Democrats and Obama working quickly to pass an amnesty bill!

[Elias824]

I'd say the problem is with Democrats AND Republicans; both parties want to pander to any large group for votes, both parties want cheap labor (Republicans for business workers and Democrats for domestic servants), and both parties will do whatever is perceived to be in their own best interests at the moment.


No one has read the HUGE section about border security because everyone knows it will never happen. Time after time the same people who refuse to enforce the existing border laws promise miraculous new laws and strict enforcement - but only if they are part of a "comprehensive" immigration package. Here's a clue: Those who wish to secure the border propose legislation to secure the border, while those who wish the border to remain open and porous propose legislation to legalize illegals and liberalize the immigration process with just enough "secure the border" spice sprinkled in to make some people think it's a worthwhile trade-off. After numerous such back-stabbings most people are quite jaded, so really strict "border security" measures must be added to fool anyone. But the beauty of the system is that it doesn't matter what border security is promised because leadership of neither party has any intention of honoring it. Democrats are free to propose and even pass any additional border security measures without any fear that Republicans will win power and actually enforce them.

Make the same analogy about anything and you'll quickly see how empty is this promise:
We are going to crack down on murders, but in order to do that we first have to pardon all the murderers.

We are going to crack down on illegal drugs, but in order to do that we first have to legalize all the illegal drugs already in the country.

We are going to crack down on intellectual property theft, but in order to do that we first have to legalize all illegally copied movies and music.

Starting to see the duplicity here?

When you add that much cynicism to anything it will seem terrible.

 

[WhipperSnapper]

LOL!

It happened before, and looks like it turned out so bad.

Besides, this nation has 0 moral standing to say no to immigrants after Europeans conquered it, especially immigrants which are NAFTA refugees that we created.

Mexico too deserves blame for accepting NAFTA, just like the U.S. government deserves blame for all the damage NAFTA may have done to Americans.

The moral standing to bar the doors is that the purpose of the U.S. government should be to protect the well being of American citizens, just like many other governments do.

This isn't Russia. The US has always been more libertarian than Europe in general, we don't operate like that "papers please" crap. If you want to live somewhere where illegal immigrants are thrown out, try Russia and see how you like it.

Now speak Navajo, the language of this land- or get out.

So are you advocating completely open borders? The U.S. has been more free market and libertarian-like and look where it's gotten us:

• Jobs going to India, China, and Mexico.
• Foreigners displacing Americans from jobs in the United States via H-1B and L-1 visas.
• Mass immigration decreasing job opportunities and wages for the lower classes.
• Mass immigration decreasing the quality of life and standard of living through population explosion and the resultant increased costs for limited resources.
• Mass unemployment in the United States.
• One of the world's most laughable and inefficient health care systems. The free market dogma is so heavily entrenched that even after it has been proven that our system is expensive and inefficient compared to far superior socialized medicine that a large percentage of Americans still want the current system.

Note--the second quote is not mine but it is attributed to me. That was not me you were quoting there.

Born here but your parents are illegal? Yeah. Time to start your immigration process or go back to your parent's home, along with your parents.

Government services (welfare, food stamps, etc)? You get none. Oh, you are a poor visitor? Save a bit more before you come next time.

 

[ericlp]

Gotta come here legally though.

Yeah just like your grand parents, parents, parents did right? Unless you are full blooded native american?

 

[Elias824]

Yeah just like your grand parents, parents, parents did right? Unless you are full blooded native american?

Did the native americans have immigration laws?

 

[MikeMike]

Yeah just like your grand parents, parents, parents did right? Unless you are full blooded native american?

really? if we go that far back, i want my slaves back...

🙄

and GTFO of my country, my family tree goes further back in America than most do... Quaker baby.

 

[shortylickens]

I came in here just to stir the pot.

 

[Kappo]

Yeah just like your grand parents, parents, parents did right? Unless you are full blooded native american?

I thought "progressive" meant moving forward, not trying to get payback for the past every single time.

"My great great great great great great grandparents had no health insurance, I'm suing"

 

[Tom]

It's not, as long as you do it legally (as in every other country).

Chuck

That doesn't answer my question, why is it illegal to come here ?

 

[OBLAMA2009]

all this worry about immigration is stupid. it makes no sense to have borders in north america at all. they want the jobs and americans sure as heck want the labor. the best way to handle this is to tear down all the national borders on this continent and form one big north american (and ultimately world) government

 

[IndyColtsFan]

Did the native americans have immigration laws?

Of course not. ericlp and the other kneejerkers (most likely on the left of the spectrum) are just grasping for straws. Using the argument "Bu....Bu...But your great great great great great grandfather didn't!" is ludicrous beyond words and they know it.

 

[IndyColtsFan]

That doesn't answer my question, why is it illegal to come here ?

Several people have answered this for you. I suggest you read through the thread.

Let's approach this from a different angle. If you didn't have laws governing immigration, what do you think would happen?

 

[nick1985]

That doesn't answer my question, why is it illegal to come here ?

/facepalm. Why are you Pro-open borders?


Its not illegal to immigrate to the US. Do it legally and we welcome you with open arms.

 

[Tristicus]

I came in here just to stir the pot.

That is win.

 

[nick1985]

That is win.

How Illegals get food stamps blows my mind. Makes me sick knowing my taxes pay for illegals.

 

[Munky]

That doesn't answer my question, why is it illegal to come here ?

Because the US is not a free for all pig farm where anyone can just show up and live off other people's tax money. Now go troll somewhere else.

 

[Modelworks]

Why is it illegal to come here ?

For one there are a lot of illegals that are criminals. You can come here , but you have to do it by the rules.

why illegals are bad:

-Agriprocessors Inc. - On May 12, 2008, ICE agents executed criminal and administrative search warrants at Agriprocessors, Inc., in Postville, IA, which resulted in the arrest of 389 illegal aliens. 305 of those arrested were also convicted of criminal offenses.


-Pilgrim’s Pride - On April 16, 2007, ICE agents arrested 311 illegal aliens working at five Pilgrim’s Pride sites. Of the 311 arrested, 91 were charged with other criminal violations.

-Del Monte Produce - On June 12, 2007, ICE agents arrested 168 illegal alien employees at their Portland, OR facility. In addition to the illegal workers, 13 managers and other workers were arrested and charged with various crimes including selling Social Security cards.

-Swift and Company - On Dec. 12, 2006, ICE agents arrested 1,297 illegal aliens at six Swift meat processing factories in six states. 274 of those arrested were also charged with other criminal offenses.

Smithfield Foods - After ICE agents raided the Tar Heel, NC plant and arrested 21 illegal alien workers, 500 workers with fake Social Security numbers were promptly fired from the factory. Another raid in August 2007, netted 28 more illegal aliens, all were from Mexico, Guatemala, and Honduras.

Do you really want people like this living next door to you without knowing who they are ?

 

[Svnla]

That doesn't answer my question, why is it illegal to come here ?

You can't be serious, right?

Because any sovereign countries on earth would control its border and enforce it rules and laws. Would you leave your home doors/windows wide open and let anyone come in and stay without questions?

I asked in another thread and many more online forums this question and even in person. Give me a name, just one name, of the country that anyone can enter ILLEGALY and stay without permission. So far, not a single person, not one, nada, can answer that very simple question.

Immigration is good for our country, but only by LEGAL means. It is not ILLEGAL to come to the US, it is ILLEGAL to come to the US ILLEGALLY. Next question.

 

[nick1985]

You can't be serious, right?

Because any sovereign countries on earth would control its border and enforce it rules and laws. Would you leave your home doors/windows wide open and let anyone come in and stay without questions?

I asked in another thread and many more online forums this question and even in person. Give me a name, just one name, of the country that anyone can enter ILLEGALY and stay without permission. So far, not a single person, not one, nada, can answer that very simple question.

Immigration is good for our country, but only by LEGAL means. It is not ILLEGAL to come to the US, it is ILLEGAL to come to the US ILLEGALLY. Next question.

teabagging racist.

 

[werepossum]

When you add that much cynicism to anything it will seem terrible.

Cynicism the first time, realism after that. Insanity, after all, is sometimes defined as doing the same thing and expecting different results - in this case, believing the lies of politicians that they will stop illegal immigration if they can just make some more illegals into legals first.

 

[WAZ]

why illegals are bad:

-Agriprocessors Inc. - On May 12, 2008, ICE agents executed criminal and administrative search warrants at Agriprocessors, Inc., in Postville, IA, which resulted in the arrest of 389 illegal aliens. 305 of those arrested were also convicted of criminal offenses.


-Pilgrim’s Pride - On April 16, 2007, ICE agents arrested 311 illegal aliens working at five Pilgrim’s Pride sites. Of the 311 arrested, 91 were charged with other criminal violations.

-Del Monte Produce - On June 12, 2007, ICE agents arrested 168 illegal alien employees at their Portland, OR facility. In addition to the illegal workers, 13 managers and other workers were arrested and charged with various crimes including selling Social Security cards.

-Swift and Company - On Dec. 12, 2006, ICE agents arrested 1,297 illegal aliens at six Swift meat processing factories in six states. 274 of those arrested were also charged with other criminal offenses.

Smithfield Foods - After ICE agents raided the Tar Heel, NC plant and arrested 21 illegal alien workers, 500 workers with fake Social Security numbers were promptly fired from the factory. Another raid in August 2007, netted 28 more illegal aliens, all were from Mexico, Guatemala, and Honduras.

Do you really want people like this living next door to you without knowing who they are ?

Not any less than a legal white person with a criminal record.

Arbitrary stats revealing that X number of illegal immigrants have criminal records are just that — arbitrary. It's a generic, blanket accusation using conveniently selective data, which could be easily countered by links to articles about all the crazy white motherfuckers out there who are also committing crimes.

Hell, the Pakistani who tried to blow up Times Square was a legal U.S. citizen. So was Timothy McVeigh. And Charles Manson. And millions of other criminals. Guess what, they're ALL disgruntled, violent assholes.

The legality of one's entry into this country has nothing to do with his intents or actions here; some illegal immigrants are definitely involved in drugs and violence, there's no doubt. But so are plenty of legal citizens: take a look at our overpopulated prison system, stuffed with legal U.S citizens. Other illegals are here looking for a better life and are not violent in any way like the selective groups you listed above. That doesn't make their illegal entry okay (and we should find a solution that works; yes, amnesty for a percentage of them would be appropriate, unlike mass-deporting 12 million people), but to group them under an umbrella with violent criminals based solely on their citizenship status is a cop-out.

I'd rather live next door to 500 of these illegals than to one McVeigh, KKK member, or other "All-American" jerkoff who thinks violence and hatred is the solution to anything.

 

[blackangst1]

Not any less than a legal white person with a criminal record.

Arbitrary stats revealing that X number of illegal immigrants have criminal records are just that — arbitrary. It's a generic, blanket accusation using conveniently selective data, which could be easily countered by links to articles about all the crazy white motherfuckers out there who are also committing crimes.

Hell, the Pakistani who tried to blow up Times Square was a legal U.S. citizen. So was Timothy McVeigh. And Charles Manson. And millions of other criminals. Guess what, they're ALL disgruntled, violent assholes.

The legality of one's entry into this country has nothing to do with his intents or actions here; some illegal immigrants are definitely involved in drugs and violence, there's no doubt. But so are plenty of legal citizens: take a look at our overpopulated prison system, stuffed with legal U.S citizens. Other illegals are here looking for a better life and are not violent in any way like the selective groups you listed above. That doesn't make their illegal entry okay (and we should find a solution that works; yes, amnesty for a percentage of them would be appropriate, unlike mass-deporting 12 million people), but to group them under an umbrella with violent criminals based solely on their citizenship status is a cop-out.

I'd rather live next door to 500 of these illegals than to one McVeigh, KKK member, or other "All-American" jerkoff who thinks violence and hatred is the solution to anything.

Perhaps you can write a little something explaining why you have a problem with sovereignty?

 

[EagleKeeper]

Not any less than a legal white person with a criminal record.

Arbitrary stats revealing that X number of illegal immigrants have criminal records are just that — arbitrary. It's a generic, blanket accusation using conveniently selective data, which could be easily countered by links to articles about all the crazy white motherfuckers out there who are also committing crimes.

Hell, the Pakistani who tried to blow up Times Square was a legal U.S. citizen. So was Timothy McVeigh. And Charles Manson. And millions of other criminals. Guess what, they're ALL disgruntled, violent assholes.

The legality of one's entry into this country has nothing to do with his intents or actions here; some illegal immigrants are definitely involved in drugs and violence, there's no doubt. But so are plenty of legal citizens: take a look at our overpopulated prison system, stuffed with legal U.S citizens. Other illegals are here looking for a better life and are not violent in any way like the selective groups you listed above. That doesn't make their illegal entry okay (and we should find a solution that works; yes, amnesty for a percentage of them would be appropriate, unlike mass-deporting 12 million people), but to group them under an umbrella with violent criminals based solely on their citizenship status is a cop-out.

I'd rather live next door to 500 of these illegals than to one McVeigh, KKK member, or other "All-American" jerkoff who thinks violence and hatred is the solution to anything.

So you have no problems with people being here illegally?
Deliberately breaking our laws before they have set two feet in our country!
That really shows their good intentions. Now if you grant them legal status and they state they will uphold the laws in the country - is such believable?

 

[Tom]

Because if anyone who wanted to come to the U.S. and become an American citizen were allowed to do so, then billions of impoverished people from around the world would make their way to the United States. Then our population would explode and our nation would transform into an overpopulated, impoverished third world country; we would be flooded with poverty. Who knows how detrimental it would be to the nation's environment.

(You don't have to be a rocket scientist to figure that out.)

If that's true, why didn't it happen in the past ?

 

[Tom]

Ever heard the word sovereignty before?

www.dictionary.com

That doesn't explain why it's illegal to come here, it might explain how such a law can be valid, not why we have the law.

 

[Tom]

You can't be serious, right?

Because any sovereign countries on earth would control its border and enforce it rules and laws. Would you leave your home doors/windows wide open and let anyone come in and stay without questions?

I asked in another thread and many more online forums this question and even in person. Give me a name, just one name, of the country that anyone can enter ILLEGALY and stay without permission. So far, not a single person, not one, nada, can answer that very simple question.

Immigration is good for our country, but only by LEGAL means. It is not ILLEGAL to come to the US, it is ILLEGAL to come to the US ILLEGALLY. Next question.

you've set up a circular paradox, it's illegal because it's illegal..

I'm trying to get us looking at why we are doing things, maybe it doesn't make sense.

I'm not for open borders. It should be illegal to come here and commit crimes, or as a combatant.

I'm not as sure it makes sense to make it illegal to come here and work and be a good citizen. I think we are making it harder to identify bad elements and keep them out, if they can mix with good people who's only "illegal" act is trying to have a better life.

Seems like it's worth considering, since our current policy has basically never worked, and maybe can't work. And it's only been the policy for a few decades, it isn't how we used to do things.