Did you discover your atheism for yourself?

[Rio Rebel]

Why did THIS thread start another flame war, but UG's first thread, which insults and ridicules all theists (as usual), did not?

It's AMAZING how many people come in to stop the perceived "oppression" whenever you get the least bit aggressive in defending theism...but you can paint up the opposition as half-witted rednecks if you are and atheist.

Be fair, folks.

 

[Rogue]

Sorry FettsBabe. I stand corrected and yes, I observe the same daily. To each their own I suppose. Agree to disagree, that's the key.

 

[Xzaver]

I think that just knowing he is thier helps allot of people.

You really must just bilieve.

But allways praise god because well just bas.. because he gave you life.


~X~

 

[fdiskboy]

First: My intent is not to ridicule any. All are free--free to believe whatever they wish.


For those athiests out there , I pity you. For you see, your change of heart will come too late. In the end, everyone will believe. That's of course, just my opinion. Feel free to hate me for not wanting you to make the wrong decision. I'm certainly not going to try to dissuade you.

Is it wrong for me to disagree? Is it wrong for me to have my own beliefs, even if they are exclusive rather than inclusive?

I think not. Just as I allow you to believe whatever you wish, you should respect my right to do the same. I believe much of the hate coming from the atheist community is based on hurt feelings--ie. "How could you believe that I,I, could be wrong? How dare you!" If you are so certain of your belief system (as I am of mine) why should you care what I believe? I'm obviously just a fool--do you feel it necessary to prove that fact? Ah, but there's the rub. There is no proof until this life is over, only then will anyone know. In my opinion, that's what faith is all about.

You get no credit for believing that which you see. Water is wet. If you don't believe it, you are a fool. There is a God. Now that's different. You either have faith that he doesn't exist or you have faith that he doesn't. Either way, it is an unproveable assertion.

That's just some of my thoughts today.

 

[NFS4]

<< You get no credit for believing that which you see. Water is wet. If you don't believe it, you are a fool. There is a God. Now that's different. You either have faith that he doesn't exist or you have faith that he doesn't. Either way, it is an unproveable assertion. >>


So it's your way or the highway? How do you feel about Muslims or Budhists who don't believe in YOUR God?

 

[BoberFett]

SmiZ

<< Do you consider it wrong when a group of people who are cut off from western or modern society determine that human sacrifice is ok because their &quot;higher power&quot; tells them they should preform it? >>

Do you consider it wrong when a cheetah kills a gazelle because its instinct tells it that it needs to eat?



vi_edit

<< The golden rule is nothing more than a logic of I don't kill you because I myself don't want to be killed. I don't steal from you because I don't like to have my stuff stolen. Monkey see, monkey do.

I don't need a God to tell me that I don't like having my car stolen, or that it's not proper conduct to hit on a neighbors wife. >>

Sorry, that just doesn't agree with other scientific observations. Whatever happened to instinct and survival of the fittest? Instinct would tell a person to take whatever they can get. If you're stronger than the person next to you, why not take their wife and possessions? They can't stop you. You've been taught by society that those things are wrong. One cannot determine morals on their own.


I think part of the reason Rio posted this thread was to demonstrate that there is no such thing as a truly original thought. UG started a thread asking whether or not theists came to that belief on their own, somehow implying that if you weren't forcefed god throughout childhood that you wouldn't come to that conclusion. This thread simply turns it around, and rightfully. Can anyone truly say that they would be the person they are today without outside influence? All thought is based on other thought.

 

[Missus]

Discover???

 

[LadyJessica]

<< You get no credit for believing that which you see. Water is wet. If you don't believe it, you are a fool. >>



Are you sure water is wet?

 

[LadyJessica]

<< << Do you consider it wrong when a group of people who are cut off from western or modern society determine that human sacrifice is ok because their &quot;higher power&quot; tells them they should preform it? >>

Do you consider it wrong when a cheetah kills a gazelle because its instinct tells it that it needs to eat? >>



So religion is an instinct?

 

[yakko]

<< Did you discover your atheism for yourself? >>


No. God sent me a brouchere.

 

[Rio Rebel]

...and Yakko makes a strong push for &quot;Post of the Day&quot;...

LMAO

 

[Zucchini]

smug? Is it smug to reinforce your arguements? Thats some twisted reasoning.

I'm agnostic not athiestic. When it comes to a christian god, i guess i would be athiestic. One only has to look to history and the world with all its varied religions to question such organizations. In the past when a persons world was much smaller, the conflicting views of multiple religions wouldn't have been so apparent. Just look at all the religions of the world, they conflict with each other, they have their own versions of heaven/hell.. rituals that must be observed to avoid punishment. And they all believe themselves to be the one true religion. Its not hard to look at that and think something is definetly wrong.

 

[BoberFett]

LMAO at Rio and Yakko!



<< So religion is an instinct? >>

If one were to listen to atheists, you'd hear that there is no such thing as a soul. A person is just a bunch of chemical reactions. What makes the chemical reactions causing an instinct any different from the chemical reactions causing a belief in God?

Whoa, deja vu. I swear I've been here before.

 

[BoberFett]

Zucchini

Hatred or distrust of religion is not proof of God's non-existance. That's a pretty weak argument.

 

[Rio Rebel]

Zucchini,

I find your position extremely reasonable. In fact, I believe it's the only logical conclusion we can come to, and the ultimate decision has to be made on some other basis.

But why in the world did you take the first post as directed at you? You don't fit the description in the first line, and you really don't fit any of it.

The only logical error here is the one that assumes you are the target of all general statements about people who aren't theists...

 

[SmiZ]

I just find that religions contradict themselves too much for my taste. Take the bible for example.

Old Testament:

God reigns down fire on cities he deems full of sin. God turns a woman to Salt for looking backward, and many other things that I deem myth at best.

New Testament:

God, through Jesus, teaches that we should love all and live in harmony.

What happened there?

 

[BoberFett]

Smiz

I think I can answer that, but the Christians can correct me if I'm wrong. The difference between old and new testament is the coming of Jesus, man's savior, who was sacrificed and now receives the punishment that man would otherwise endure.

 

[Zucchini]

bobberfett,

I guess u didn't really read my post then. Did i say god didn't exist? No, i said that your specific version of god probably doesn't. It has an equal chance of existing as the rest of the religions in the world.

 

[Zenmervolt]

Just want to point out that even the &quot;golden rule&quot; did not originate with christianity. Confucius' Analects contains a passage that says exactly the same thing as the &quot;golden rule&quot;. (Though of course there are slight semantic differences due to translation.) I don't have the original quote on me right now, but someone asked Confucius for one rule that a gentleman should live by and Confucius replied by saying that a gentleman did nothing to others that he would not wish to be done to himself. Just pointing out that the &quot;golden rule&quot; predates christianity. This tidbit certainly does not refute christianity, but it does help the argument that a god is not necessary for the establishment of a moral code. Someone mentioned &quot;survival of the fittest&quot; as an incentive for theivery and the like. Well, sort of. However there is also the instinct to preserve the species or society. A society cannot function without a law similar to the &quot;golden rule&quot;, any society tolerating theft and murder would fall apart quickly. The early founders of civilization reaqlized this and established laws to counter human instinct because the society was more important than its individual members. Basically, the &quot;golden rule&quot; is common sense for the preservation of a society.

Zenmervolt

 

[LordMaul]

Who else besides me noticed that religon threads always get the most flam..err...replies?!

SUcks, doesn't it?




Maul <---Who DOES believe in God.

 

[FettsBabe]

Smiz, education about the bible can help you tell the difference between the old testament and new. You can't look at the two and compare. It's not there for that reason.

 

[SmiZ]

BoberFett:


What I meant was &quot;God&quot; seemed to change his mind. Old Testament is

kill everyone not like us!!!

New Testament is

love and forgive everyone not like us!!!

Now I went to catholic school for 7 years and have seen mostly their practices as well as methodist, so I can't speak for all religions, but based on my observations, it seems like many religious figures talk out of both sides of their mouth.

 

[SmiZ]

FettsBabe:


The entire bible is meant as a telling of God, Jesus, and their teachings correct? How did God go from Super Dooper war general to warm fuzzy happy sugar plum fairy man? That's what I don't get. It has nothing to do with bible learning, as the bible was beaten into my head for 17 years.

I compare it to Ghandi all of the sudden forming a gorilla soldier team and fighting against his enemies.

 

[FettsBabe]

Some religions focus on the old testament more than the new (Southern Baptists), and other religions (Methodist) focus on the new.

God didn't change his mind. Its called salvation. You mind changes when you are saved.

 

[SmiZ]

Ok Fetts, you're obviously missing the point.
Here's some other questions for anyone who wants to answer them:

How much bearing did your upbringing have on your current religious beliefs? Was who you were born to or what part of the world you were born in a major factor regarding the God you believe in? Have you ever truly considered converting to another religion? Do you believe that you would have the same beliefs if you were born on the opposite side of the world?