? Wouldn't be the government by any chance? Or is it Karma?

 

[Slew Foot]

lose some weight fatties

 

[Darwin333]

I'm on the fence on this one. On one hand I have always felt that what I do on my own time is no one business but my own. On the other hand it does effect the employers bottom line so that does sort of make it their business if it increases what they pay in health insurance.

 

[shira]

Republicans: The party that insists on personal responsibility until Democrats use laws to encourage people to be personally responsibile.

 

[OutHouse]

My company fines you for not participating, It's fucked up and we see it as heavy handed big brother shit.

 

[OutHouse]

Republicans: The party that insists on personal responsibility until Democrats use laws to encourage people to be personally responsibile.

Troll

 

[Zaap]

Republicans: The party that insists on personal responsibility until Democrats use laws...

LOL. Its so telling you conjured this "thought" without realizing the later then ceases to be personal responsibility. But then again, that does define "progressives": totalitarian mindset always in the guise of something else.

 

[bshole]

Republicans: The party that insists on personal responsibility until Democrats use laws to encourage people to be personally responsibile.

I don't know, maybe they are just going after the fat vote, the smoke vote and the drunk vote. Good politics.....

 

[IBMer]

My old company started these policies while Bush was in office, can I blame Bush too?

 

[shira]

My company fines you for not participating, It's fucked up and we see it as heavy handed big brother shit.

What's the difference between "fining" non-participants X dollars and giving participants X more dollars?

 

[bshole]

LOL. Its so telling you conjured this "thought" without realizing the later then ceases to be personal responsibility. But then again, that does define "progressives": totalitarian mindset always in the guise of something else.

Well at least progressives are good moral people..... that gotta be worth something right there.

 

[shira]

You know, it's really interesting that both Democrats and Republicans pass all sorts of tax breaks to provide financial incentives for companies to engage in activities that the government deems beneficial. But expand that concept to financial incentives for individuals and it's "big brother."

 

[OutHouse]

What's the difference between "fining" non-participants X dollars and giving participants X more dollars?

One is a reward the other is punishment

 

[shira]

LOL. Its so telling you conjured this "thought" without realizing the later then ceases to be personal responsibility. But then again, that does define "progressives": totalitarian mindset always in the guise of something else.

Really? You seem to believe that "personal responsibiliy" is completely independent of "personal benefit."

A man has a dream of being a professional musician, and he stubbornly refuses to get a better job than his low-paying nightclub gigs so that he can get in maximum playing time and improve his "craft." As a result, his family lives in poverty. Or, A man wants to be a professional musician, but he compromises his dream and changes jobs to make more money, to better take care of his family.

Most of us would agree that the former behavior is rather seflish, whereas the latter behavior is an honorable example of "personal responsibility. Yet according to you, the latter is "just choosing more money" and "personal responsibility" has nothing to do with it.

 

[shira]

One is a reward the other is punishment

So, if your company pays $4000 toward your medical premiums, and gives $1000 more if you exercise, you're happy. But if your company gives you $5000 toward your medical premiums, but withholds $1000 of that payment because you don't exercise, you're unhappy? Even though the bottom line is exactly the same for exactly the same behavior?

 

[bshole]

So, if your company pays $4000 toward your medical premiums, and gives $1000 more if you exercise, you're happy. But if your company gives you $5000 toward your medical premiums, but withholds $1000 of that payment because you don't exercise, you're unhappy? Even though the bottom line is exactly the same for exactly the same behavior?

Well played.....

 

[piasabird]

Diabetes gets worse as you get older, and it is not easily preventable. It is very complicated and the drugs you use to treat it can make you gain weight. My wife is not overweight and she came down with diabetes. The older you get the harder it is to keep going. The older you get the more likely you will have other health complications like a bad or worn out rotator cuff, Knees that go bad and keep you from running, Parkinsons, Gout, Arthritis, MS, Glacoma, poor circulation, etc., etc., etc. Exercise does not cure everything. Maybe you will have cancer and you penis will fall off.

High blood Pressure is just about hereditary in white men over 30. With age you everything from teeth, to eyesight take a hit. Joints ware you and then you cant even run or do real exercise. Many older adults experience severe chronic back pain.

So the CEO that has a limousine a private club, and 5 million dollar bonus kind of conveniently wants to be an evil monster. Maybe the Government will do away with all business deductions and credits and take all his bonus in taxes. Who knows what will happen in the future.

 

[yllus]

This is actually an argument for national healthcare; take your employer completely out of the equation and you can be as unhealthy as you want! (Until the gov't starts in on this line of thinking too, but that'll take longer.)

 

[shira]

Diabetes gets worse as you get older, and it is not easily preventable. It is very complicated and the drugs you use to treat it can make you gain weight. My wife is not overweight and she came down with diabetes. The older you get the harder it is to keep going. The older you get the more likely you will have other health complications like a bad or worn out rotator cuff, Knees that go bad and keep you from running, Parkinsons, Gout, Arthritis, MS, Glacoma, poor circulation, etc., etc., etc. Exercise does not cure everything. Maybe you will have cancer and you penis will fall off.

I don't think anyone believes that exercise is a panacea. But all other things being equal, it's pretty clear that it's better to engage in a "prudent" exercise program that takes into account the person's personal health situation than to live a completely sedentary life.