DNC (Democratic National Convention) Thread

[MovingTarget]

C - L - A - S - S - Y !!!

I don't know whether I should be laughing or crying here. Maybe both. I hope it isn't something you take to be serious truth. D:D:

 

[emperus]

I was impressed by the night. Some really great speaches.

 

[Bowfinger]

Can't really, working and was casually listening to it from across the house. Basically it's just like Ann's speech for Romney, a bunch of pull at the heart BS, make sure to get every demographic and talking point in, blah blah blah. Predictable is really the best sumation. I'm just amazed people buy into any of it.

You can't possibly have thought all that was from the heart, exactly what she really feels, means, and without the benefit of a speech writer and re-election, what she really thinks, right? Please tell me you're not that naive?

Chuck

I never think any politician speaks 100% from the heart. Every word is considered at that level of politics. That said, this doesn't mean the words are false. I heard nothing in the portion I caught that caused me to doubt her veracity or sincerity, generally speaking. It all seemed factually plausible and consistent with what we already know about the Obamas.

That is why I asked you to provide specifics, bit it appears you weren't actually listening. If you had been, you should be able to challenge at least one or two specific points. I know I did during both Ann Romney's and Paul Ryan's speech, hearing specific claims I immediately thought sounded bogus. I couldn't do that after Mitt's speech, however, because it didn't hold my attention. Since I had no basis for criticizing it other than it was boring, that's all I said about it in the GOP convention thread. I didn't toss out empty, gratuitous attacks like, "who buys this shit? (other than little splooge sucking partisans)."

 

[CallMeJoe]

It's CRYFEST!

I still don't see John Boehner. Where are you spotting him?

 

[chucky2]

I never think any politician speaks 100% from the heart. Every word is considered at that level of politics. That said, this doesn't mean the words are false. I heard nothing in the portion I caught that caused me to doubt her veracity or sincerity, generally speaking. It all seemed factually plausible and consistent with what we already know about the Obamas.

That is why I asked you to provide specifics, bit it appears you weren't actually listening. If you had been, you should be able to challenge at least one or two specific points. I know I did during both Ann Romney's and Paul Ryan's speech, hearing specific claims I immediately thought sounded bogus. I couldn't do that after Mitt's speech, however, because it didn't hold my attention. Since I had no basis for criticizing it other than it was boring, that's all I said about it in the GOP convention thread. I didn't toss out empty, gratuitous attacks like, "who buys this shit? (other than little splooge sucking partisans)."

Of course nothing she said would cause you to doubt it, she purposefully keeps things general, PC, and pro-American. Who's going to have any issues with her being 'mom in chief', blah blah blah. The whole speech is a fluff piece to reel people in and generate symbiotic patriotism, ethnicity, gender, you name it. It's generated to touch as many people as possible, to share the same values, concerns, emotions, etc. as all those potential voters (and, don't forget the base).

She did a great job at it like I said, I'm not knocking that. I'm just mystified by people going gaga over it not from the 'she delivered a great speech' in the technical sense, but rather, the OMG, I'm a mom, and she's 'mom in chief', I can so identifiy with that....puke...

Please people, she's a Politicians wife who's running for re-election. That whole speech was crafted, rehersed, and delivered to help reel your vote in. For those undecideds who actually believed any of that...I've got a bridge to sell you...

Chuck

 

[UberNeuman]

C - L - A - S - S - Y !!!

I don't know whether I should be laughing or crying here. Maybe both. I hope it isn't something you take to be serious truth. D:D:

The GOP obsession over the Clinton penis has trans-morphed into the obsession over the Fluke's vagina.....

 

[Bowfinger]

Of course nothing she said would cause you to doubt it, she purposefully keeps things general, PC, and pro-American. Who's going to have any issues with her being 'mom in chief', blah blah blah. The whole speech is a fluff piece to reel people in and generate symbiotic patriotism, ethnicity, gender, you name it. It's generated to touch as many people as possible, to share the same values, concerns, emotions, etc. as all those potential voters (and, don't forget the base).

She did a great job at it like I said, I'm not knocking that. I'm just mystified by people going gaga over it not from the 'she delivered a great speech' in the technical sense, but rather, the OMG, I'm a mom, and she's 'mom in chief', I can so identifiy with that....puke...

OK, I'm mostly with you up to this point. Certainly, lots of platitudes intended to resonate with voters. That is one of the purposes of such speeches, and how effectively that is done is what differentiates a "great" speech from a poor one.

Please people, she's a Politicians wife who's running for re-election. That whole speech was crafted, rehersed, and delivered to help reel your vote in. For those undecideds who actually believed any of that...I've got a bridge to sell you...

Chuck

And that is where you fly off the rail into blind partisanship. It's one thing to claim a speech is fluffy and light on content. It's something else entirely to insinuate it was dishonest, and therefore not to be believed. It is quite possible for a reasonable person to believe the sincerity of the platitudes while still recognizing there was little meat.

 

[PJABBER]

Of course nothing she said would cause you to doubt it, she purposefully keeps things general, PC, and pro-American. Who's going to have any issues with her being 'mom in chief', blah blah blah. The whole speech is a fluff piece to reel people in and generate symbiotic patriotism, ethnicity, gender, you name it. It's generated to touch as many people as possible, to share the same values, concerns, emotions, etc. as all those potential voters (and, don't forget the base).

She did a great job at it like I said, I'm not knocking that. I'm just mystified by people going gaga over it not from the 'she delivered a great speech' in the technical sense, but rather, the OMG, I'm a mom, and she's 'mom in chief', I can so identifiy with that....puke...

Please people, she's a Politicians wife who's running for re-election. That whole speech was crafted, rehersed, and delivered to help reel your vote in. For those undecideds who actually believed any of that...I've got a bridge to sell you...

Chuck

I agree with this.

The delivery was quite good, Michelle came across as a very polished speaker. Only by having been exposed to her for the past four years have we gotten to know that the motivations are not what she laid out tonight.

In fact, the takeaway from the night is that the Obamas and the Democrat Party do not believe in private enterprise or individual entrepreneurship.

EVERY problem can and must be solved by government. And the solutions that were proffered came from only one source - the government.

That is an astonishing perspective for a capitalist society, but it is singularly unsurprising coming from Michelle and the rest of tonight's cast.

 

[Bowfinger]

I agree with this.

The delivery was quite good, Michelle came across as a very polished speaker. Only by having been exposed to her for the past four years have we gotten to know that the motivations are not what she laid out tonight.

In fact, the takeaway from the night is that the Obamas and the Democrat Party do not believe in private enterprise or individual entrepreneurship.

EVERY problem can and must be solved by government. And the solutions that were proffered came from only one source - the government.

That is an astonishing perspective for a capitalist society, but it is singularly unsurprising coming from Michelle and the rest of tonight's cast.

I'd challenge you to back up any of that with actual quotes, but I know that would be a waste of time. This is your usual scripted GOP shilling that would remain unchanged no matter what Obama said. Your opinions are therefore irrelevant, based on nothing but blind partisan fealty. (Perhaps when you get new talking points tomorrow, you can repost a few as if they are your own ideas.)

 

[chucky2]

snip


And that is where you fly off the rail into blind partisanship. It's one thing to claim a speech is fluffy and light on content. It's something else entirely to insinuate it was dishonest, and therefore not to be believed. It is quite possible for a reasonable person to believe the sincerity of the platitudes while still recognizing there was little meat.

Ok, do I think she has empathy for service members? Sure, at least I'd hope so, have little reason to think she wouldn't (as an American, and especially as the wife of this POTUS). Do I think she <insert some other random everyday thing 99% of Americans are for/feel)? Sure, no reason not to.

My whole point is, the speech is designed to draw in the maximum amount of people it's targeted at. It's designed to draw you closer to Obama. That's it. I could give two F's what Michelle, or Ann, or anyone other than Obama/Biden, or Romney/Ryan, say. Everyone else unless they're already an elected official is there for fluff and BS. And that includes the First Lady. EDIT: And even if they are an elected official, they're there to stump (that is, to help reel in and/or fire up base) for their side.

We use Tide Free and Clear detergent. If Michelle is up there saying how much she loves Tide Free and Clear, I could give less than a sh1t. My point is, there are total splooge sucking delusionals that would actually run right out and make sure they get that next shopping trip, or feel some sense of pride they already have it in their laundry room. Seriously: How social engineered could one be?

Chuck

 

[chucky2]

I agree with this.

The delivery was quite good, Michelle came across as a very polished speaker. Only by having been exposed to her for the past four years have we gotten to know that the motivations are not what she laid out tonight.

In fact, the takeaway from the night is that the Obamas and the Democrat Party do not believe in private enterprise or individual entrepreneurship.

EVERY problem can and must be solved by government. And the solutions that were proffered came from only one source - the government.

That is an astonishing perspective for a capitalist society, but it is singularly unsurprising coming from Michelle and the rest of tonight's cast.

I didn't listen close enough to know if this is what she did or not. I wouldn't be surprised really, given the Dem party stance on things, so I'm not saying you're wrong. I just have other sh1t going on right now that's more important than Michelle predictably telling us - shocker, sniff sniff - how much she and "Barack" have in common with us all and blah blah blah.

People like service when they have problems, and that doesn't happen when things are misbehaving...

Chuck

 

[berzerker60]

Her speech basically matters in the same very limited way conventions matter as a whole: get the base excited, show off to the tiny amount of "independent" voters who are swayed by flashy things and shiny lights, and make a coherent story of what the party wants to do going forward. She was uneventfully on script and performed well tonight, which is about par. If the Dem convention keeps this level of showmanship up, it still won't be a super big deal overall, but it would contrast with the only thing people talk about from the Republican convention being the fact-checkers' heads exploding and Eastwood's dementia moment. In terms of political theater, it's a win so far, though as you say, content-wise neither one matters much.

 

[OrByte]

Ok, do I think she has empathy for service members? Sure, at least I'd hope so, have little reason to think she wouldn't (as an American, and especially as the wife of this POTUS). Do I think she <insert some other random everyday thing 99% of Americans are for/feel)? Sure, no reason not to.

My whole point is, the speech is designed to draw in the maximum amount of people it's targeted at. It's designed to draw you closer to Obama. That's it. I could give two F's what Michelle, or Ann, or anyone other than Obama/Biden, or Romney/Ryan, say. Everyone else unless they're already an elected official is there for fluff and BS. And that includes the First Lady. EDIT: And even if they are an elected official, they're there to stump (that is, to help reel in and/or fire up base) for their side.

We use Tide Free and Clear detergent. If Michelle is up there saying how much she loves Tide Free and Clear, I could give less than a sh1t. My point is, there are total splooge sucking delusionals that would actually run right out and make sure they get that next shopping trip, or feel some sense of pride they already have it in their laundry room. Seriously: How social engineered could one be?

Chuck

ok now we are talking about social engineering?

why couldnt it just be a good speech? jeez

 

[chucky2]

I already said it was a good speech on the technical merits, and better than Ann's. Seriously, what more do you want from me?

 

[OrByte]

I already said it was a good speech on the technical merits, and better than Ann's. Seriously, what more do you want from me?

I WANT YOU TO VOTE OBAMA!!



jk

ok you said it was good technically..

 

[chucky2]

I may indeed vote for Obama. He's not 100% out, but either way, I will literally vomit some as I cast a vote for either Obamney or Robama. It makes me ill (not joking) thinking I will have to pick one of these two candidates. Of course...I'm in solid blue IL. So I could vote 3rd party and it wouldn't hurt Obama if I wanted him as a 2nd, or wouldn't cost Romney if I wanted him as a 2nd.

It's really too bad we don't have a different voting system. Unless I vote Dem, my vote is meaningless here...

Chuck

 

[umbrella39]

And how does that not also pertain to the GOP?

Exactly... he may as well have been quoting Romney FFS. Wake up Eagle...

 

[Moonbeam]

I expected pure bull shit at the Democratic convention but found I can actually watch. I am very surprised and very impressed.

 

[lotus503]

Of course nothing she said would cause you to doubt it, she purposefully keeps things general, PC, and pro-American. Who's going to have any issues with her being 'mom in chief', blah blah blah. The whole speech is a fluff piece to reel people in and generate symbiotic patriotism, ethnicity, gender, you name it. It's generated to touch as many people as possible, to share the same values, concerns, emotions, etc. as all those potential voters (and, don't forget the base).

She did a great job at it like I said, I'm not knocking that. I'm just mystified by people going gaga over it not from the 'she delivered a great speech' in the technical sense, but rather, the OMG, I'm a mom, and she's 'mom in chief', I can so identifiy with that....puke...

Please people, she's a Politicians wife who's running for re-election. That whole speech was crafted, rehersed, and delivered to help reel your vote in. For those undecideds who actually believed any of that...I've got a bridge to sell you...

Chuck

I haven't watched any of the speeches. In large part because all of them are as you describe. Some lie and some lie more. Your fault isn't in doubting democrats sincerity, it's that you don't doubt republican sincerity to the same degree.

Probably because the key words and phrases designed to invoke emotion and agreement are just more appealing to you from the republican faux point of view.

That's the problem with partisans they don't comprehend their side is just as bad.

 

[umbrella39]

today's democrat party and their agenda is a throw back to pre-enlightenment. The dark dingy days of the USSR alive and well among today's liberals. The speakers are a joke. A parade of pseudo victims and potential pseudo victims. Spot on for today's democrat party.

You are a sad, silly, pathetic wise and beautiful woman.

 

[chucky2]

I haven't watched any of the speeches. In large part because all of them are as you describe. Some lie and some lie more. Your fault isn't in doubting democrats sincerity, it's that you don't doubt republican sincerity to the same degree.

Probably because the key words and phrases designed to invoke emotion and agreement are just more appealing to you from the republican faux point of view.

That's the problem with partisans they don't comprehend their side is just as bad.

Oooh you are very very wrong there. I'm certainly not a GOP fanboi. I'd happily, and even still may, vote 3rd party as long as the candidate is viable. I'm not a Dem, or a Rep. I'm me. My beliefs are across party lines, my hatred is across party lines. If I had my way, we'd hang them all and start over.

Since that will never happen, unfortunately, we're stuck voting...

Aside: Not that I agreed with him on a lot of things, but one guy I did respect was Nader. It was clear that Nader truly did believe, and actually know what he was talking about from his viewpoint, what he said. If you listen to him on certain subjects, it is clear he doesn't need a teleprompter, he didn't need to reherse that, he actually knows what he's talking about.

That IMO is severely lacking in todays major party candidates. I'd rather have them say in response to a question: I honestly don't know enough about gun control to answer that question sufficiently.

Stop F'ing lying to me, and trying to BS me. For me, I see through that a mile away. If you watched the 2008 debates, it was disgusting (on both sides). And people ate it up like candy. I doubt 2012 will be much different.

Chuck

 

[Moonbeam]

I haven't watched any of the speeches. In large part because all of them are as you describe. Some lie and some lie more. Your fault isn't in doubting democrats sincerity, it's that you don't doubt republican sincerity to the same degree.

Probably because the key words and phrases designed to invoke emotion and agreement are just more appealing to you from the republican faux point of view.

That's the problem with partisans they don't comprehend their side is just as bad.

Actually you are talking about yourself, full of uninformed certainties that science has shown are false. Republicans have been proven to be more delusional than liberals so the notion they are equal in nothing more than pure bull shit, likely a comforting delusion you tell yourself to feel superiorly above the fray.

 

[JEDIYoda]

Hey man I'm just pointing out facts, feel free to continue whatever it is you're trying to advocate.

facts with no references???

 

[nageov3t]

I actually liked tonights speeches, but MSNBC's coverage is once again unwatchable.

it's like Rachel Maddow wants to put herself in a sling and let every Democrat in the nation have their way with her.

 

[emperus]

Of course nothing she said would cause you to doubt it, she purposefully keeps things general, PC, and pro-American. Who's going to have any issues with her being 'mom in chief', blah blah blah. The whole speech is a fluff piece to reel people in and generate symbiotic patriotism, ethnicity, gender, you name it. It's generated to touch as many people as possible, to share the same values, concerns, emotions, etc. as all those potential voters (and, don't forget the base).

She did a great job at it like I said, I'm not knocking that. I'm just mystified by people going gaga over it not from the 'she delivered a great speech' in the technical sense, but rather, the OMG, I'm a mom, and she's 'mom in chief', I can so identifiy with that....puke...

Please people, she's a Politicians wife who's running for re-election. That whole speech was crafted, rehersed, and delivered to help reel your vote in. For those undecideds who actually believed any of that...I've got a bridge to sell you...

Chuck

What were your expectations of the speech? She is after all the wife of a politcian? What policy prescriptions did you want her to give?

Btw, if speech making were so easy. I think we would have seen more from it at the RNC. I think she gave a clear and concise vision of who Obama is, what he believes, and where those beliefs orginated. I saw his passion and sense of decency through her. I also think she gave a compelling vision for our country and of shared sacrifice.

Overall I think it was a good counterweight to the RNC and the you built it theme of their convention.

It was a very compelling speech.