For those who disagree with how the Bin Laden affair was handled...

[Craig234]

Same thing except make sure there were no eye witnesses.

Spoken like someone without the morals most criminals, including murderers, have.

Yes, kill people for political gain.

One more example of the 'absolute power corrupts absolutely' saying - lie, kill, whatever that helps you when the truth isn't good for you.

 

[Vic Vega]

Well remember, despite your trusted media STRIDENTLY repeating over & over & over & over . . . (nonterminating process) that he was behind 911,

in reality there is NO credible evidence he nor his organization nor his money nor his influence had any SHRED of connection to 911.

The USA populace is eagerly swallowing the incessantly droned-into-your-skull spin the media reiterates in EVERY message about him, forgetting about ever showing that to be true in the first place. (it's been said a million times so it bust be true? Bull shit logic 101).

David Ray Griffin has satisfied a hypercritical me that the preponderance of evidence points at Dick Cheny & whatever PNAC secret cabal he was participant in, as THEEEEE true masterminds who Originated the concept, Planned the project, and Managed execution to project completion (irregsardless of whatever external agencies (Mossad? Saudi Arabians? who the hell will ever truly know) got their hands dirty, and anyway to HELL with >3000 innocent lives, the Ends justified the Means. IN THEIR INSANE TWISTY MINDS.

Those mentally ill monsters! HOME GROWN, IT WAS AN INSIDE JOB!!!! They OPENLY PUBLISHED their idea for "American "hegemony" and "full-spectrum" dominance" of this entire planet. MONSTERS!!!!!

911 was ABSOLUTELY an inside job, Dick Chey at the helm, with the other looneys who signed onto the PNAC insanity he rabidly lived. Their names are in the 1st link in my other post below. God DAMNED monsterously evil Dick Cheny and the men in the shadows behind him hell bent years ahead of 911 who openly plotted taking the USA to war, shoving it down the USA citizens' throats with their INTENDED "new Pearl Harbor." God DAMNED Dick CHeny & his posse. (The insane ultra righties & still MORE insane grow-government-till-we-die lefties)

HERE IS THE TRUE STORY ON 911

You're completely insane.

 

[zsdersw]

President Bartlett approves.

I wish we had President Bartlet.

 

[ichy]

I would've taken him alive so that he could be thoroughly waterboarded. After that, shoot him.

 

[Craig234]

If you ask the question then don't make these silly arbitrary conditions trying to get us to give the answer you're looking for.

Truth is there's no reason he could not have been taken alive if they wanted to.

I think you're right, except that *if* bin Laden had resisted more strongly, it would no longer have been as safe. But there are many non-lethal tools they have nowadays.

I'm surprised there weren't more protections, such as perhaps some sort of activatable mine field or other bombs for intruders.

What if one defender had a surface to air rocket launcher as helicopters approached?

I know the military usually tries to probe such defenses - remember the lone tank that toured Baghdad before the larger invasion - but I'm not sure they could in this case.

Boy, would we have heard about 'incompetent Obama' in that case.

Helicopters are the bane of Democratic Presidents - the failure of the Iran hostage rescue for Carter, Blackhawk down for Clinton, we lost one copter in this mission.

It seems wrong that this mission has much effect on the 2012 election either way.

It seems either party can 'supervise' the military for operations like this - though the Republicans tend to lie about that, 'only they can protect you, not Democrats'.

 

[Craig234]

Yep the military wanted to carpet bomb the area. Obama said no for 2 big reasons. 1 was killing a lot of innocent people and the 2nd was we need proof he was there and is dead.


Hell we got pictures, video, and DNA and people still think it was fake. Look how nuts people like WildHor are with 9/11 even though evidance says they are nuts.

Those are both correct but there was a third, to collect rather than destroy info there.

 

[Craig234]

There is just one thing that could have been done better, where the result of that better way was obvious before going that route: The little detail of Osama being unarmed, should not have been made public.

I disagree. I like our government telling the truth over hiding things to make it look better, generally.

We don't need to be inventing Satanic items in Noriega's hideout, denying prisoner stories of abuse in Abu Ghraib, inventing embarrassing sexual stories for captured enemy leaders, writing fiction about a heroic gun battle in which a female soldier was captured early in Iraq nor dangers that weren't there for her rescue, a heroic gun battle for Pat Tillman hiding his killing by friendly fire, etc.

 

[soulcougher73]

Id take him out on a live national US TV feed thru the helmet cams Would be great reality TV with proof

 

[cganesh75]

if he was captured alive, rest of his people will do anything to bring him back. imagine if pakistani military got to the compound as we were getting out with handcuffed osama.. do you think they would let us take him away?

killing him was the only choice. how it was done is where the president gets his credit.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

Truth is there's no reason he could not have been taken alive if they wanted to.

If this had been most places, but it was not, and therefore my contention stands because of the location of the compound relative to ISI forces, which would probably means defenses against helicopters are in place. The operation therefore had to be done as fast as possible. That changes how things have to be done. You now have to identify targets in a confusing situation as to not shoot Bin Laden and you have to move in such a way to keep him from being shot and killed while leaving. That takes time and time is your real enemy.

So there are some factors you can ignore or say don't count. Very well. Let's look at your statement of an absolute guarantee of success. No one designing this operation would have ever said such a thing. What makes your expertise better than theirs? What remarkable insight do you have that would allow you to say to Obama "Mr. President I have a plan which cannot fail".

You really should consider government service or perhaps a career in screen writing.

Nevertheless, let's say you pulled this off. You have Bin Laden. What happens next?

 

[GuitarDaddy]

Why does everybody try and make this so difficult.

1. We should not and did not give one rats ass about international opinion, this guy initiated the largest attack on American soil in the history of our country and killed over 3000 Americans. Did we worry about international opinion when we dropped nukes on Japan to end WWII?

2. Taking OBL alive would have served no purpose and would have created numerous problems for the US. How many terrorists have we executed once in custody? Think KSM, why is that pos still alive?

We did exactly what we should have IMHO, siezed the opportunity and took out the garbage.

 

[Scotteq]

Why does everybody try and make this so difficult...

Because by going through the detailia - Ad Nauseam - over how the exact manner of UBL's long overdue demise, it's perfectly possible to issue a long stream of inuendo and non sequiturs that vilify whichever political side one opposes. Why let an event go to waste when there's political hay to be made in front of one's Internet Buddies and Internet Opponents?

 

[Nemesis 1]

Yep the military wanted to carpet bomb the area. Obama said no for 2 big reasons. 1 was killing a lot of innocent people and the 2nd was we need proof he was there and is dead.


Hell we got pictures, video, and DNA and people still think it was fake. Look how nuts people like WildHor are with 9/11 even though evidance says they are nuts.

1) You see this is your problem . The overwhelming evidance says it was an inside job .

I watched the event live and any others who did had to have seen that other plane right after the first hit. Fly by the screen (Your rightside) and none said anything about it . I was In shock when I seen that plane. It flew out of site but 5 mins latter it came back on screen your left side. and struck the second building.

2. First time a steal building every fell from fire. THis day we had 3 first times in history.
3 building go down

3) When the first building fell into its own footprint I said to self Thats not right. Than the second one did the same thing I thought what the freak is this . When BBC reported that Building seven went down befor it actually went down as you could clearly see it up in the background I thought what the hells going on . Than when it fell in its own footprint . I new who did what .

THE overwhelming evidance sugjest its an inside job .

Than we have the hit on the pentigon by a 757. That left a 9 foot hole that got enlarged latter . But zero proof the wings ever hit anything . Plus it had the wromg engine parts displayed for the plane used.

IF your asked to do jury trail , I sugjest you decline it . Based on absence of logic to come to rational conclusion.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

2. First time a steal building every fell from fire. THis day we had 3 first times in history.
3 building go down

Wrong. Steel buildings commonly collapse during fires as steel weakens substantially after being exposed to temperatures above 1000F for over 10 minutes. The fire proofing on the steel only delayed the inevitable as office buildings are not designed to withstand flammable liquid fires where the BTU content is well over 3 times that of ordinary combustibles.

 

[GuitarDaddy]

1) You see this is your problem . The overwhelming evidance says it was an inside job .

I watched the event live and any others who did had to have seen that other plane right after the first hit. Fly by the screen (Your rightside) and none said anything about it . I was In shock when I seen that plane. It flew out of site but 5 mins latter it came back on screen your left side. and struck the second building.

2. First time a steal building every fell from fire. THis day we had 3 first times in history.
3 building go down

3) When the first building fell into its own footprint I said to self Thats not right. Than the second one did the same thing I thought what the freak is this . When BBC reported that Building seven went down befor it actually went down as you could clearly see it up in the background I thought what the hells going on . Than when it fell in its own footprint . I new who did what .

THE overwhelming evidance sugjest its an inside job .

Than we have the hit on the pentigon by a 757. That left a 9 foot hole that got enlarged latter . But zero proof the wings ever hit anything . Plus it had the wromg engine parts displayed for the plane used.

IF your asked to do jury trail , I sugjest you decline it . Based on absence of logic to come to rational conclusion.

^^^ Certifiably insane ^^^


I guess you also believe the moon missions where taped in a hollywood studio, and that Elvis is still alive

 

[Craig234]

Nevertheless, let's say you pulled this off. You have Bin Laden. What happens next?

Same thing as the person convicted for planning the original WTC bombing. And whatever information he has to offer, without torture, that much better.

The people like you arguing 'couldn't be done' might remember even the people who did it disagree - this was not a kill order but a kill or capture order.

If he had surrendered, he was to be taken into custody.

 

[SAWYER]

I can't believe people are butt hurt abut this dirtbag being killed. He and people like him would rather slit the throats of the sympathizers than piss on them

 

[sunzt]

Shooting him there had the least risk and consequences. You also have to expect that he might had the capability to blow up the compound with a remote device near him.

Think of all the stupid shit and consequences the US would have to deal with if they took him alive. The "now what?" question is the biggest quandary of all.

 

[CallMeJoe]

... Than we have the hit on the pentigon by a 757. That left a 9 foot hole that got enlarged latter . But zero proof the wings ever hit anything . Plus it had the wromg engine parts displayed for the plane used.

Someone here has watched too many Road Runner cartoons.

IF your asked to do jury trail , I sugjest you decline it . Based on absence of logic to come to rational conclusion.

Well said. I just hope you can take your own advice.

 

[Smoove910]

I would've done him in for the sole purpose that the US citizens wouldn't have to worry about a corrupt court system, nor would we have to worry about housing and feeding him for the rest of his life once he's sentenced.

A bullet is pretty inexpensive these days, especially compared to the cost of the legal battles and the prison time. We are losing enough $$, why waste more on this pile of sh!t?

 

[Nemesis 1]

Wrong. Steel buildings commonly collapse during fires as steel weakens substantially after being exposed to temperatures above 1000F for over 10 minutes. The fire proofing on the steel only delayed the inevitable as office buildings are not designed to withstand flammable liquid fires where the BTU content is well over 3 times that of ordinary combustibles.

Link of steel building (high Rise ) falling into its own footprint. You say there are lots of them . I say show me 1 video of this occurring. Just 1 video for the point.

 

[Nemesis 1]

Someone here has watched too many Road Runner cartoons.

Well said. I just hope you can take your own advice.

I will not do jury duty. As its Gods job to judge not mine. I just won't do it. rather go to jail . Judge not least ye be judged according to your own judgement.

 

[Nemesis 1]

^^^ Certifiably insane ^^^


I guess you also believe the moon missions where taped in a hollywood studio, and that Elvis is still alive

Are you denying the facts as I presented them . Than you reject the video proof . Yet you except the word of a proven liar that he got OBL.Were there is ZERO proof that this infact happened. DNA not proof. Picture Proven fakes. Videos . Haven't seen one.

Yet you except this as fact were there is zero proof . Than you reject the 9/11 conspirecy. When the video and other proof has been proven yet you reject that.

Ya we need the men in white coates but not for me . I just can't wait tell later this year. You will know terror like you have never known it befor . UP close and personnal

 

[OutHouse]

Are you denying the facts as I presented them . Than you reject the video proof . Yet you except the word of a proven liar that he got OBL.Were there is ZERO proof that this infact happened. DNA not proof. Picture Proven fakes. Videos . Haven't seen one.

Yet you except this as fact were there is zero proof . Than you reject the 9/11 conspirecy. When the video and other proof has been proven yet you reject that.

Ya we need the men in white coates but not for me . I just can't wait tell later this year. You will know terror like you have never known it befor . UP close and personnal

Holy shit you are crazy as well. You believe 9/11 was a inside job and you are calling the death of obl fake????? wow you are one crazy dude.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Link of steel building (high Rise ) falling into its own footprint. You say there are lots of them . I say show me 1 video of this occurring. Just 1 video for the point.

I said there are a lot of steel buildings that collapse during a fire...it's common. There are much less high rise steel frame buildings that collapse as they're fire proofed and have fire protection systems design for the occupancy.

Anyway...here's one for you:
http://www.archboston.org/community/showthread.php?t=2238
This is a reinforced concrete structure that used mild (non-prestressed) steel reinforcement which is far better fire-resistive construction than the WTC which had steel with spray-on fire retardant.

http://www.google.com/url?q=http://...sQFjAE&usg=AFQjCNFdeX20d-Qgs0n06QOeYYHxbjDA_w