Democrats confront Republicans over changing House rules to keep gov't shut down.

[Matt1970]

Yup, I have little trouble believing you are this detached from reality. No doubt, if the Dems had held up gov't funding over immigration reform but reduced their demands to "just" legalizing Dreamers, you'd be saying the exact same thing.

Well that would be a compromise wouldn't it? That would be the process of negotiations.

 

[Moonbeam]

Congress has the ability to defund programs and/or change the content.

Anything done by a previous Congress does not obligate a future Congress to rubber stamp

That is fine. But you can't throw up the meal you ate and return it to the kitchen. You negotiate a different meal for the future after you pay for the one already agreed to.

 

[First]

Well that would be a compromise wouldn't it? That would be the process of negotiations.

No, it'd be doubling down on stupid with a slightly less stupid demand. That's not "negotiating".

I'm sorry, but you really are out of your league here.

 

[Matt1970]

No, it'd be doubling down on stupid with a slightly less stupid demand. That's not "negotiating".

I'm sorry, but you really are out of your league here.

So it's only negotiating when you approve of the requests. I see. If that's the "league" then you are right, I am out of it.

 

[Paul98]

Everyone on the Dem side is stating that the Republicans are demanding and that the Dems should not negotiate.

that is what is causing the deadlock.

So if the Democrats want to resolve the problem; they are going to have to bend a little to meet the Republicans bending.

However, the Dems do not want to bend - weakness.
The Republicans have adjusted their sights - offering an olive branch.
All they are asking is the ACA be on a level footing.

The Dems are still saying no go.
What will the Dems give or are they not willing to negotiate? They want it their way all the way.

What are the democrats negotiating for, what are they asking for that the republicans don't want?

 

[fskimospy]

No. Here let me give you a cenario.

Someone wants to negotaite with your boss how much pay you want.
They offer to work for $50/hr, boss wants them to work for free.
They offer to work for $25/hr, boss wants them to work for free.
They offer to work for $15/hr, boss wants them to work for free.
They offer to work for $10/hr, boss wants them to work for free.

Replace the boss with Obama and you have the current situation only you are claiming it is the employee who will not negotiate. You can call the GOP a lot of things but Not willing to negotiate isn't one of them. And stop it with the insults. It just shows your arguement is falling apart.

Wait, this is what you guys actually believe?

The affordable care act is the law. Full stop. Republicans wish to change this law.

If you wanted to use an employment metaphor it would be once you ALREADY HAVE AN EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT:

You say "pay me $50 more an hour or I destroy your company." Your boss says no.

"Ok, pay me $30 more an hour or I destroy your company. " your boss says no.

Your boss then offers to negotiate on your salary if you are willing to take on some new responsibilities, but that he won't talk about that until you stop threatening to destroy the company.

Then you scream about how unreasonable your boss is.

 

[First]

So it's only negotiating when you approve of the requests. I see. If that's the "league" then you are right, I am out of it.

You're still out of your league here and, worse, you made some weird off-topic statement about it only being negotiating when said person approves of the results. Which is odd because I'd love for immigrants to be legalized, but am not so detached from reality that I think Dems should shut down the government over it. Meanwhile, you believe shutting down the government to extract ACA concessions is "negotiating". No, it's not. The whole shutting down the gov't part changes the equation. You can negotiate immigration and ACA changes during regular order like grown-ups.

 

[fskimospy]

So it's only negotiating when you approve of the requests. I see. If that's the "league" then you are right, I am out of it.

For about the tenth time, compromise involves both sides getting something they want.

Please list what the democrats are getting. This shouldn't be hard.

 

[Matt1970]

For about the tenth time, compromise involves both sides getting something they want.

Please list what the democrats are getting. This shouldn't be hard.

There would be a list of what the democrats want but they haven't sat down to negotiate.

 

[First]

There would be a list of what the democrats want but they haven't sat down to negotiate.

lol.

 

[fskimospy]

There would be a list of what the democrats want but they haven't sat down to negotiate.

Now you're contradicting yourself.

Regardless of your internal consistency, the sorts of things the democrats want are no secret. So for the third time, out of the things I mentioned what are republicans willing to trade? Why can't you answer this simple question?

 

[DominionSeraph]

There would be a list of what the democrats want but they haven't sat down to negotiate.

You think that? So this is the first time you've heard the term, "Clean bill?"

 

[Matt1970]

You're still out of your league here and, worse, you made some weird off-topic statement about it only being negotiating when said person approves of the results. Which is odd because I'd love for immigrants to be legalized, but am not so detached from reality that I think Dems should shut down the government over it. Meanwhile, you believe shutting down the government to extract ACA concessions is "negotiating". No, it's not. The whole shutting down the gov't part changes the equation. You can negotiate immigration and ACA changes during regular order like grown-ups.

Do you really give a shit about illegals or are you just having wet dreams about 20 million more americans that will vote 80% democrat? And ya pal, I am out of my league here.

 

[First]

Do you really give a shit about illegals or are you just having wet dreams about 20 million more americans that will vote 80% democrat? And ya pal, I am out of my league here.

You're getting desperate, but yes I care about undocumented Americans. I'm not stupid enough to support a stunt like shutting down the gov't to legalize them, though. It's politically asinine and isn't anywhere near the realm of "negotiating". It's childish ransom.

Cope with your party's asininity however you like. It won't change how this will be viewed in history.

 

[Matt1970]

You think that? So this is the first time you've heard the term, "Clean bill?"

Wow you guys are thick headed. No, it's not the first but it's the only thing I have heard. The Dems have made one demand all along, held to it, refused to even look at anything else, shut the government down over it, yet the Republicans are the ones not negotiating. "My way or the Highway" is not how you negotiate. It's not what the founding fathers intended when they set up the House, Senate and Presidency. Enjoy your partisian hackery.

 

[First]

Wow you guys are thick headed. No, it's not the first but it's the only thing I have heard. The Dems have made one demand all along, held to it, refused to even look at anything else, shut the government down over it, yet the Republicans are the ones not negotiating. "My way or the Highway" is not how you negotiate. It's not what the founding fathers intended when they set up the House, Senate and Presidency. Enjoy your partisian hackery.

Go to college. You're in desperate need of some schooling on American history.

 

[ivwshane]

Wow you guys are thick headed. No, it's not the first but it's the only thing I have heard. The Dems have made one demand all along, held to it, refused to even look at anything else, shut the government down over it, yet the Republicans are the ones not negotiating. "My way or the Highway" is not how you negotiate. It's not what the founding fathers intended when they set up the House, Senate and Presidency. Enjoy your partisian hackery.

What was the demand they made?

 

[Paul98]

Wow you guys are thick headed. No, it's not the first but it's the only thing I have heard. The Dems have made one demand all along, held to it, refused to even look at anything else, shut the government down over it, yet the Republicans are the ones not negotiating. "My way or the Highway" is not how you negotiate. It's not what the founding fathers intended when they set up the House, Senate and Presidency. Enjoy your partisian hackery.

I will ask again what do the democrats want, what are they asking for that the majority republicans don't want? What demand are the democrats making that the republicans don't want to happen?

 

[Matt1970]

Go to college. You're in desperate need of some schooling on American history.

Hey, I am used to dumbasses like you insulting what they don't like or understand.

 

[Matt1970]

You're getting desperate, but yes I care about undocumented Americans. I'm not stupid enough to support a stunt like shutting down the gov't to legalize them, though. It's politically asinine and isn't anywhere near the realm of "negotiating". It's childish ransom.

Cope with your party's asininity however you like. It won't change how this will be viewed in history.

"undocumented Americans"

And you can all wack off thinking this will change the 2014 elections. This has happened in the 90's for 21 days. The elctions happened a year later and the GOP still held the house only losing 3 seats. The difference here is good or bad Obamacare will be shoved down the throats of all the registered voters.

 

[Tom]

as long as the liberals refuse to negotiate the shutdown is theirs. The shutdown has liberal fingerprints all over it.

Totally false. The liberals are not attempting to change government policy that has been established by the democratic process embodied in the Constitution.

The funding that the government spends has been established by negotiations between the House, Senate, and the President.

Now the House, a minority in the House, is trying to force that agreement to be ignored or they will not fund the government.

You might not like that Democrats have been elected by the people, and are a majority in the Senate and the President, who is elected, is a Democrat.

But that does not give you the right to disregard the facts.

 

[Matt1970]

Totally false. The liberals are not attempting to change government policy that has been established by the democratic process embodied in the Constitution.

The funding that the government spends has been established by negotiations between the House, Senate, and the President.

Now the House, a minority in the House, is trying to force that agreement to be ignored or they will not fund the government.

You might not like that Democrats have been elected by the people, and are a majority in the Senate and the President, who is elected, is a Democrat.

But that does not give you the right to disregard the facts.

I see you are conviently leaving out the fact that the GOP has control of the house. There are 535 people that have a right to be there and be heard, not just Obama and Reid.

 

[MomentsofSanity]

I see you are conviently leaving out the fact that the GOP has control of the house. There are 535 people that have a right to be there and be heard, not just Obama and Reid.

Yes, the majority in the house that want clean CR vote do deserve to be heard. But unfortunately the point of this thread is that their ability to be heard was taken away.

 

[Tom]

I see you are conviently leaving out the fact that the GOP has control of the house. There are 535 people that have a right to be there and be heard, not just Obama and Reid.

The thing is the House has already been heard. They are trying to change the policy they already agreed to.

And they are trying to do so threatening to harm the country they are sworn to protect.

Not by the strength of their arguments, which is how this process is supposed to work.

 

[First]

"undocumented Americans"

And you can all wack off thinking this will change the 2014 elections. This has happened in the 90's for 21 days. The elctions happened a year later and the GOP still held the house only losing 3 seats. The difference here is good or bad Obamacare will be shoved down the throats of all the registered voters.

Poor ignorant conservative, scared of things he doesn't understand. If you didn't constantly wimp out of discussions and questions asked of you, you'd almost be entertaining.

Hey, I am used to dumbasses like you insulting...

Yes, I'm sure you're used to being insulted. Maybe one day you'll figure out why people constantly insult you.