Discrimination in the name of religion

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Texashiker

Texashiker

Lifer
Dec 18, 2010
18,811
198
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Any kind of discrimination is wrong, I do not care if its racial, religious or sexual discrimination, it is wrong.

With that being said, why is discrimination done in the name of religion tolerated in a modern society?

Example:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/mor...ium-to-determine-the-dangers-of-the-internet/

40,000 ultra-orthodox jews had a rally at mets stadium, but no women were allowed.

Could we imagine the uproar if whites held a rally and said no blacks were allowed?

Why do religions get a free pass to discriminate? Its not just jews, its any religion. Christians for a long time discriminated against gays.

But if a business discriminates against gays or women, that business can get sued.
 
cybrsage

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
No outrage found. It was a meeting of Ultra Orthodox Men to discuss things pertaining to their religion.

I take it you are outraged at the Congressional Black Caucus, which does not allow white members?
 
F

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,964
55,355
136
Because interfering with the free exercise of religion causes more problems than it solves. Sometimes when religion gets out of its place and tries to infiltrate other areas the government has to step in, but by and large it's best to stay away.
 
cybrsage

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
I am just a bit surprised there are that many ultra orthodox Jewish men who were close enough to attend. I know New York has a lot of Jews in it, but I did not know there were so many ultra orthodox ones.
 
polarmystery

polarmystery

Diamond Member
Aug 21, 2005
3,888
8
81
cybrsage said:
No outrage found. It was a meeting of Ultra Orthodox Men to discuss things pertaining to their religion.

I take it you are outraged at the Congressional Black Caucus, which does not allow white members?
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I kind of agree with this. Let them do what they want. As long as they aren't demanding that we have to create laws that favor their religion exclusively then I don't see it being an issue. Their religion being stupid or not, is their own problem.
 
crashtestdummy

crashtestdummy

Platinum Member
Feb 18, 2010
2,893
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Texashiker said:
Any kind of discrimination is wrong, I do not care if its racial, religious or sexual discrimination, it is wrong.

With that being said, why is discrimination done in the name of religion tolerated in a modern society?

Example:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/mor...ium-to-determine-the-dangers-of-the-internet/

40,000 ultra-orthodox jews had a rally at mets stadium, but no women were allowed.

Could we imagine the uproar if whites held a rally and said no blacks were allowed?

Why do religions get a free pass to discriminate? Its not just jews, its any religion. Christians for a long time discriminated against gays.

But if a business discriminates against gays or women, that business can get sued.
Click to expand...

These are the special protections that we provide religious organizations. They are allowed to assemble themselves however they see fit. While I find the way Haredi culture treats women (essentially as second-class citizens) to be despicable, it's to some extent the price we pay to allow open religious freedom in this country.

I will also say that there are many non-religious organizations are are allowed to have similar levels of discrimination (the Augusta National Golf Club, for instance).

This is why there is occasionally a push for an equal rights amendment that includes women. Unlike ethnic minorities, women are generally not considered a protected class under the law.

cybrsage said:
I am just a bit surprised there are that many ultra orthodox Jewish men who were close enough to attend. I know New York has a lot of Jews in it, but I did not know there were so many ultra orthodox ones.
Click to expand...

There were many that came in from other parts of the northeast (the Times article interviewed someone from Toronto).
 
F

fskimospy

Elite Member
Mar 10, 2006
87,964
55,355
136
crashtestdummy said:
There were many that came in from other parts of the northeast (the Times article interviewed someone from Toronto).
Click to expand...

Even if there weren't, NYC has huge numbers of ultra orthodox. Within about a mile of my apartment there are 50,000+ Hasidic Jews, and they aren't the only ones around by any means.
 
alzan

alzan

Diamond Member
May 21, 2003
3,860
2
0
Most organized religions give power and leadership to their male members, the ultra Orthodox Hasidic Jews have a lot of like-minded friends as far as that goes. I can't think of too many sects of Christianity that don't feel the same way other than Episcopalians.

It does seem to me though that if they're concerned about the pervasiveness of Internet usage among their members; "harnessing the Internet" might best be served by their leaders issuing an edict to their members directly about Internet and social media usage. Harnessing the internet smacks of abusing power and politics that would restrict for all people, not just Hasidic Jews. Perhaps that's what they are proposing; the article wasn't clear on that.

The attendee from Toronto said it best when he said to a reporter, "We have to learn how to control ourselves." Pretty good advice for members of any religion, or of none, as far as the Internet goes.

Incorruptible said:
Interesting how nothing is said about islam which has much more discrimination towards women
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It's also interesting how you seem to work Islam into ~25% of your posts, regardless of the original subject matter. You might want to work on that. By the way, you capitalize the first letter of the name of an organized religion when referencing it.
 
Lonbjerg

Lonbjerg

Diamond Member
Dec 6, 2009
4,419
0
0
Religions people can go *beep* themselfes.
They call me a "sinner"..judging me..so I jugde them...as people suffering from a cognetive virus.

But yeah...religion today is a freepass to violate rights and equality.
 
C

Charles Kozierok

Elite Member
May 14, 2012
6,762
1
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It's not just religions. All sorts of groups have rules about who can join and under what circumstances.

We do still freedom of association.
 
Lonbjerg

Lonbjerg

Diamond Member
Dec 6, 2009
4,419
0
0
CharlesKozierok said:
It's not just religions. All sorts of groups have rules about who can join and under what circumstances.

We do still freedom of association.
Click to expand...

These gropus must abide to the law right?
Equality and all that right?
If so...fail analogy.
 
C

Charles Kozierok

Elite Member
May 14, 2012
6,762
1
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Lonbjerg said:
These gropus must abide to the law right?
Equality and all that right?
If so...fail analogy.
Click to expand...

Sorry, not following you.

And at least in this country, there are no laws that force people to admit to a private function those they do not want present.
 
cybrsage

cybrsage

Lifer
Nov 17, 2011
13,021
0
0
I never understood the Hasidics placing women in an inferior position. I think it is something they learned from Europe.

In Judaism, women are considered holier than men. This is true. The Torah rules are there to tell us what to do and what not to do to be holy. God wants everyone to be holy - men and women alike. Women have less commands placed on them than than men do...which means women need LESS rules to make them holy...which means women are HOLIER than men (who need MORE rules to make them holy).
 
SparkyJJO

SparkyJJO

Lifer
May 16, 2002
13,357
7
81
You can't legislate people to be 100% tolerant of everything, because there is always some form of intolerance somewhere. Try to force a group to tolerate something? You're not being tolerant of them. Catch-22.

There are many, many groups - both religious AND non-religious - that have set rules in place that bar certain people from doing certain things or being part of certain things. It's called reality and you CAN'T allow or force 100% of everyone to accept 100% of everything.

If you can't deal with that, well, too bad, because reality takes precedence over your feelings.
 
Kadarin

Kadarin

Lifer
Nov 23, 2001
44,296
16
81
cybrsage said:
I never understood the Hasidics placing women in an inferior position. I think it is something they learned from Europe.

In Judaism, women are considered holier than men. This is true. The Torah rules are there to tell us what to do and what not to do to be holy. God wants everyone to be holy - men and women alike. Women have less commands placed on them than than men do...which means women need LESS rules to make them holy...which means women are HOLIER than men (who need MORE rules to make them holy).
Click to expand...

Because women are "holier" (whatever the fuck that means), they must therefore be protected, and be forbidden from dressing immodestly, from driving, from being educated, and from being exposed to ideas that could potentially harm them... You get the idea.
 
W

WHAMPOM

Diamond Member
Feb 28, 2006
7,628
183
106
Texashiker said:
Any kind of discrimination is wrong, I do not care if its racial, religious or sexual discrimination, it is wrong.

With that being said, why is discrimination done in the name of religion tolerated in a modern society?

Example:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/mor...ium-to-determine-the-dangers-of-the-internet/

40,000 ultra-orthodox jews had a rally at mets stadium, but no women were allowed.

Could we imagine the uproar if whites held a rally and said no blacks were allowed?

Why do religions get a free pass to discriminate? Its not just jews, its any religion. Christians for a long time discriminated against gays.

But if a business discriminates against gays or women, that business can get sued.
Click to expand...

Purty much the rule in religion, "as man is to God, so women are to men." Slaves.
 
N

nehalem256

Lifer
Apr 13, 2012
15,669
8
0
Texashiker said:
Could we imagine the uproar if whites held a rally and said no blacks were allowed?
Click to expand...

Do you think the KKK invites black people to their meetings?

Why do religions get a free pass to discriminate? Its not just jews, its any religion. Christians for a long time discriminated against gays.

But if a business discriminates against gays or women, that business can get sued.
Click to expand...

Being a Jew/Catholic/Muslim/etc is in no way necessary. Being able to shop at the Grocery store kinda is.
 
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