Does a president need to uphold the Constitution? Trump says 'I don't know'

[fskimospy]

"I don't know."

MAGA 2025!

January 6th is all you need to know about Trump “upholding” our Constitution.

Yeah not sure why this is even news. He literally already attempted a coup so we know with absolute certainty that he doesn’t care about upholding the constitution.

 

[fskimospy]

Are we going to pretend that the answer isn't obvious? Clearly Trump swore an oath and has to uphold it.
Homer has a fixation on the few here that don't share his belief system, that's a Homer problem, not a greenman problem. Or perhaps it is my problem in that I don't care who agrees or disagrees with me. My beliefs aren't going to change in the hope that I'll be popular. The concept of doing such a thing makes me feel dirty.

You are correct the answer is obvious but not in the way you think.

The guy attempted to overthrow the constitution in a coup so it’s completely obvious that he doesn’t care about following it.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Yet you still voted for and appear to still support the man who's actions and now words say otherwise. If that doesn't make you feel dirty..........

For a lot of fully indoctrinated MAGA cultist, I'd bet they could be personally thrown in Jail without due process, and still support Trump.

So a little thing like Trump weaseling out of upholding the constitution is not going to phase them in the slightest.

 

[fskimospy]

For a lot of fully indoctrinated MAGA cultist, I'd bet they could be personally thrown in Jail without due process, and still support Trump.

So a little thing like Trump weaseling out of upholding the constitution is not going to phase them in the slightest.

There's already plenty of historical precedent for this in cults of personality. There's the famous phrase 'if only Hitler (or Stalin, etc.) knew!', meaning that when you see evil things happening in authoritarian dictatorships it's only because the benevolent leader wasn't aware of it happening, not that he designed the system to do exactly that.

Some people definitely used it sarcastically but plenty meant it. The leader would never betray them!

 

[eelw]

For a lot of fully indoctrinated MAGA cultist, I'd bet they could be personally thrown in Jail without due process, and still support Trump.

So a little thing like Trump weaseling out of upholding the constitution is not going to phase them in the slightest.

Like people where their family member has been detained or worse deported haven’t changed their support. Others affected by the DOGE cuts the same. Let’s see what happens when this tariff war really affects prices for consumers. But not holding my breath that any of these MAGAtards will regret their vote.

Same for us here in Canada. People doubling down on their support for Poilievre and Smith knowing very well they want to steer the country exactly like our American neighbours.

 

[hal2kilo]

I'm not from the USA, but isn't that the main part of the Oath of Office?

https://www.npr.org/2025/05/04/g-s1-64239/does-a-president-need-to-uphold-the-constitution-trump-says-i-dont-know

That sounds like: My Lawyers and hand picked Supreme court, are giving me enough wiggle room to violate the constitution at will.

I also didn't find this part, particularly reassuring:



My take on this, is that Trump believes threats will be enough, so he won't need to do a Military invasion, but in the "unlikely" event that we reject being part of the 4th Reich... Poland 1939...

It's part of the oath of office . There's no but if's.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Same for us here in Canada. People doubling down on their support for Poilievre and Smith knowing very well they want to steer the country exactly like our American neighbours.

Yeah, I'm in Canada, and we got lucky this time, but it was too close, and the Canadian Conservatives are doubling down on what they figure brought them success: Right wing populism, scapegoating, hate mongering, and dog whistling. With a minority they will spend all their time trying to bring down the government. I'm not hopeful they can be kept at bay for long.

 

[fskimospy]

Yeah, I'm in Canada, and we got lucky this time, but it was too close, and the Canadian Conservatives are doubling down on what they figure brought them success: Right wing populism, scapegoating, hate mongering, and dog whistling. With a minority they will spend all their time trying to bring down the government. I'm not hopeful they can be kept at bay for long.

I’m not sure if ensuring maybe the greatest polling collapse in a country’s history should be defined as ‘success’.

 

[Heartbreaker]

I’m not sure if ensuring maybe the greatest polling collapse in a country’s history should be defined as ‘success’.

Don't fall into wishful thinking. Conservative Vote didn't collapse much at all, it was within a couple of points all across. All the vote shifting mainly took place on the Center/Left.

So we should still be concerned about the final outcome even if early polling showed much worse results.

This was the highest percent of the Popular Vote Conservatives have had in over 40 years, and highest seat count they won in 14 years.

The real collapse was the NDP vote, making this into a much closer two party race. We can't count on that again.

If the Conservatives just hold there current support and the NDP springs back to split center/left voters as is the norm in Canada, the Conservatives will Win next time.

 

[fskimospy]

Don't fall into wishful thinking. Conservative Vote didn't collapse much at all, it was within a couple of points all across. All the vote shifting mainly took place on the Center/Left.

So we should still be concerned about the final outcome even if early polling showed much worse results.

This was the highest percent of the Popular Vote Conservatives have had in over 40 years, and highest seat count they won in 14 years.

The real collapse was the NDP vote, making this into a much closer two party race. We can't count on that again.

If the Conservatives just hold there current support and the NDP springs back to split center/left voters as is the norm in Canada, the Conservatives will Win next time.

They might be able to win in the future, sure. We also need to live in reality though which is in the course of a few months they went from an all but guaranteed massive victory to a loss.

This is not indicative of a successful strategy.

 

[Heartbreaker]

They might be able to win in the future, sure. We also need to live in reality though which is in the course of a few months they went from an all but guaranteed massive victory to a loss.

This is not indicative of a successful strategy.

You are learning the wrong lesson. We got ridiculously lucky. The LPC ditched a deeply unpopular leader, and had the near perfect Candidate replace him, then we had Trump repeatedly talk about annexing Canada, then attack our economy with unjustified tariffs, and we had the NDP implode.

All of that happened in the LPC favor and the CPC only lost about 3% off their support. Their support is stunningly stable and the highest it's been in over 40 years.

I'm almost having Deja Vu from when Biden beat Trump, and people were writing off Trump.

 

[fskimospy]

You are learning the wrong lesson. We got ridiculously lucky. The LPC ditched a deeply unpopular leader, and had the near perfect Candidate replace him, then we had Trump repeatedly talk about annexing Canada, then attack our economy with unjustified tariffs, and we had the NDP implode.

All of that happened in the LPC favor and the CPC only lost about 3% off their support. Their support is stunningly stable and the highest it's been in over 40 years.

I'm almost having Deja Vu from when Biden beat Trump, and people were writing off Trump.

You seem to be arguing a position that nobody holds?

The conservative strategy obviously failed as shown by the election results. If it were a successful strategy it would not have failed. This does not mean they can never win an election in the future, but going this way was extremely obviously a bad move this cycle.

 

[manly]

I'm not from the USA, but isn't that the main part of the Oath of Office?

https://www.npr.org/2025/05/04/g-s1-64239/does-a-president-need-to-uphold-the-constitution-trump-says-i-dont-know

That sounds like: My Lawyers and hand picked Supreme court, are giving me enough wiggle room to violate the constitution at will.

I also didn't find this part, particularly reassuring:



My take on this, is that Trump believes threats will be enough, so he won't need to do a Military invasion, but in the "unlikely" event that we reject being part of the 4th Reich... Poland 1939...

Just a rare moment of honesty from Donny.

Trump is an unserious imbecile, so who cares what he "thinks" and says? It's hard to imagine what kind of political crisis it would take in Canada for Trump's "threat" of annexation to manifest without a U.S. military invasion. Same goes for the Panama Canal or Greenland. It wouldn't be hard for Trump to order an invasion somewhere, but obviously that ignites an international crisis. America would instantly become a pariah state like Putin's Russia.

Don't get me wrong; this administration is evil and fucked up and we don't want to rule out extreme scenarios just because they are highly implausible. But let's take the annexation of Canada, for example. Is there any policy that Ottawa can take to counter Trump's threat? It's not like you're going to beef up your military to repel a superpower. Obviously you'll have to navigate this dumb trade war and the likely global recession; but to some degree, the world has little choice but to deal with a madman. Most world leaders know by now that pretending to let Trump win is about all you have to do.

 

[nakedfrog]

Just a rare moment of honesty from Donny.

Trump is an unserious imbecile, so who cares what he "thinks" and says? It's hard to imagine what kind of political crisis it would take in Canada for Trump's "threat" of annexation to manifest without a U.S. military invasion. Same goes for the Panama Canal or Greenland. It wouldn't be hard for Trump to order an invasion somewhere, but obviously that ignites an international crisis. America would instantly become a pariah state like Putin's Russia.

Don't get me wrong; this administration is evil and fucked up and we don't want to rule out extreme scenarios just because they are highly implausible. But let's take the annexation of Canada, for example. Is there any policy that Ottawa can take to counter Trump's threat? It's not like you're going to beef up your military to repel a superpower. Obviously you'll have to navigate this dumb trade war and the likely global recession; but to some degree, the world has little choice but to deal with a madman. Most world leaders know by now that pretending to let Trump win is about all you have to do.

TBH he probably doesn't even really care if they hold up their end of the deal, it's appearing to have made a deal that's important. He doesn't honor his deals, why would he expect them to?

 

[Heartbreaker]

You seem to be arguing a position that nobody holds?

The conservative strategy obviously failed as shown by the election results. If it were a successful strategy it would not have failed. This does not mean they can never win an election in the future, but going this way was extremely obviously a bad move this cycle.

It only failed because of confluence of extraordinary luck. With everything stacked against them they still had their biggest vote share in 40+ years.

We didn't win because of their failed strategy, we won only because of blind luck creating a confluence of events in our favor.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Most world leaders know by now that pretending to let Trump win is about all you have to do.

How do you pretend to let him win at annexing your country? He wants his place in the history books next to Hitler, and that requires conquest.

I think only domestic unrest will keep him from conquest, and there doesn't seem to be much domestic resistance to his complete takeover.

 

[fskimospy]

It only failed because of confluence of extraordinary luck. With everything stacked against them they still had their biggest vote share in 40+ years.

We didn't win because of their failed strategy, we won only because of blind luck creating a confluence of events in our favor.

It’s kind of incredible to ascribe no agency to the biggest electoral collapse in Canadian history.

But hey, you do you.

 

[pmv]

I have heard the 47 didn't actually touch the Bible he was swearing on. Kinda like crossing your fingers behind your back when you are a 5 yr old.

Well we all know that's because one or the other (either Trump or the Book) would have burst into flame.

(Wasn't it held indoors? Would have been a complete pain had it set off the sprinklers)

 

[manly]

How do you pretend to let him win at annexing your country? He wants his place in the history books next to Hitler, and that requires conquest.

I think only domestic unrest will keep him from conquest, and there doesn't seem to be much domestic resistance to his complete takeover.

Annexing Canada or Greenland is just a completely unserious idea, and unless Trump wants America to be a pariah state, he has no cards to play.

Obviously I wasn't referring to pretending to let Trump annex Canada, as no such thing is possible. My point is that you can't literally plan for all contingencies (i.e. repulsing an invasion*); but from a distance, Mark Carney seems to be doing fine. Trump is obviously trying to push Canada into a recession, imagining that will force Ottawa to bend the knee. (Mind you, his global trade war pushes everyone into a recession.)

So the entire world has to play ball with Trump and pretend that he wins his trade war. Obviously it's tricky and not all countries will take the same strategy. As an American, I support Canada's and China's decision to play "hardball," so to speak. Other countries like Japan and South Korea have chosen to play nice, at least for now.

* Frankly if you think Poland 1939 is the end game, then there's nothing you or anyone can do. The dominant superpower invading a NATO ally is so far off the charts that you can't plan for it to happen, and you couldn't stop it if it did. The Panama Canal seems like a much easier "take," but even that is rather unlikely IMO.

 

[Heartbreaker]

It’s kind of incredible to ascribe no agency to the biggest electoral collapse in Canadian history.

Who said no agency? You have to assign the agency were it belongs. As is often the case, it's external factors that can cost a party the election.

If Trump kept his mouth shut and they won the election would you claim they had a great strategy?

It was a confluence of external events beyond their control.

The only party that collapsed was the NDP, which is beyond CPC control. These were historic lows for the NDP. Literally the worse results ever.

Trump attacking Canada had more of those NDP left leaning voters vote the more left leaning Liberals.

The LPC also switched candidates from Trudeau who was far beyond his best before date and deeply unpopular. To a dream candidate, who also reversed their most unpopular policy immediately (Carbon Tax).

Three Major events stacked up simultaneously to shift the outcome.

It's not that CPC strategy failed. It's that the opposition got a giant stack of 3 Hail Mary passes at exactly the right moment.

 

[Heartbreaker]

Annexing Canada or Greenland is just a completely unserious idea, and unless Trump wants America to be a pariah state, he has no cards to play.

I think the guy that launched a trade war against the world, told all NATO treaty allies that if they want US help, the have to pay for it, ended US humanitarian aid, sided with Russia in the Ukraine war, is perfectly happy to have USA be a Pariah State.

Trump cares about his place in history (and his idea of role model is literally Hitler), not that people like the USA.

Trump doesn't care at all about good will. He figures no matter what he does, everyone has to trade with USA whether they want to or not.

 

[Jaskalas]

For a lot of fully indoctrinated MAGA cultist, I'd bet they could be personally thrown in Jail without due process, and still support Trump.

Can we? Don't tease us a good time.

 

[Indus]

I think the guy that launched a trade war against the world, told all NATO treaty allies that if they want US help, the have to pay for it, ended US humanitarian aid, sided with Russia in the Ukraine war, is perfectly happy to have USA be a Pariah State.

Trump cares about his place in history (and his idea of role model is literally Hitler), not that people like the USA.

Trump doesn't care at all about good will. He figures no matter what he does, everyone has to trade with USA whether they want to or not.

He's a mob boss.. pay up and kiss the ring.

No you watch my back and I watch your back agreement which benefits both sides.

 

[fskimospy]

Who said no agency? You have to assign the agency were it belongs. As is often the case, it's external factors that can cost a party the election.

If Trump kept his mouth shut and they won the election would you claim they had a great strategy?

It was a confluence of external events beyond their control.

The only party that collapsed was the NDP, which is beyond CPC control. These were historic lows for the NDP. Literally the worse results ever.

Trump attacking Canada had more of those NDP left leaning voters vote the more left leaning Liberals.

The LPC also switched candidates from Trudeau who was far beyond his best before date and deeply unpopular. To a dream candidate, who also reversed their most unpopular policy immediately (Carbon Tax).

Three Major events stacked up simultaneously to shift the outcome.

It's not that CPC strategy failed. It's that the opposition got a giant stack of 3 Hail Mary passes at exactly the right moment.

You are literally arguing for no agency. After all, if events were purely determinative then they had no agency. You’re agreeing with me!

I think the conservatives choosing to embrace Trumpism was a giant mistake and they paid the price. If they continue the same electoral strategy they will pay the price again.

 

[Heartbreaker]

You are literally arguing for no agency. After all, if events were purely determinative then they had no agency. You’re agreeing with me!

They had agency in their campaign messaging, and budget decisions, but the big factors were indeed the big external events this time.

That is reality, sometime events beyond your control dominate.

I think the conservatives choosing to embrace Trumpism was a giant mistake and they paid the price. If they continue the same electoral strategy they will pay the price again.

That's the same wishful thinking I saw after Biden won.