Electricians - generator to house

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: bctbct
BigJ said

Adding a standby generator to the electrical system of a home, farm or business requires a suitable transfer switch to disconnect the electric loads from the power supplier's utility grid. This is a requirement of the National Electrical Code (see NEC Article 702-6) and all electric power suppliers, for two very good reasons: (1) it prevents the back flow of current into the utility's lines during an outage, which could electrocute linemen working to restore power; and (2) it prevents damage to the generator when regular electric service has been restored, which can destroy the generator.

This exception was added in the 2005 Code. This exception provides requirements for
the connection of loads to a generator without the use of a transfer switch, where the
installation is under the supervision of qualified service personnel. Such applications
often occur when necessary for equipment maintenance or breakdown or when there is
an extended power outage. In such instances, a portable generator can be brought to a
facility and connected to the existing distribution system. The supervision by qualified
personnel is critical to ensuring that a dangerous backfeed condition is not created by
connecting the generator to the system without the benefit of transfer equipment.

You already addressed this for me.

AlienCraft said

Unless you're in Mexico,us folks in the United States, electrical codes are goverend by the NATIONAL Electrical Code, and I will gurantee you that connecting a generator in the manner described via a 220volt outlet being fed in reverse is not acceptable anywhere.
Furthermore, I challenge you to prove otherwise.
If there is a plug with a hot & neutral reversed, that neutral line is now feeding back into the system, the voltage present at the generator, THAT is how a backfeed gets around a standard main breaker thrown OFF.

SEE ABOVE

See italicized portion.
That ain't you.
Unless you remove the neutral connection at the panel, you're in violation of that subsection.
Furthermore, a HOT MALE PLUG never passes as an approved wiring method.
Constructing one of those, plugging your home into your gennie, and backfeeding the line via the neutral will get you.
DON'T DO IT unless you're willing to gamble with a someone else's life by assuming your home wiring is 100% perfect for Hot to Neutral integrity.l

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: AlienCraft

Originally posted by: bctbct
BigJ said

Adding a standby generator to the electrical system of a home, farm or business requires a suitable transfer switch to disconnect the electric loads from the power supplier's utility grid. This is a requirement of the National Electrical Code (see NEC Article 702-6) and all electric power suppliers, for two very good reasons: (1) it prevents the back flow of current into the utility's lines during an outage, which could electrocute linemen working to restore power; and (2) it prevents damage to the generator when regular electric service has been restored, which can destroy the generator.

This exception was added in the 2005 Code. This exception provides requirements for
the connection of loads to a generator without the use of a transfer switch, where the
installation is under the supervision of qualified service personnel. Such applications
often occur when necessary for equipment maintenance or breakdown or when there is
an extended power outage. In such instances, a portable generator can be brought to a
facility and connected to the existing distribution system. The supervision by qualified
personnel is critical to ensuring that a dangerous backfeed condition is not created by
connecting the generator to the system without the benefit of transfer equipment.

You already addressed this for me.

AlienCraft said

Unless you're in Mexico,us folks in the United States, electrical codes are goverend by the NATIONAL Electrical Code, and I will gurantee you that connecting a generator in the manner described via a 220volt outlet being fed in reverse is not acceptable anywhere.
Furthermore, I challenge you to prove otherwise.
If there is a plug with a hot & neutral reversed, that neutral line is now feeding back into the system, the voltage present at the generator, THAT is how a backfeed gets around a standard main breaker thrown OFF.

SEE ABOVE

See italicized portion.
That ain't you.
Unless you remove the neutral connection at the panel, you're in violation of that subsection.
Furthermore, a HOT MALE PLUG never passes as an approved wiring method.
Constructing one of those, plugging your home into your gennie, and backfeeding the line via the neutral will get you.
DON'T DO IT unless you're willing to gamble with a someone else's life by assuming your home wiring is 100% perfect for Hot to Neutral integrity.l

Thank you. I was wondering when you were going to show up btw.

 

[bctbct]

Originally posted by: AlienCraft

Originally posted by: bctbct
BigJ said

Adding a standby generator to the electrical system of a home, farm or business requires a suitable transfer switch to disconnect the electric loads from the power supplier's utility grid. This is a requirement of the National Electrical Code (see NEC Article 702-6) and all electric power suppliers, for two very good reasons: (1) it prevents the back flow of current into the utility's lines during an outage, which could electrocute linemen working to restore power; and (2) it prevents damage to the generator when regular electric service has been restored, which can destroy the generator.

This exception was added in the 2005 Code. This exception provides requirements for
the connection of loads to a generator without the use of a transfer switch, where the
installation is under the supervision of qualified service personnel. Such applications
often occur when necessary for equipment maintenance or breakdown or when there is
an extended power outage. In such instances, a portable generator can be brought to a
facility and connected to the existing distribution system. The supervision by qualified
personnel is critical to ensuring that a dangerous backfeed condition is not created by
connecting the generator to the system without the benefit of transfer equipment.

You already addressed this for me.

AlienCraft said

Unless you're in Mexico,us folks in the United States, electrical codes are goverend by the NATIONAL Electrical Code, and I will gurantee you that connecting a generator in the manner described via a 220volt outlet being fed in reverse is not acceptable anywhere.
Furthermore, I challenge you to prove otherwise.
If there is a plug with a hot & neutral reversed, that neutral line is now feeding back into the system, the voltage present at the generator, THAT is how a backfeed gets around a standard main breaker thrown OFF.

SEE ABOVE

See italicized portion.
That ain't you.
Unless you remove the neutral connection at the panel, you're in violation of that subsection.
Furthermore, a HOT MALE PLUG never passes as an approved wiring method.
Constructing one of those, plugging your home into your gennie, and backfeeding the line via the neutral will get you.
DON'T DO IT unless you're willing to gamble with a someone else's life by assuming your home wiring is 100% perfect for Hot to Neutral integrity.l

Having personally directly supervised about 10 million worth of electrical subcontracts on commercial sites that very well could be me.

Having sought my guidance from a guy that installed a $150K(used) generator at a 60,000 sq ft facility this summer I feel comfortable that using this method of connection for temporary power during an emergency is neither illegal or dangerous if you throw the main breaker.

 

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: AlienCraft

Originally posted by: bctbct
BigJ said

Adding a standby generator to the electrical system of a home, farm or business requires a suitable transfer switch to disconnect the electric loads from the power supplier's utility grid. This is a requirement of the National Electrical Code (see NEC Article 702-6) and all electric power suppliers, for two very good reasons: (1) it prevents the back flow of current into the utility's lines during an outage, which could electrocute linemen working to restore power; and (2) it prevents damage to the generator when regular electric service has been restored, which can destroy the generator.

This exception was added in the 2005 Code. This exception provides requirements for
the connection of loads to a generator without the use of a transfer switch, where the
installation is under the supervision of[I] qualified service personnel. [/i]Such applications
often occur when necessary for equipment maintenance or breakdown or when there is
an extended power outage. In such instances, a portable generator can be brought to a
facility and connected to the existing distribution system. The supervision by qualified
personnel is critical to ensuring that a dangerous backfeed condition is not created by
connecting the generator to the system without the benefit of transfer equipment.

You already addressed this for me.

AlienCraft said

Unless you're in Mexico,us folks in the United States, electrical codes are goverend by the NATIONAL Electrical Code, and I will gurantee you that connecting a generator in the manner described via a 220volt outlet being fed in reverse is not acceptable anywhere.
Furthermore, I challenge you to prove otherwise.
If there is a plug with a hot & neutral reversed, that neutral line is now feeding back into the system, the voltage present at the generator, THAT is how a backfeed gets around a standard main breaker thrown OFF.

SEE ABOVE

See italicized portion.
That ain't you.
Unless you remove the neutral connection at the panel, you're in violation of that subsection.
Furthermore, a HOT MALE PLUG never passes as an approved wiring method.
Constructing one of those, plugging your home into your gennie, and backfeeding the line via the neutral will get you.
DON'T DO IT unless you're willing to gamble with a someone else's life by assuming your home wiring is 100% perfect for Hot to Neutral integrity.l

Thank you. I was wondering when you were going to show up btw.

IT's AC ! DEfender of Electrical Integrity! dunh dummm dummm LOL... thanks well, if they're gonna do it their way, I think the UNWRITTEN rules require :camera:'s so we can see the pretty sparks too!

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: bctbct

Having personally directly supervised about 10 million worth of electrical subcontracts on commercial sites that very well could be me.

Having sought my guidance from a guy that installed a $150K(used) generator at a 60,000 sq ft facility this summer I feel comfortable that using this method of connection for temporary power during an emergency is neither illegal or dangerous if you throw the main breaker.

See I still find this hilarious. I don't give a damn if you friend was personally involved in writing the NEC.

The AHJ says what goes. Not you. Not your friend. Not even the NEC. And naturally, when you don't have anything to fall back on, you whip out your e-penis. How sad.

Do yourself a favor. Head on over to the MikeHolt forums and just browse the forums and see what the licensed electricians over there have to say about a genny and a transfer switch.

 

[Rubycon]

Originally posted by: AlienCraft
... Furthermore, a HOT MALE PLUG never passes as an approved wiring method.
Constructing one of those, plugging your home into your gennie, and backfeeding the line via the neutral will get you.

This needs :camera: 's for validation! :laugh:

That's an old trick I'm told - plugging a genny into a two pole outlet like a dryer or stove. (even a CAC disconnect with heavy 'gators right on the disconnect blades!) and throwing all CB's including main. Start genny then go back and throw ON the circuits you need. Of course the neutral is still going back to the CT of the pole pig...

Now unless the storm has ripped the overhead lines from the peckerhead on your roof - you WILL have a connection to the pole pig (step down transformer). HOWEVER your neighbors are also connected to the SECONDARIES so...

UNLESS you have a large genny that can power everyone on the block it would seem to me IF the main CB was connected the genny would stall or its own CB would open from the seemingly infinite load applied!

But there's more. Even if the main CB is opened and the genny is running IF there is potential running on the neutral which is the CT of the pole pig I suppose potential could exist on the primaries - at much higher voltage (most PP = 7.5kV to 120/240VAC 1F in the United States) so do the math. Even if it's potential only the hazard exists to lineman that's told by his supervisor the line is dead and he gets arc'd with a few 10's of mA potential. Ever touch the secondary of an oil burner ignition transformer? Most are 10kV at 23mA and it FREAKING HURTS like a bitch. Add element of surprise on a bucket truck and well someone could die. Sorry for rambling on but fooling with this stuff is kind of um well irresponsible! Do NOT do it please!

Now I realize in an emergency where YOUR life is at stake (power failure in freezing conditions) you COULD disconnect the neutral wire from the utility side to ensure safety of people working on primaries.

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

 

[bctbct]

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: bctbct

Having personally directly supervised about 10 million worth of electrical subcontracts on commercial sites that very well could be me.

Having sought my guidance from a guy that installed a $150K(used) generator at a 60,000 sq ft facility this summer I feel comfortable that using this method of connection for temporary power during an emergency is neither illegal or dangerous if you throw the main breaker.

See I still find this hilarious. I don't give a damn if you friend was personally involved in writing the NEC.

The AHJ says what goes. Not you. Not your friend. Not even the NEC. And naturally, when you don't have anything to fall back on, you whip out your e-penis. How sad.

Do yourself a favor. Head on over to the MikeHolt forums and just browse the forums and see what the licensed electricians over there have to say about a genny and a transfer switch.

Well if you have been to MIKEHOLT forums I guess I sould take what you say as true. Even though you link the NEC saying it is acceptable.

There is no AHJ for me, I live in the county and the city does not inspect or require that I have a license to do work at my house.

For the record you broke out the e-penis with your friend of a friend of a brother , 4 electricians blah blah.

 

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: bctbct


Having personally directly supervised about 10 million worth of electrical subcontracts on commercial sites that very well could be me.

Having sought my guidance from a guy that installed a $150K(used) generator at a 60,000 sq ft facility this summer I feel comfortable that using this method of connection for temporary power during an emergency is neither illegal or dangerous if you throw the main breaker.

Well , looking back, you did ask if it would work, not if it was legal.
But since you ignore the fact that....
A neutral conductor is a current carrying conductor.
A neutral conductor at the main panel is NEVER switch disconnected by operation of the main breaker, thus that subsection of the 2005 NEC is null and void. ALL three wires coming from the pole need to be isolated from the house wiring, plain and simply put.
Any Hot / Neutral reversal ( a common wiring error in residential construction, especially in older homes with remodels / add-ons) at the plug, or from a light using a swiched neutral instead of a swiched hot ( another common wiring error found in residential construction) will render that open breaker a one armed killer, or an explosive reminder of the fallacy of your plan, when the power comes on.
Your ignoring of that in your response leads me to believe you may have only heard as much as you wanted to hear from that installer or any of us.
You can "do what you want". I'm only advising you do what is SAFE.

Finally , never confuse SUPERVISING a project, with ENGINEERING one.
Every one has their fields of expertise, I daresay Home Electrical Wiring isn't yours.

 

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: Rubycon

Originally posted by: AlienCraft
... Furthermore, a HOT MALE PLUG never passes as an approved wiring method.
Constructing one of those, plugging your home into your gennie, and backfeeding the line via the neutral will get you.

This needs :camera: 's for validation! :laugh:

This is heading for a BADDD Craigslist kind feel... I just know it !!!:laugh:

That's an old trick I'm told - plugging a genny into a two pole outlet like a dryer or stove. (even a CAC disconnect with heavy 'gators right on the disconnect blades!) and throwing all CB's including main. Start genny then go back and throw ON the circuits you need. Of course the neutral is still going back to the CT of the pole pig...

Now unless the storm has ripped the overhead lines from the peckerhead on your roof - you WILL have a connection to the pole pig (step down transformer). HOWEVER your neighbors are also connected to the SECONDARIES so...

UNLESS you have a large genny that can power everyone on the block it would seem to me IF the main CB was connected the genny would stall or its own CB would open from the seemingly infinite load applied!

SSSHHHHHH, he knows it all, already !!! He doesn't care about no stinking transformer.....

But there's more. Even if the main CB is opened and the genny is running IF there is potential running on the neutral which is the CT of the pole pig I suppose potential could exist on the primaries - at much higher voltage (most PP = 7.5kV to 120/240VAC 1F in the United States) so do the math. Even if it's potential only the hazard exists to lineman that's told by his supervisor the line is dead and he gets arc'd with a few 10's of mA potential. Ever touch the secondary of an oil burner ignition transformer? Most are 10kV at 23mA and it FREAKING HURTS like a bitch. Add element of surprise on a bucket truck and well someone could die. Sorry for rambling on but fooling with this stuff is kind of um well irresponsible! Do NOT do it please!

Now I realize in an emergency where YOUR life is at stake (power failure in freezing conditions) you COULD disconnect the neutral wire from the utility side to ensure safety of people working on primaries.

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

See this is exactly why you are soooo HOT !!!!

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: bctbct

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: bctbct

Having personally directly supervised about 10 million worth of electrical subcontracts on commercial sites that very well could be me.

Having sought my guidance from a guy that installed a $150K(used) generator at a 60,000 sq ft facility this summer I feel comfortable that using this method of connection for temporary power during an emergency is neither illegal or dangerous if you throw the main breaker.

See I still find this hilarious. I don't give a damn if you friend was personally involved in writing the NEC.

The AHJ says what goes. Not you. Not your friend. Not even the NEC. And naturally, when you don't have anything to fall back on, you whip out your e-penis. How sad.

Do yourself a favor. Head on over to the MikeHolt forums and just browse the forums and see what the licensed electricians over there have to say about a genny and a transfer switch.

Well if you have been to MIKEHOLT forums I guess I sould take what you say as true. Even though you link the NEC saying it is acceptable.

There is no AHJ for me, I live in the county and the city does not inspect or require that I have a license to do work at my house.

For the record you broke out the e-penis with your friend of a friend of a brother , 4 electricians blah blah.

You mean after you whipped it out and said you had "no less than 10 conversation."

And holy shit. Here's a few things wrong with you defaulting to the 2005 Exemption. First of all, and this is a big one, NOT ALL STATES, CITIES, OR COUNTIES USE THE 2005 EDITION OF THE NEC. Did you get that?

Secondly, I cannot tell you what qualified personnel is. You cannot decide what qualified personnel is. The only person who can is whoever decides the code for your county.

On top of that, did you read what I copied in the 2005 exemption. Lockable disconnect means is not throwing the god damn main CB. Disconnection of the normal supply conductors does not mean throwing the main CB. The whole point of that last section is to make sure that you cannot connect yourself to main lines. A lockable disconnect, at the very least, means that the main CB cannot be turned back on. You're locked out of it. Disconnection of the normal supply conductors is physically removing the connection to your SE wires.

Lastly, YOU HAVE AN AHJ. Everybody has one. It's whatever governing body decides what is legal and proper in your area.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Rubycon
..

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

It's too cold outside. I am going to keep the generator in the livingroom next to the propane fireplace. I am aso going to keep the gasoline can there so I don't have to go outside in the cold to get it to refuel the generator.
That also makes it easier for me to keep an eye on my dynamite. I have it next to the fireplace drying out. It's got all these weird crystals forming on it. Must have gottem wet.

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Rubycon
..

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

It's too cold outside. I am going to keep the generator in the livingroom next to the propane fireplace. I am aso going to keep the gasoline can there so I don't have to go outside in the cold to get it to refuel the generator.
That also makes it easier for me to keep an eye on my dynamite. I have it next to the fireplace drying out. It's got all these weird crystals forming on it. Must have gottem wet.

Is the dynamite stored right next to that bottle of bleach dripping down into the ammonia?

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Rubycon
..

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

It's too cold outside. I am going to keep the generator in the livingroom next to the propane fireplace. I am aso going to keep the gasoline can there so I don't have to go outside in the cold to get it to refuel the generator.
That also makes it easier for me to keep an eye on my dynamite. I have it next to the fireplace drying out. It's got all these weird crystals forming on it. Must have gottem wet.

Is the dynamite stored right next to that bottle of bleach dripping down into the ammonia?

Are you kidding? That's dangerous! :shocked:

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: BigJ

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Rubycon
..

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

It's too cold outside. I am going to keep the generator in the livingroom next to the propane fireplace. I am aso going to keep the gasoline can there so I don't have to go outside in the cold to get it to refuel the generator.
That also makes it easier for me to keep an eye on my dynamite. I have it next to the fireplace drying out. It's got all these weird crystals forming on it. Must have gottem wet.

Is the dynamite stored right next to that bottle of bleach dripping down into the ammonia?

Are you kidding? That's dangerous! :shocked:

:laugh:

 

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: Evadman

Tripping the breaker does not disconnect the neutral. Theoretically it should not matter since neutral is supposed to be tied to ground, so there will not be a voltage on the neutral feed back to the pole. But if something is wrong in your box there will be issues.

the neutral lead from the pole is actually isolated from ground...It only connects AT THE PANEL. the transformer case on the pole is not grounded, and neither are the windings to the case. They "float" above ground potential.

Grounding, within home wiring parameters, is strictly for safety, specifically for referncing the center tapped NEUTRAL conductor to EARTH and not carrying current unbder normal load. HOWEVER it must be sized in order to handle a full in rush current load.
Standard Single Phase Wiring is "unbalanced" like a home stereo wiring is unbalanced, and as such allows for the transfer of high frequency artifacts along the neutral / ground plane.
For truly quiet power, we use center tapped 120 volt transformers with a 60v+ ....com.....60v-.
These balanced power transformers , and the incumbent wiring modifications have recently been adopted into home building codes.
This technology is a direct descendant from the power centers that feed you guys' server farms.

 

[Rubycon]

If you don't use a service entrance transfer switch please make sure one of the dedicated circuits feeds your sarcasm meter. Please!

:laugh:

Wow I hope no one starts a "I want to install an isolated ground circuit for my PC" thread here. :laugh:

 

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Rubycon
..

Oh and for extended run time of those "grass cutter" type small engines - don't forget to keep it completely outdoors. Lots of people die from CO poisoning running it inside a garage or basement! I think more are KILLED from that then shocked or burned from wiring snafus.

It's too cold outside. I am going to keep the generator in the livingroom next to the propane fireplace. I am aso going to keep the gasoline can there so I don't have to go outside in the cold to get it to refuel the generator.
That also makes it easier for me to keep an eye on my dynamite. I have it next to the fireplace drying out. It's got all these weird crystals forming on it. Must have gottem wet.

LOL, did those guys running the meth lab finally move out?
D'OHHHH...

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Rubycon
If you don't use a service entrance transfer switch please make sure one of the dedicated circuits feeds your sarcasm meter. Please!

:laugh:

Wow I hope no one starts a "I want to install an isolated ground circuit for my PC" thread here. :laugh:

Meter

I am just gathering info, I am sure I will use a switch if I decide to wire my generator to the house.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Rubycon
...

Wow I hope no one starts a "I want to install an isolated ground circuit for my PC" thread here. :laugh:

It would be in the wrong forum.

It's amazing what can get people's blood flowing.

 

[AlienCraft]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat

Originally posted by: Rubycon
If you don't use a service entrance transfer switch please make sure one of the dedicated circuits feeds your sarcasm meter. Please!

:laugh:

Wow I hope no one starts a "I want to install an isolated ground circuit for my PC" thread here. :laugh:

Meter

I am just gathering info, I am sure I will use a switch if I decide to wire my generator to the house.

Check out the link I put up there for the reliance controls stuff.

I've installed about 2 dozen of those over the last 20 years and they just keep getting better.
If you can't find one there for your need, we'll call my old man and he'll get one from the hospital contractor.

 

[Rubycon]

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat


Meter

I am just gathering info, I am sure I will use a switch if I decide to wire my generator to the house.

Reminds me of the 260 that was left on O that someone used to check the voltage on the 450VAC distro! :shocked:

 

[BigJ]

For further clarification on the 2005 Exemption, go to this page:

http://www.neccode.com/videodisplaynew.php?pageid=3288

Then play the video. It can be downloaded and played with VLC.

For those who don't know who Mike Holt is:

CODE EXPERT
Mike has devoted his career to studying and understanding the National Electrical Code, a foundation of the electrical industry. Researching the NEC all these years and understanding its background has not only made Mike an expert, but it has earned him the respect of his peers.

Companies and organizations across the United States and Mexico have used his expertise in English and Spanish to help them pinpoint the exact meaning of the NEC. In addition, his insight has been helpful in litigation problems, where the exact meaning of the Code is necessary.

If anybody is going to know the interpretation of the NEC, it's going to be Mike Holt. But again, this does not mean the NEC is the final authority.

 

[bctbct]

Originally posted by: BigJ

You mean after you whipped it out and said you had "no less than 10 conversation."

And holy shit. Here's a few things wrong with you defaulting to the 2005 Exemption. First of all, and this is a big one, NOT ALL STATES, CITIES, OR COUNTIES USE THE 2005 EDITION OF THE NEC. Did you get that?

My first post in this thread said to check your local codes, its not illegal in my city but it might be in yours.

Secondly, I cannot tell you what qualified personnel is. You cannot decide what qualified personnel is. The only person who can is whoever decides the code for your county.

I also mentioned this in a post to you earlier, it is not defined, that makes it an easy standard to meet. Competent personel in construction means...speaks english, comes to work on time.

On top of that, did you read what I copied in the 2005 exemption. Lockable disconnect means is not throwing the god damn main CB. Disconnection of the normal supply conductors does not mean throwing the main CB. The whole point of that last section is to make sure that you cannot connect yourself to main lines. A lockable disconnect, at the very least, means that the main CB cannot be turned back on. You're locked out of it. Disconnection of the normal supply conductors is physically removing the connection to your SE wires.

I am very familar with lock out/tag out procedures, if you go look at your MB right now you will find a small hole through it with a tab for adding a lock. If you want to interpret disconneting from the grid as pulling your service line, go for it, no inspector will interpret it that way.

Lastly, YOU HAVE AN AHJ. Everybody has one. It's whatever governing body decides what is legal and proper in your area.[/quote]


The question in this thread was will it work?- yes it will

Next topic was is it legal? If your city is bound by the NEC, yes it is.

You guys can talk all about equipment failure or miss-wiring etc. if you want because its the only thing you have to latch onto to make this a bad idea.

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Rubycon

Originally posted by: oldsmoboat


Meter

I am just gathering info, I am sure I will use a switch if I decide to wire my generator to the house.

Reminds me of the 260 that was left on O that someone used to check the voltage on the 450VAC distro! :shocked:

My little $25 craftsman multimeter has a protection circuit.

I did burn up one years ago by testing for 110v when I had it set to ohms.

 

[BigJ]

Originally posted by: bctbct
The question in this thread was will it work?- yes it will

Next topic was is it legal? If your city is bound by the NEC, yes it is.

You guys can talk all about equipment failure or miss-wiring etc. if you want because its the only thing you have to latch onto to make this a bad idea.

:roll:

It's utterly useless with you. No, it is not legal as per the NEC. The exemption spells out certain requirements that have to be met. Flipping the main CB and thinking you're done is not it.

You do realize one of the huge purposes of the NEC is safety in case of mis wiring, accidents, or equipment failure, right?

On top of this, you MUST use a manual transfer switch if your area uses the 2002 code. No ifs, ands, or buts about that.