did the Bush administration really desire to eliminate Bin Laden?

[Perknose]

Tora Bora was a screwup, no doubt about that.

Are you guys saying there was a massive shift in how Obama was pursued between Obama and Bush?

Yes. Mulitple people in this thread have been trying to tell you just that.

Bush pulled special op resources away from the hunt for Osama for his war with Iraq, de-emphasized finding and capturing Bin Laden as a priority, even said as much, and never re-committed the resources necessary to root him out.

Barry O. did, as he said he would, and the efforts bore fruit, as we can now see. Is this really so hard for you to understand?

Time Line:

1. We fuck up @ Tora Bora. You have admitted this, but if anyone else thinks otherwise, the documentation is overwhelming and I will provide it.

2. 2002: Bush pulls resources away from Bin Laden for the Iraq War.

Gary Schroen, leader of the first CIA team into Afghanistan.

Gary Schroen's orders in September 2001 were to find Osama bin Laden and kill him. Schroen believes US forces came close at Tora Bora in eastern Afghanistan. But the battle there was more than three years ago. Since then, Schroen believes bin Laden has never been in real danger.

Schroen's second theory for why bin Laden hasn't been caught is that the US has, in fact, dropped the ball. Schroen says that by 2002, as planning for the Iraq War ramped up, top military Special Forces units were pulled out of Afghanistan. Same for the CIA. Schroen says the Iraq effort consumed hundreds of operations officers, leaving CIA managers struggling to staff Afghanistan.

3. 2006: Bush Effort Peters Out Altogether:

CIA Reportedly Disbands Bin Laden Unit
The Associated Press
Tuesday, July 4, 2006; 11:19 AM

NEW YORK -- A CIA unit that had hunted for Osama bin Laden and his top deputies for a decade has been disbanded, according to a published report.

Citing unnamed intelligence officials, The New York Times reported Tuesday that the unit, known as "Alec Station," was shut down late last year. The decision to close the unit, which predated the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, was first reported Monday by National Public Radio.

The officials told the Times that the change reflects a view that al-Qaida's hierarchy has changed, and terrorist attacks inspired by the group are now being carried out independently of bin Laden and his second-in-command, Ayman al-Zawahiri.

The CIA said hunting bin Laden remains a priority, but resources needed to be directed toward other people and groups likely to initiate new attacks.

"The efforts to find Osama bin Laden are as strong as ever," said CIA spokeswoman Jennifer Millerwise Dyck. "This is an agile agency, and the decision was made to ensure greater reach and focus."

A former CIA official who once led the unit, Michael Scheuer, told the Times that its shutdown was a mistake.

"This will clearly denigrate our operations against al-Qaida," he said. "These days at the agency, bin Laden and al-Qaida appear to be treated merely as first among equals."

4. Nov 2008 Obama Pledges to Renew The Effort to Capture Bin Laden

President-elect Barack Obama has said that he plans to renew the U.S. commitment to tracking down the al Qaeda leader.

"I think it is a top priority for us to stamp out al Qaeda once and for all, Obama told CBS's "60 Minutes" Sunday. "And I think capturing or killing bin Laden is a critical aspect of stamping out al Qaeda. He is not just a symbol, he's also the operational leader of an organization that is planning attacks against U.S. targets."

"He's completely disappeared," former CIA operative Robert Baer told ABCNews.com about bin Laden.

"I asked my CIA colleagues who have been on the hunt for him, and what surprised me was, no one was quite sure. Half assumed he was alive, and half assumed he was dead," Baer said. "Obviously, they have lost track of this guy completely."

Baer, who was the inspiration for the George Clooney character in the film "Syriana," said intelligence gathering in the mountainous region is "virtually impossible."

5. May 2010 Obama's Promise Is Made Good

 

[IGBT]

Obama gets credit for doing his part. No more and no less. It was a team effort by who knows how many people doing just about anything they could to catch the guy. This isn't some Hollywood movie with a lone hero defying the odds. They're all heroes who all risked a lot to catch this guy including Obama apparently. Trying to deflect credit from any of them does a disservice to them all.

it was an on going effort that had a life of it's own. All your obama did was read the teleprompter.

 

[fskimospy]

it was an on going effort that had a life of it's own. All your obama did was read the teleprompter.

Wow are you pathetic.

 

[wuliheron]

it was an on going effort that had a life of it's own. All your obama did was read the teleprompter.

And your part I suppose was to write trash.

 

[sportage]

Yet just another Bush mess Obama had to clean up. Yes... yet another.

 

[Generator]

Bush was just an awful leader, indifferent to just about everything but need to clear brush. Multiply that indifference with the deliberate lie to make up a choice war in Iraq gave Osama easy get away on mules lol.

You have to wonder if even bin Laden somehow underestimated American's will on capturing him. I wonder how long he was living in a mansion in Pakistan's capital? You think John McCain would have found him? Or would he be trying to arm both sides of Libya?

 

[sMiLeYz]

Yes. Mulitple people in this thread have been trying to tell you just that.

Bush pulled special op resources away from the hunt for Osama for his war with Iraq, de-emphasized finding and capturing Bin Laden as a priority, even said as much, and never re-committed the resources necessary to root him out.

Barry O. did, as he said he would, and the efforts bore fruit, as we can now see. Is this really so hard for you to understand?

Time Line:

1. We fuck up @ Tora Bora. You have admitted this, but if anyone else thinks otherwise, the documentation is overwhelming and I will provide it.

2. 2002: Bush pulls resources away from Bin Laden for the Iraq War.



3. 2006: Bush Effort Peters Out Altogether:



4. Nov 2008 Obama Pledges to Renew The Effort to Capture Bin Laden



5. May 2010 Obama's Promise Is Made Good

/thread

 

[brainhulk]

I wonder how long he was living in a mansion in Pakistan's capital?

well the compound was built in 2005 http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110502/ts_nm/us_binladen_compound

 

[Generator]

Unbelievable. Fuck Pakistan and its citizens.

 

[Infohawk]

Unbelievable. Fuck Pakistan and its citizens.

It is pretty disgusting. It's likely a large circle of people knew about this and it took so long for one of their connections to take millions of dollars to turn in a mass murderer.

Obama deserves credit for this but I'd like to see our policy towards Pakistan get a whole lot tougher in favor of India (assuming most Indians aren't hindifascists like our Baasha.)

 

[Whoozyerdaddy]

Wow are you pathetic.

No, that's pretty much how it happened.


Still laughing at everyone trying to assign/claim credit.

This was the end result of a 10 year manhunt. Period.

 

[Red Dawn]

Of course they wanted to get him then at least they would have had at least one success.

 

[PokerGuy]

Great job by our intel, CIA and spec ops folks to get the job done. Leave it to the great teleprompter reader to use the opportunity to try and aggrandize himself and pretend he was personally responsible for what happened.

 

[Red Dawn]

Great job by our intel, CIA and spec ops folks to get the job done. Leave it to the great teleprompter reader to use the opportunity to try and aggrandize himself and pretend he was personally responsible for what happened.

Did I miss where he put on a flight suit and flew a plane onto an Aircraft Carrier?

 

[FuzzyBee]

Of course they wanted to get him then at least they would have had at least one success.

Huh? Drinking already this morning?

 

[FuzzyBee]

Yet just another Bush mess Obama had to clean up. Yes... yet another.

Yeah! Just like Guantanamo!

Errr.... wait.

 

[FuzzyBee]

The specific lead that led to this moment goes back before Obama.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42853221/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/

I find it interesting that this article fails to mention the "G" word - you know, where the detainees were held. Probably because nothing good could have come out of that detention facility.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Bush sucked.

Obama is the man!

It's just that simple. LOL

Edit: BTW...I thought Obama calling Bush prior to the announcement was pure class. :thumbsup:

 

[rudder]

Wow... Y'know... at no point did the Bush admin ever stop looking for him. At no point has the intelligence community ever stopped looking for him. He hid out for 10 years.

And can we stop with this "I'm not concerned" BS? That quote is being taken so far out of context. It's really dishonest the way some of you are using it. Use it in the proper context and it means something completely different than you nutjobs use it for.

This.

To kill Bin Laden the U.S. forces went in unannounced into a foreign country and killed him. If you remember back when Clinton approved the launch of some cruise missiles at bin laden and hit absolutely nothing.... the reason was the U.S. notified the Pakistani military because we were using their airspace. Of course, calls were immediately made to osama who had at least an hour to bug out by the time the sub-sonic cruise missiles got to his location.

So this was really no easy task. If bin laden had been hiding in Afghanistan these last 10 years... I could see the OP's point. Bin Laden was real close to a large Pakistani military school. This goes to show how safe he felt that foreign intelligence services would not find him.

 

[Red Dawn]

Huh? Drinking already this morning?

Lol, you're the one who's fuzzy.

 

[classy]

Obama gets the credit here for making the call and finishing the job. To deny his leadership in this is not possible. But there is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that President Bush would have killed Bin Laden just the same. To believe anything else is ridiculous. President Bush was a great President in this area, he would do and kill whomever he had to to protect this country. It was a great day yesterday, but I have no delusions at all that President Bush wanted him dead.

 

[FuzzyBee]

Lol, you're the one who's fuzzy.

Hah!

Seriously, though, I have no idea what "Of course they wanted to get him then at least they would have had at least one success." means. Perhaps you could rephrase.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Hah!

Seriously, though, I have no idea what "Of course they wanted to get him then at least they would have had at least one success." means. Perhaps you could rephrase.

I'll help...here you go.

I'm a shameless hack and proud of it!

 

[Thump553]

It’s amazing how the President is often forced to make a tough decision on critical missions where the outcome is balanced on a razor's edge. Decide right and it is a sterling accomplishment, decide wrong and you are vilified. Three such recent matters:

1) Bin Laden's death-the decision whether to use troops or drones: drones for safety, troops for proof. People in the WH and Pentagon must have been shitting bricks when the helicopter broke down. The decision whether to involve Pakistan in the mission and the possible/probable ramifications this mission will have on destabilizing Pakistan more. If this mission failed then without a doubt Obama would have looked like an absolute idiot.

2) Tora Bora and GWB's failed attempt to get Bin Laden: GWB's decision to have Afgan "allies" instead of US troops do the fighting: If it worked probably would have gone a long way towards building a real country in Afghanistan and cutting that war much shorter. Unfortunately our allies betrayed us and let Bin Laden escape.

3) Jimmy Carter and the failed mission to rescue the hostages in Tehran: Carter was castigated for this and it contributed substantially to his loss to Reagan-it pretty much cemented the public perception of Carter as incompetent. In actuality the mission was a huge gamble where we just pushed our equipment too far beyond what it could handle and we rolled wrong.

 

[Tom]

I'm sure Bush wanted to capture or kill him.

It's possible that Obama's diplomatic team in the region, led by the now deceased Richard Holbrook, led to better cooperation with Pakistan.

It's also possible that the recent terrorist attacks in Pakistan changed their level of cooperation.

It's also possible that the level of effort has been the same for the entire time since 9/11, and it just happened to occur now.

In any case, I credit Bush and Obama for their efforts, as well as the intelligence community and military. I don't see any reason for partisanship, other than this shows that Obama is doing his job.