Creationist Ken Ham calls to end space program because aliens are going to hell anywa

[zinfamous]

This is good news. If aliens can not be saved then it precludes embarrassing attempts to save them.

 

[Retro Rob]

We're breathlessly waiting for creationists and intelligent design protagonists to submit their Biblical-based beginning-of-life hypotheses to the scientific method.

We've been waiting for several decades in fact....

I think you're missing the point of that post. Since religion makes claims as to the origins of the Universe, and by extension, intelligent life, those claims simply cannot go ignored because people actually believe these claims, and pass them down to their children.

In fact, it would behoove science to address these claims.

 

[davmat787]

Didn't the Catholic church make news a few years ago by announcing that extraterrestrial life is not in conflict with the bible and Catholicism? I seem to remember news along those lines.

edit: Here it is: Pope Benedict XVI's astronomer: the Catholic Church welcomes aliens

Highly evolved extra terrestrial lifeforms may be living in space and would be welcomed into the church - "no matter how many tentacles", one of the Pope's astronomers has said.

The senior Vatican scientist, Brother Guy Consolmagno, said that he would be delighted if we encountered intelligent aliens and would be happy to baptise them.
His pronouncement opens up the possibility of space missionaries heading out to the stars to convert aliens to Christianity.

 

[Retro Rob]

The senior Vatican scientist, Brother Guy Consolmagno, said that he would be delighted if we encountered intelligent aliens and would be happy to baptise them.

Yeah, that's until they man ships that bursts from underneath the ground and start zapping dudes to star-dust.

 

[alzan]

I think you're missing the point of that post. Since religion makes claims as to the origins of the Universe, and by extension, intelligent life, those claims simply cannot go ignored because people actually believe these claims, and pass them down to their children.

In fact, it would behoove science to address these claims.

That's already being done. Archaeology, Astronomy, Philology, Neurology, Anthropology and other sciences have shown the falsity of the more popular Biblical claims.

People who believe Biblical claims and pass them to their children have been doing so for a long time, in fact long past the time when some of the Biblical claims were originally shown to be false.

Science, specifically psychology can also explain why people cling to debunked beliefs.

 

[MongGrel]

this is good news. If aliens can not be saved then it precludes embarrassing attempts to save them.

Die E.T. , DIE YOU SHORT MIGRANT BEER THIEF !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xWMqsZOYWg

 

[Retro Rob]

That's already being done. Archaeology, Astronomy, Philology, Neurology, Anthropology and other sciences have shown the falsity of the more popular Biblical claims.

I would really like to see some things in the Bible specifically falsified in all these categories of science.

 

[alzan]

I would really like to see some things in the Bible specifically falsified in all these categories of science.

A geocentric universe for one; astronomy.

A close relationship between our beliefs and neuron firings, which can be drug induced, or even surgically removed; neurology.

Mesopotamian texts with similar superstitious stories about the universes and life's origins which predate the Bible; archaeology.

We are predisposed to believe what we prefer to be true, we think and behave illogically and that we are not so much evil as ill; psychology.

 

[MongGrel]

Yeah, that's until they man ships that bursts from underneath the ground and start zapping dudes to star-dust.

It's all fun and games till you piss off Mars.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYGWG2_PB_Q

Frig lost one that would have went well here, not looking again

 

[Retro Rob]

A geocentric universe for one; astronomy.

A close relationship between our beliefs and neuron firings, which can be drug induced, or even surgically removed; neurology.

Mesopotamian texts with similar superstitious stories about the universes and life's origins which predate the Bible; archaeology.

We are predisposed to believe what we prefer to be true, we think and behave illogically and that we are not so much evil as ill; psychology.

I said something specific to the Bible, because you did say "popular Biblical claims".

As usual, you're just talking out of your arse.

 

[Retro Rob]

It's all fun and games till you piss off Mars.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYGWG2_PB_Q

Frig lost one that would have went well here, not looking again

LOL, exactly!

 

[Fern]

Creationist Ken Ham calls to end space program because aliens are going to hell anywa

OK, that's pretty funny.

---------------

While I'm a strong proponent of a space program (just not ours as it currently exists) I think there are some valid concerns:

1. Bringing back a harmful organism.

2. Actually finding superior lifeforms. I do not adhere to the belief that because they are much further advanced they must necessarily be nonviolent or benevolent. We'd make decent slaves and/or our planet could be azz raped for resources.

Personally, I think any benevolent superior lifeform would be loathe to have contact with us. Wouldn't you? That only leaves the other kind.

Fern

 

[Retro Rob]

Personally, I think any benevolent superior lifeform would be loathe to have contact with us. Wouldn't you? That only leaves the other kind.

Fern

I normally ask why haven't we been contacted by "superior lifeforms" if they are allegedly abundant in the Universe.

Nothing but excuses as answers...

 

[alzan]

I said something specific to the Bible, because you did say "popular Biblical claims".

As usual, you're just talking out of your arse.

While you're busy picking gnat shit out of black pepper you're welcome to view other examples. That is if you can get past your conformational bias and take off your cross-shaped glasses.

 

[JEDIYoda]

A geocentric universe for one; astronomy.

A close relationship between our beliefs and neuron firings, which can be drug induced, or even surgically removed; neurology.

Mesopotamian texts with similar superstitious stories about the universes and life's origins which predate the Bible; archaeology.

We are predisposed to believe what we prefer to be true, we think and behave illogically and that we are not so much evil as ill; psychology.

links...or just your opinion...

 

[Atomic Playboy]

2. Actually finding superior lifeforms. I do not adhere to the belief that because they are much further advanced they must necessarily be nonviolent or benevolent. We'd make decent slaves and/or our planet could be azz raped for resources.

Personally, I think any benevolent superior lifeform would be loathe to have contact with us. Wouldn't you? That only leaves the other kind.

I like Neil DeGrasse Tyson's take on this, myself.

The closest genetic relative to the Human Being is the chimpanzee. We share 99 percent, identical DNA. We are smarter than a chimpanzee. Hypothetically, lets invent a measure of intelligence that make humans unique. Intelligence would be the ability to compose poetry, symphonies, art, math, and science, and this would be the arbitrary definition of intelligence, because chimps can't do any of that. But we share 99% identical DNA. The most brilliant chimp ever, could possible do some sign language, but so can our toddlers.

The fascinatingly disturbing thought is, everything that we are that distinguishes us from chimps, emerges from that one percent difference in DNA. It has to, because that's the difference. The Hubble Telescope, and all great human inventions are in that one percent. Everything that we are, that is not the chimp, is not as smart compared to the chimp, as we tell ourselves it is. The difference between constructing and launching the Hubble Telescope, and a chimp combining two finger motions as sign language, maybe that difference is not all that great. We tell ourselves it is, but maybe it's almost nothing.

How would we decide that? Imagine another life form that is one percent different from us, in the direction that we are different from the chimp. Think about that. We have a one percent difference and we're building the Hubble telescope. Go another one percent, and ask the questions, what are we to them? We would be drooling, blithering idiots in their presence. They would take Stephen Hawking and roll him in front of their primate researchers and say, "this one is the most brilliant among them because he can do astrophysics in his head." "Oh isn't that cute, little Johnny can do that too, it's on the refrigerator, he did it in his elementary school class."

Think about how smart they would be. Quantitative mechanics would be intuitive to their toddlers. Entire symphonies would be written by their children, and placed on the refrigerator door, the way our pasta collages are on our refrigerator doors.

The notion that we're going to find intelligent life, and have a conversation with it, is humorous. When was the last time you stopped to have a conversation with a worm, or a bird? We don't have conversations with other species on earth, with whom we have DNA in common, to believe that some intelligent other species is going to be interested in us, enough to have a conversation, is absurd.

Are we as a species simply too stupid to figure out the universe we are investigating? There could very well be a species, one percent smarter than we are, for which String Theory (theory of everything - TOE - self contained mathematical model that describes all fundamental forces and forms of matter) is intuitive; for which all the greatest mysteries of the universe, from dark matter, dark energy, origins of life, and all the frontiers of our thought, would be something that this intelligent species could just self-intuit.

Benevolent or not, the idea that we're going to be having sophisticated conversations with intelligent life is pretty silly. They might as well throw us in a zoo. Which, if I'm remembering Slaughterhouse 5 correctly, might not be so bad.

 

[zinfamous]

I think you're missing the point of that post. Since religion makes claims as to the origins of the Universe, and by extension, intelligent life, those claims simply cannot go ignored because people actually believe these claims, and pass them down to their children.

In fact, it would behoove science to address these claims.

Huh?

Claims that reject the scientific method of testing can not be addressed by science. Try not to pretend that this is some type of "win" for your club.

 

[zinfamous]

I normally ask why haven't we been contacted by "superior lifeforms" if they are allegedly abundant in the Universe.

Nothing but excuses as answers...

wtf?

When did you ever see an "alleged abundance of superior lifeforms" claimed by anyone, ever? Please show this.

Second, please explain your follow-up assumption that the presence of any such a superior lifeform in the Universe (hint: The Universe is ass-fucking HUGE), precludes an immediate ability to contact another.

 

[Atomic Playboy]

I normally ask why haven't we been contacted by "superior lifeforms" if they are allegedly abundant in the Universe.

Nothing but excuses as answers...

You could ask the exact same question about God, since he is allegedly everywhere. This is the problem with being unable to imagine a reality outside of the one you personally believe exists; you're incapable of having an actual discussion about the merits of your viewpoint because you are unwilling to accept that you might be wrong. I'm perfectly willing to accept that God (or Gods) might exist even though I don't personally see evidence and don't currently believe; are you willing to accept that he (or they) might not?

 

[zinfamous]

I said something specific to the Bible, because you did say "popular Biblical claims".

As usual, you're just talking out of your arse.

No evidence found for a flood that destroyed humanity some 3k, 5k, 10k ya--however many absurd years you claim the earth to have existed.

The claim begins as false, because there as yet exists no evidence for it.

 

[MongGrel]

I like Neil DeGrasse Tyson's take on this, myself.



Benevolent or not, the idea that we're going to be having sophisticated conversations with intelligent life is pretty silly. They might as well throw us in a zoo. Which, if I'm remembering Slaughterhouse 5 correctly, might not be so bad.

Someday we'll get on the String Theory Superhighway, if we don't blow each other up first.

Then the E.T.'s might start looking at us like "Wow, where did you guys come from" and offer some tips :biggrin:



I always got a kick out of Douglas Adams teasers aliens landing here landing in obscure spots just to screw with people so they'd be not believed.

The Origin of God (Douglas Adams)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9sV3zNge9o

Teasing a bit but is entertaining.

 

[zinfamous]

links...or just your opinion...

yes, the earth is still flat.

please, do go on.

 

[Retro Rob]

No evidence found for a flood that destroyed humanity some 3k, 5k, 10k ya--however many absurd years you claim the earth to have existed.

I never made a claim on the age of the Earth.

The claim begins as false, because there as yet exists no evidence for it.

LOL -- there are so many things thought to be "false" as far as Biblical archaeology is concerned, only to be blown away by evidence:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_artifacts_in_biblical_archaeology

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_biblical_figures_identified_in_extra-biblical_sources

If anything, scientific findings has relegated Biblical denial to an ever-receding pocket of ignorance.

 

[kage69]

Damn I don't wish the end to anyone but can this hurry up and go. He is so damn embarrassing to the country.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/07/...gram-because-aliens-are-going-to-hell-anyway/

Creationist Ken Ham has said that the U.S. space program is a waste of money because any alien life that scientists found would be damned to hell.

“I’m shocked at the countless hundreds of millions of dollars that have been spent over the years in the desperate and fruitless search for extraterrestrial life,” Ham wrote in a Sunday column on his Answers in Genesis website.

Ham argued that “secularists are desperate to find life in outer space” as a part of their “rebellion against God in a desperate attempt to supposedly prove evolution.”


“Life did not evolve but was specially created by God, as Genesis clearly teaches. Christians certainly shouldn’t expect alien life to be cropping up across the universe,” he continued. “Now the Bible doesn’t say whether there is or is not animal or plant life in outer space. I certainly suspect not.”

But regardless of whether there was life in outer space, Ham asserted that it could not be truly “intelligent.”

“You see, the Bible makes it clear that Adam’s sin affected the whole universe. This means that any aliens would also be affected by Adam’s sin, but because they are not Adam’s descendants, they can’t have salvation,” he explained. “Jesus did not become the ‘GodKlingon’ or the ‘GodMartian’! Only descendants of Adam can be saved. God’s Son remains the ‘Godman’ as our Savior.”

Friendly Atheist blogger Hemant Mehta called Ham’s quest to end the space program “a new low even for him.”

“Jesus Christ, Ken Ham is talking about the eternal damnation of alien life forms,” Mehta wrote. “They’re all going to hell, apparently, and why go in search of life on other planets if they’re all doomed to a lake of fire?”

“To whine about the pittance we spend on space exploration because ‘Christians certainly shouldn’t expect alien life to be cropping up across the universe’ has to be a new low even for him.”

Isn't that mentally challenged nutbag an Aussie though? Or did he find an equally nutty American woman to marry?

 

[MtnMan]

Religion and belief in the imaginary demons or gods of religion creates a really special type of stupid that cannot be achieved any other way.