Do you consider this to be racism/hate speech

[Amused]

I think POC know their reality better than we do. And once more studies back that up.

So I’ll lend more weight to POC about their experiences than non-POC pontificating on POC experiences.

It's amusing to listen to people who aren't black go on and on about how blacks are wrong about what they experience. This very thread and the condemnation of those articles is proof of that very thing.

 

[Snarf Snarf]

It's amusing to listen to people who aren't black go on and on about how blacks are wrong about what they experience. This very thread and the condemnation of those articles is proof of that very thing.

Honestly as POC we get used to it. It's frustrating as hell, but you learn to not give into anger and continue to have intellectual discussion regardless of whether the other party is interested in engaging in it. I was raised with the idea that I can never allow a racist to make me become what they think I should be. Walk the better educated high road in arguments, never let an ignorant person make you behave like them. I've never encountered a bigot I couldn't eventually get to respect me, through intelligent and concise dialogue, and a refusal to allow myself to be labeled as anything other than an American.

We've made great strides this century but there's still a long way to go when it comes to the cultural element of racism. Everyone plays their part, take every opportunity that arises to educate your fellow Americans, and make the change happen one person at a time.

 

[BonzaiDuck]

The latest sense of this I've observed most recently comes from a 70-year-old white, Irish-German Chicagoan who had come to California at age 10. At various times, he exhibited apologist views for Germany in World War II. He may have voted against Trump, but he's constantly trying to excuse the ignorance of "the Base." And always -- always -- I hear this story about how blacks in Chicago destroyed his neighborhood. This was also a theme of others I knew in the same So. Cal milieu from the Midwest, whining about how blacks "destroyed" their neighborhood (housing values) after housing discrimination became illegal in the '60s and '70s.

Those neighborhoods were always vulnerable to decline, with or without a black presence. But it's really the same argument you could find from white college-aspirants who didn't get accepted at this or that university, blaming their troubles solely on affirmative-action and quotas.

One could argue this is similar to an attitude we perceive among climate change deniers. They don't want to be responsible for the 200+ years of accumulated CO2 emissions. Why should they bear the inconvenience of a reduced life-style because a bunch of dead people already poisoned the planet?

And so, why should we hardworking working-class white people suffer setbacks because blacks were mistreated for 400 years? Most of the setbacks are imaginary. You can be unhappy about a lot of things, but it always helps to have an easily-identifiable scapegoat.

Besides -- "we're white." "America was a great place -- once -- for 'white people'."

Ultimately, I see this as a problem of diminishing-majority racial identity and the dilemma of choosing sides. Frustrated white people need to consider rejoining the Human Race and rejecting their sense of privilege.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Is it me or does the op seem so very, very concerned?

 

[UberNeuman]

Is it me or does the op seem so very, very concerned?

Very concerned and with a lot of free time.

 

[MrSquished]

I read some of the articles of the most extreme titles. They weren't racist at all, they just used sensationalist headlines to get clicks.

 

[pmv]

But you can view it however you please, I don't give a crap what people think, I just deal with the real world as it is presented each day. But there are certain places where even white people or other various ethnicities can't go without being treated like how any minority is treated.

But the crucial difference is that white people generally don't _have_ to go to those places. And those places tend not to come to them. That's where there is no symmetry.

Meh, this thread is educational for me in seeing just how damaged at least some white Americans have been by the country's messed-up history, and just how far they are from being able to see the world as it is. (And I wouldn't dream of claiming it's only Americans...though it seems to manifest different ways in different countries).

 

[BonzaiDuck]

Very concerned and with a lot of free time.

That's an interesting concept.

I have another similar thought. What would've happened, if the military draft had not been discontinued? The draft ended in part because we were using draftees as cannon-fodder in unwisely-chosen military conflicts.

Would we have all this Trumpie discontent, anger and whining if a greater number of citizens had been "socialized" through the draft?

By socialization, I mean a similar phenomenon to the objective and result of establishing public schools when there had been large-scale immigration of people from Europe -- among other origins.

One aspect of that process would be described as a suppression of the narcissistic individualism among people as opposed to an indoctrination of a collective "we."

 

[Commodus]

What is the much larger problem? And yes I’ll discuss the answer, where am I not.

The larger problem of white-on-black racism and your attempt to suggest that pointing out that racism is somehow racist. Farrakhan was a distraction by trying to shift the focus to black-on-white racism.

So, will you actually discuss those headlines instead of parroting what Daily Caller told you to think?

 

[realibrad]

Not personally.

But you know what I have done? I've listened to them. I take their word, and the statistical evidence and combine it to form an accurate picture of what life is like for them.

And the one thing I have not done is disagree with them from a position of ignorance based on my privilege. Which is what a lot of you here do.

You sir, seem to ignore that Black people, like all people, have varied and prolific views. If you believe there is a unified native then you have missed the plot. I find it dubious at best, and arrogant at worst while most likely that you believe you know what Black people experience.

 

[realibrad]

I think POC know their reality better than we do. And once more studies back that up.

So I’ll lend more weight to POC about their experiences than non-POC pontificating on POC experiences.

And do you believe their views are all the same?

 

[realibrad]

The larger problem of white-on-black racism and your attempt to suggest that pointing out that racism is somehow racist. Farrakhan was a distraction by trying to shift the focus to black-on-white racism.

So, will you actually discuss those headlines instead of parroting what Daily Caller told you to think?

Why is racism not THE problem? Seems to have the same solution regardless the race of the people.

 

[Amused]

You sir, seem to ignore that Black people, like all people, have varied and prolific views. If you believe there is a unified native then you have missed the plot. I find it dubious at best, and arrogant at worst while most likely that you believe you know what Black people experience.

Projectionism 101 right here folks. Accusing me of what your intentions are to justify your denial of their own experiences.

I'm taking their fairly unified word for it. And yes, the black community has a pretty clear consensus on what their experience in America is.

Double logical fallacy in 3..2..

 

[mindless1]

nvm wrong topic

 

[Victorian Gray]

Is it me or does the op seem so very, very concerned?

Isn't he always?

 

[Paratus]

It's amusing to listen to people who aren't black go on and on about how blacks are wrong about what they experience. This very thread and the condemnation of those articles is proof of that very thing.

It is, but it’s unfortunately not surprising. One of the studies I’ve linked in the past, (which exposes minority or non-minority subjects to blatant or subtle racism and then measured cognitive deficits caused by that exposure), showed this.

For blatant racism both minorities and non-minorities identified the blatantly racist scenario. Interestingly non-minorities performed worse on the cognitive test compared to a control while the minorities only had a very slight performance deficit indicating good coping skills.

For subtle racism non-minorities showed almost no deficit on the cognitive test indicating most non-minority subjects didn’t notice the subtle racism (confirmed by comments made by subjects about the scenario) while minorities did detect the subtle racism and it negatively impacted their cognitive test.

So what does all this mean for folks like @UglyCasanova ?

The study suggests they’ll identify blatant cases of racism. When they say they have or haven’t seen racism this is the racism they mean.

When it comes to subtle forms of bias they won’t see it. Even though it’s impacts are measurable on minorities they won’t see it.

That’s why we get these we threads. He ‘knows’ what racism is and he’s seen it. We keep telling him something he can’t see exists. Ergo we must be full of BS.

 

[Commodus]

Why is racism not THE problem? Seems to have the same solution regardless the race of the people.

Racism is the problem, but white-on-black racism is the predominant issue, and there are particular issues to address in that space.

Think of it this way: when there's one house on fire, you don't have fire trucks pour water on every house in the neighborhood to be "fair." You acknowledge and deal with risks to the other houses, but you devote most of your energy to the actual burning house.

 

[Paratus]

And do you believe their views are all the same?

I believe statistically the bulk of any group will share similar experiences and similar views tend to rise from similar experiences.

Any two specific individuals would have to be compared individually.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Isn't he always?

yup. deeply and genuinely concerned, so very, very concerned.

 

[mindless1]

Targeting any race, making a negative statement, of course it's racist.

That's what racists do even if they try to be sneaky about it. Sad fscks who walk around all day consumed by hate that's only tempered by a minimum level of politically correctness. Sane people have better things to do.

 

[Victorian Gray]

yup. deeply and genuinely concerned, so very, very concerned.

He's even become concerned about being concerned. Now that is a lot of concern.

 

[Jaskalas]

There is no war on White America, it's entirely a fantasy created by those who wish to halt actual progress in regards to healing the racial divide of this nation.

There are folks on "both sides" who wish to halt progress. On the Right they talk in supremacist tones and of people having a place. On the Left they talk of privilege and reparations. Of affirmative action. That race must continue to be a factor in our lives. Thing is, there are POC who have "made it". They are better off, have escaped out from under the lash of poverty. And for their upper "class" they are fully accepted. They are not defined by the color of their skin but the content of their character. Or rather the thickness of their wallet.

And so my perspective is thus. Justice is blind. So too must race relations be blind, to not recognize race or ethnicity to forge a true and inclusive path forward, together. Instead of raising divisions and speaking of hate, we can journey together and work towards healing. Much of the damage done to POC, especially black families, has been a legacy of poverty. With proper economic reform we can solve that inequality. Part of modern America's racism is borne not of a racial divide, but a class and cultural divide. We eliminate a lot of the problem by bridging those divides.

We have 200+ years of history as a deeply racist nation and anyone who expects to fix this issue in 40 years needs to share some of that good stuff they're smoking.

It has been 54 years since the Civil Rights movement. You missed a decade? It was before my time.

Constant reminders are necessary, and no, white people do not get to decide when the racial divide has been healed and claim to be victims of a race war.

Reminders to oppose supremacists, and racists, sure. But what else? Do we want to be reminded of our divisions? Of mankind's tribal instinct to stereotype and hate upon the "other"? That'd be a terrible mistake to prey upon the weakness of human nature. To say that white people have no voice in the matter.

Look to my economic solution if you value the idea of rising together as a nation, as one people.

 

[realibrad]

Racism is the problem, but white-on-black racism is the predominant issue, and there are particular issues to address in that space.

Think of it this way: when there's one house on fire, you don't have fire trucks pour water on every house in the neighborhood to be "fair." You acknowledge and deal with risks to the other houses, but you devote most of your energy to the actual burning house.

What unique solutions are there to solve white on black racism that is different than other racism?

 

[realibrad]

I believe statistically the bulk of any group will share similar experiences and similar views tend to rise from similar experiences.

Any two specific individuals would have to be compared individually.

So how many black people must one listen to before they can know the truth? Amused seems to have talked to enough to know their plight. Would you say you have talked to enough to know their story?

Personally I have talked to many black people and while many have complained of racism many others have not.

My mom took in one of my sister's friends in Junior high when her mom went to jail for drugs. She lived with us for 5 years. She got far more hate from her old black friends for turning white than she ever did from white people. She got a whole lot more from her family when she went to Yale to get her law degree.

From what she tells me, many successful Black people get more hate from other Blacks than Whites.

I also know an excutive at Uber that is Black. She is there most amazing Black woman I know. She ranks behind my fiancee in terms of women I respect. Her experience seems to be a 50/50 split.

So, should I believe the Black people in my life, or ones in Amused's?

 

[96Firebird]

But the crucial difference is that white people generally don't _have_ to go to those places. And those places tend not to come to them. That's where there is no symmetry.

Quoting this for the laughs, I can't believe people actually think this way.

If this is how you truly feel, you are one racist fuck.