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Gas prices soaring??

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Savij

Diamond Member
Nov 12, 2001
4,233
0
71
Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Anyone in Arkansas or Tennessee that can confirm reports of gas $8 and $9 respectively?

where'd you hear that? doesn't surprise me though

$8.81 Tennessee

:(

i'll put our differences aside dave, that's insane and should be illegal

The beauty of that site is that anyone can post any price they want without really any backing. For all you know, Dave posted it.

Oh yeah, it's not even listed anymore. ;)

OMG! Gas prices are down 50% since last night!! I better sell what I have left before it's too late!
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: iamwiz82
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Anyone in Arkansas or Tennessee that can confirm reports of gas $8 and $9 respectively?

where'd you hear that? doesn't surprise me though

$8.81 Tennessee

:(

i'll put our differences aside dave, that's insane and should be illegal

The beauty of that site is that anyone can post any price they want without really any backing. For all you know, Dave posted it.

Oh yeah, it's not even listed anymore. ;)

Notice I asked for confirmation
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Anyone in Arkansas or Tennessee that can confirm reports of gas $8 and $9 respectively?

where'd you hear that? doesn't surprise me though

$8.81 Tennessee

:(

i'll put our differences aside dave, that's insane and should be illegal

With 20% of our refining capacity currently down, what should the price of gas of be?

Oh I don't know considering it is their job to produce a product 365 24/7 no change.

What do you think?
 

charrison

Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
17,033
1
81
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Anyone in Arkansas or Tennessee that can confirm reports of gas $8 and $9 respectively?

where'd you hear that? doesn't surprise me though

$8.81 Tennessee

:(

i'll put our differences aside dave, that's insane and should be illegal

With 20% of our refining capacity currently down, what should the price of gas of be?

Oh I don't know considering it is their job to produce a product 365 24/7 no change.

What do you think?

Maybe you should have volunteered to keep the operations running in cat 2 winds. At least the refiners were smart enough to shut down operations and let their employees seek shelter. I have little doubt they will back on the job today and get things back online as soon as possible.
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Anyone in Arkansas or Tennessee that can confirm reports of gas $8 and $9 respectively?

where'd you hear that? doesn't surprise me though

$8.81 Tennessee

This explains why it is so high in Tennessee

It's amazing what you can learn if you just ask a question or two instead of assuming you already know the answer.

Why are gas prices spiking today?

Gouging, right? It's the evil big oil companies ripping us off again!

Actually, no, it isn't.

I stopped in at a few gas stations, some chain and some independent to see exactly what was going on. I got pretty much the same story from both sides, with some slight differences. Basically, what has happened is that the slide in crude prices combined with the supply interruptions from Gustav and now Ike, have combined to create a shortage of bulk fuel in Tennessee, and that means the retail outlets are running dry.

Here's how it worked. The Knoxville area has several bulk fuel storage depots. Some belong to the chain outfits, others are run by wholesalers that supply independent gas stations. In either case, they manage their storage levels to maintain a competitive retail price. When the price of gas is rising, they maintain a relatively full inventory. This means that on average the gas they store always costs less than the current spot price. On the other hand, when gas prices are dropping, they keep inventories low, so they aren't holding a lot of gas that cost them more than the market price.

It's the exact same thing you do to minimize how much you pay for gas. If the price is going up, you fill up in the morning before the price changes go into effect, and you fill the tank full. When the price is going down, you guy your gas in the afternoon, after the price changes, and you buy just what you need. The wholesalers and bulk storage facilities do exactly the same thing, except on a much larger scale. Gas prices have been plummeting lately, so all of the bulk storage facilities have been keeping their stocks low.

Then along came Gustav, which impacted the ability of refineries to deliver fuel to the regional and local bulk storage facilities. That hasn't been a huge deal because they were drawing down their stocks anyway. But now Ike is headed for Galveston, and the pipelines are being shut down completely. And that is where the fertilizer hits the propeller. When you're in a low stock condition, you are relying on a steady flow of gasoline to maintain smooth distribution. When that steady flow is disrupted, you're only hours away from shortages.

It's been more than a few hours, and shortages are already here.

So the price of a gallon of gas is skyrocketing, even at stations, like Pilot, that have enough gas to get through the interruption without going dry. So why are they raising their prices? Aren't they gouging?

Nope. If you've been out in Knoxville at all today, you've seen long lines of cars at gas stations. You've seen people filling up cars, trucks, motorcycles, lawnmowers and gas cans. They are in a panic mode, and they're buying more gas than usual. Even though Pilot has enough to get through the crisis at normal levels of sales, there's no way they can sustain sales at the rate they are going. So what do they do? They raise prices. By raising prices, they discourage people with brains from buying more gas than they need. They discourage people from driving more than they need to. In effect, they are encouraging conservation by using market forces rather than governmental coercion.

And it will work.

Consider the opposite case, where gas prices remain low, and everybody fills every container they can get their hands on with gas, and the stations run dry for the next three days. What happens when an ambulance needs to gas up? What happens when a fire truck needs fueling? What happens when you have an emergency and you need fuel but can't get any because everybody and his brother is hoarding it?


There are two ways to ration a short supply of a commodity. You allow the market to price it accordingly, and those who really need it will buy it, or you let the government come in and set the price. As a small government supporter, I favor the former. We're still dealing with the fallout of Nixon's wage and price controls from 40 years ago.

Anyway, that's what happened. Bulk storage facilities were acting to minimize the price of fuel and got caught short when the supply was interrupted. Barring major damage from Ike, supplies should be flowing again in a couple of days, and prices will resume their freefall.
 

MarkW

Senior member
Sep 12, 2001
355
0
0
5.09 this morning now in knoxville. was 4.59 mid day Friday yesterday, and 3.59 Thursday.
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: Queasy
Bulk storage facilities were acting to minimize the price of fuel and got caught short when the supply was interrupted.

and there is the criminal activity in bold.

:roll: please cite exactly which law, state or federal, was broken.
 

PottedMeat

Lifer
Apr 17, 2002
12,363
475
126

The local WalMart yesterday had unleaded regular for $3.45 - I pass by today on my bike and its $3.75.

Just west of DFW.
 

Gothgar

Lifer
Sep 1, 2004
13,429
1
0
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: Queasy
Bulk storage facilities were acting to minimize the price of fuel and got caught short when the supply was interrupted.

and there is the criminal activity in bold.

:roll: please cite exactly which law, state or federal, was broken.

well, they are using alternator shaped/sized containers of gasoline as storage, that wouldn't last long enough
 

Modular

Diamond Member
Jul 1, 2005
5,027
67
91
Don't know if this has been posted yet, but the thing that always gets me is that they are raising prices on the gas that they have right now, currently in the underground tanks, which didn't cost them any more because of the hurricane. The price gouging in this industry is so out of hand...
 

Special K

Diamond Member
Jun 18, 2000
7,098
0
76
Originally posted by: Queasy
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: Queasy
Bulk storage facilities were acting to minimize the price of fuel and got caught short when the supply was interrupted.

and there is the criminal activity in bold.

:roll: please cite exactly which law, state or federal, was broken.

It's not criminal, but we've known approximately when the hurricane would hit for quite some time. It's not like they were just following their usual business model of minimizing the price when all of a sudden a hurricaine appeared out of nowhere and knocked the supplies offline. I guess I figured they would have anticipated this situation and kept more fuel on hand in advance.
 

BUTCH1

Lifer
Jul 15, 2000
20,433
1,769
126
Lets hope Ike doesn't cause massive damage, the refineries already were behind after shutting down for Gustav, don't want it to come down to this..
 

xSauronx

Lifer
Jul 14, 2000
19,582
4
81
Originally posted by: JoPh
in nj my station is up .20 today

4.59 here last i checked, for premium. i got premium yesterday and 3.89 because i got a heads up that it was going to go up. i expected over $5/gallon though, but still, this sucks :(
 

Mill

Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
28,558
3
81
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: charrison
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: JohnCU
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Anyone in Arkansas or Tennessee that can confirm reports of gas $8 and $9 respectively?

where'd you hear that? doesn't surprise me though

$8.81 Tennessee

:(

i'll put our differences aside dave, that's insane and should be illegal

With 20% of our refining capacity currently down, what should the price of gas of be?

Oh I don't know considering it is their job to produce a product 365 24/7 no change.

What do you think?

Maybe you should have volunteered to keep the operations running in cat 2 winds. At least the refiners were smart enough to shut down operations and let their employees seek shelter. I have little doubt they will back on the job today and get things back online as soon as possible.


I seriously don't understand what the fuck you or Queasy are talking about. We have gasoline stocks of 287 million barrels of gasoline. Our consumption is 9.3, and we refine about 8 million (actually a little more) a day. Even with 20% of the refining capacity down we only have a gap of 2.9 million a day. Let's round that to 3 just to be nice. That means we have at least a 95 day supply at FULL CONSUMPTION.

WTF is wrong with all of you people? The panic buying and rumors are leading to increased consumption (notably only in some areas... it is mainly localized) which is wiping out the supplies in entire counties and cities. If people would calm the fuck down, quit defending the price of gas and the oil companies, and just let the market act normal gas wouldn't have spiked more than .20 or .30 cents.

A lot of this comes down to how stupid Americans are and how greedy they are. If people weren't so fucking scared that their neighbor might get .20 cents cheaper gas than them and just went about their normal routine prices would stabilize.

To the OP, what do you expect? You live in Birmingham, AL. The density of fucking morons is overwhelming in Birmingham.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
47
91
www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Mill

I seriously don't understand what the fuck you or Queasy are talking about. We have gasoline stocks of 287 million barrels of gasoline. Our consumption is 9.3, and we refine about 8 million (actually a little more) a day. Even with 20% of the refining capacity down we only have a gap of 2.9 million a day. Let's round that to 3 just to be nice. That means we have at least a 95 day supply at FULL CONSUMPTION.

WTF is wrong with all of you people? The panic buying and rumors are leading to increased consumption (notably only in some areas... it is mainly localized) which is wiping out the supplies in entire counties and cities.

If people would calm the fuck down,

quit defending the price of gas and the oil companies,

and just let the market act normal gas wouldn't have spiked more than .20 or .30 cents.

A lot of this comes down to how stupid Americans are and how greedy they are. If people weren't so fucking scared that their neighbor might get .20 cents cheaper gas than them and just went about their normal routine prices would stabilize.

To the OP, what do you expect? You live in Birmingham, AL. The density of fucking morons is overwhelming in Birmingham.

:shocked: :laugh:

You missed the point though.

There is no "normal " market conditions, so what were you saying about "density of fucking morons is overwhelming"? :confused:
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Originally posted by: Mill
I seriously don't understand what the fuck you or Queasy are talking about.

I guess not because I'm essentially agreeing with you. I've already said in this thread that people panicking and doing a run on gas is part of the problem because they suck these gas stations dry instead of sticking to their normal routine. That causes artificial shortages and price increases.

The other problem is that the gas pipelines that supply gas for the South East and the parts of the East Coast have been shut down because of Ike and won't be turned back on until Ike passes and they can do a damage assessment. That won't be until later next week.

The same thing happened during Katrina. If people just waited to get gas until they actually needed it, it wouldn't be that big of a deal.

 

TerryMathews

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
11,464
2
0
Well, OPEC always said that our gasoline price was due to refining capacity and not the price of crude oil.

I guess we have our answer now.