- Jun 27, 2005
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I might be wrong here... wouldn't be the first time... But once you're sentenced you go to jail. I don't think they let you out on bail for an appeal. The appeals are held with the convicted parties in jail? The only exception I could see to that is if they mangaged to convince a judge to allow them to sit under house arrest while they go through the appeals process.
Lemon law
Lifer
- Nov 6, 2005
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What I am waiting for is the sobbing Ken Lay wife---who may have to really start slumming it and start selling one
of the many Lay family million dollar plus mansions---Life can be cruel---but that indignity is just too hard for
anyone to bear.
But cheer up----maybe she can ask the Dub for some of the Lay families political donations back. Surely GWB
can find it in his heart for good old Kenny boy and girl.
of the many Lay family million dollar plus mansions---Life can be cruel---but that indignity is just too hard for
anyone to bear.
But cheer up----maybe she can ask the Dub for some of the Lay families political donations back. Surely GWB
can find it in his heart for good old Kenny boy and girl.
- Jun 27, 2005
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Eessshh... Sentencing won't happen until 9/11/06. Why so long?
Linkage
Linkage
Lay, Skilling Convicted in Enron Collapse
May 25 12:53 PM US/Eastern
Email this story
By KRISTEN HAYS
AP Business Writer
HOUSTON
Former Enron Corp. chiefs Kenneth Lay and Jeffrey Skilling were convicted Thursday of conspiracy to commit securities and wire fraud in one of the biggest business scandals in U.S. history.
The verdict put the blame for the 2001 demise of the high-profile energy trader, once the nation's seventh-largest company, squarely on its top two executives. It came in the sixth day of deliberations following a trial that lasted nearly four months.
Lay was also convicted of bank fraud and making false statements to banks in a separate trial non-jury trial before U.S. District Judge Sim Lake related to Lay's personal banking.
Lay was convicted on all six counts against him in the trial with Skilling. Skilling was convicted on 19 of the 28 counts against him, including one count of insider trading, and acquitted on the remaining nine.
"Obviously, I'm disappointed," Skilling told reporters outside the courthouse. "But that's the way the system works."
Skilling's lawyer, Dan Petrocelli, said the verdict "doesn't change our view of what happened at Enron ... or Jeffrey Skilling's innocence."
Lay did not come outside the courthouse to speak with reporters immediately after the verdict.
Lake told jurors, "you have reflected on this evidence for the last few days and reached a very thorough verdict, and I thank you."
He set sentencing for Sept. 11.
Lake set a $5 million bond for Lay and ordered him to surrender his passport before he leaves the courthouse. The judge said the bond already in place for Skilling was sufficient. The judge said he did not believe home confinement was necessary for either.
The former corporate titans are now felons facing years in prison after being convicted of running an elaborate fraud that gave the company a glamorous illusion of success.
Jurors declared through their verdict that both men repeatedly lied to cover a vast web of unsustainable accounting tricks and failing ventures that shoved Enron into bankruptcy protection in December 2001.
The conviction was a major win for the government, serving almost as a bookend in an era that has seen prosecutors win convictions against executives from WorldCom Inc. to Adelphia Communications Corp. and homemaking maven Martha Stewart. The public outrage over the series of corporate scandals led Congress to pass the Sarbanes-Oxley act, designed to make company executives more accountable
The panel rejected Skilling's insistence that no fraud occurred at Enron other than a few executives skimming millions from secret scams behind his and Lay's backs, and a lethal combination of bad press and poor market confidence sank the company.
Both men testified in their own defense. Skilling is expected to appeal.
The government's victory caps a 4 1/2 year investigation that nabbed 16 guilty pleas from ex-Enron executives, including former Chief Financial Officer Andrew Fastow and former Chief Accounting Officer Richard Causey.
All are awaiting sentencing later this year except for two who either finished or are serving prison terms.
Many deemed the outcome of the Lay-Skilling case a final exam of sorts of the federal government's ability to prove complicated corporate skullduggery.
Enron's implosion and the subsequent scandals vexed Wall Street, sent skittish investors fleeing, increased regulatory scrutiny over publicly traded companies and prompted Congress to stiffen white collar penalties.
Former WorldCom head Bernard Ebbers awaits a 25-year prison term for orchestrating the $11 billion accounting fraud that bankrupted the company. Stewart did five months in prison and more time confined to work and home for lying about a stock sale. Adelphia Communications Inc. founder John Rigas and his son got double-digit prison terms for looting their company. :thumbsup:
HealthSouth Corp. founder Richard Scrushy bucked the trend with his acquittal last year of fraud charges despite five former finance chiefs pointing the finger at him in a $2.7 billion scheme to inflate earnings. He dropped in on the Lay-Skilling case during Fastow's lengthy testimony in March, saying the ex-CFO couldn't be believed.
But those cases were much simpler than that against Lay and Skilling.
The government's vast investigation seemed to stall until Fastow pleaded guilty in January 2004 to two counts of conspiracy and paved the way for prosecutors to secure indictments against his bosses. Fastow also led investigators to Causey, who was bound for trial alongside Lay and Skilling until he broke ranks with their unified defense and pleaded guilty to securities fraud just weeks before the trial began.
You're wrong. People get let out on appeal all the time, provided they can afford the usually very high bail. It's $5M bail in this case.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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Great news. Better than I would have ever hoped. With his low approval rating, I don't think Bush will dare to interfere. I predict long prison sentences. Here's to hoping that both those fsckers rot in prison a long time and then die there, wretched and broken.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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I say you should. No way Bush will pardon them. Even he is not that stupid. He would be immediately impeached and out of office in disgrace. In politics, friendship comes in stacks of green, and Lay doesn't have enough of those left anymore to be friends to anyone.
Presidential pardons take place the day before they leave Office.
Bush will pardon them Jan 19, 2009.
- Oct 30, 2000
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Anything is possible.
I would hope not; however, external pressures can encourage/convince a president to pardon someone for the sake of friendship and then come out with a justification for such actions.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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In your conspiracy theories, you forget the #1 rule of politics. What good has Lay done Bush lately? Or could do after 1/19/09?
Loyalty didn't mean sh!t to Lay before all this, he bribed Republicans and Democrats alike, so I don't think any sense of loyalty is going to save Lay. If that was the case, this never would have even gone to trial. Quite the opposite, IMO. I know you're clueless about the world of finance and economics, Dave, the Bush Admin had a lot to do with bringing down Enron while the Clinton Admin would just look the other way while the law was being broken. Bush gave the SEC its teeth back.
I'm not surprised you would say this. All part of the Republican brainwashing strategy.
"Oh look we slapped our own down".
I hope to God or Allah or whatever the U.S. prays to now that the Sheeple see right through this but sadly I know they won't.
Vic
Elite Member
- Jun 12, 2001
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HAHAHAHA!!! :laugh:
You always seem to forget that there are no poor men in the Congress. Neither Republican nor Democrat. Every one of them is a millionaire or better. In fact, the 5 richest in the Senate are all Democrats (Kerry is the richest, worth almost a billion).
And I have discussed with you before your abuse of the word "sheeple." I suggest you read Orwell's Animal Farm (the origin of the word) before you use it again. It specifically referred to the clueless partisan sheep who would drown out any attempt at intelligent discussion with their mindless partisan rhetoric. Namely you, moron.
Oh btw, what does Vic do for a living? Oh, that's right... finance and banking. He might know a little bit about what's happening in those industries, don't you think?
- Jun 27, 2005
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I'm about 70/30 on the pardon thing. (70 he won't, 30 he will)
We've seen some fairly outrageous last minute pardons at the end of presidential terms recently. Marc Rich anyone?
I'm not convinced he won't do it. I certainly wouldn't bet the farm on it. Like I said... 70/30.
We've seen some fairly outrageous last minute pardons at the end of presidential terms recently. Marc Rich anyone?
I'm not convinced he won't do it. I certainly wouldn't bet the farm on it. Like I said... 70/30.
If Bush had intended to save Lay and Skilling - he would have bailed them out as was the rumour at the time. He severed his ties with them...no way will he pardon.
100% guaranteed he won't pardon them. I'll be right for about the 3,745th time where Dave was wrong. On his death bed he'll say "maybe I was a moron".
100% guaranteed he won't pardon them. I'll be right for about the 3,745th time where Dave was wrong. On his death bed he'll say "maybe I was a moron".
I am a Moron, so what's your point?
I'd rather be a Moron than a brainwashed Bush Regime supporter.
Make that 3,747. Neither am I brainwashed, nor a "Bush Regime Supporter". At least you were right on the moron part.
Care to make a wager Dave on the pardon? I'll bet you any amount you choose you will be wrong. You can't go wrong - you 100% promised! I've been here 6 years, you've been here 7. We'll both be here to settle up. How much?
judasmachine
Diamond Member
- Sep 15, 2002
- 8,515
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- 81
wouldn't it just be great if they had to pay all the people who suffered at their hands all the money they earned while running the frier at McD's.
so i'm a dreamer, leave me alone.
so i'm a dreamer, leave me alone.
Lemon law
Lifer
- Nov 6, 2005
- 20,984
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What is all this useless debate on the question of a Presidential pardon?
Its still a binary black box question that only GWB can answer. And I for one can hardly
be any angrier at GWB regardless. Expecting any intelligence or logic from GWB is and remains
an excersize in futility.
What I want to know is when is the sentencing and how soon thereafter will the prison
doors slam shut on these two sad and sorry human beings---who need to be off the street where they can
do no further damage to our economy.---I can hardly think of any two people who have done more social
damage to our economy---unless you count GWB and Dick Cheney.
Its still a binary black box question that only GWB can answer. And I for one can hardly
be any angrier at GWB regardless. Expecting any intelligence or logic from GWB is and remains
an excersize in futility.
What I want to know is when is the sentencing and how soon thereafter will the prison
doors slam shut on these two sad and sorry human beings---who need to be off the street where they can
do no further damage to our economy.---I can hardly think of any two people who have done more social
damage to our economy---unless you count GWB and Dick Cheney.
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