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Covid is slamming India, a worst nightmare

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
30,152
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India is in the throes of a catastrophe. Prime Minister Modi's Hindu party government is anti-science, smugly delighted in their success with the first wave (with draconian lockdown and no care for its sufferers), sanctioned subsequent super spreader political rallies and sports events and now the moneyed, politicians and the famous have access to beds, medicine and likely oxygen if they catch covid, but the general public likely doesn't.

A vicious 2nd wave has emerged, the last week officially over 300,000 new cases daily, more than a couple thousands deaths daily, but those numbers are a coverup, it's way way worse than they are reporting.

India's the world's leading producer of covid vaccine but only 2% of its inhabitants are fully vaccinated.

 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
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Here's an eye opening comment by a reader of an NYTimes article today:

Whats in a name
Planet Earth8h ago
Dear Americans, I am an Indian and the scale of tragedy here in India is immense. And the catastrophe is exacerbated by the shocking corruption of some of our fellow Indians. There are reports of black-marketing of essential oxygen and drugs like Remdesivir. In some areas, government ambulances, which are supposed to be free, are charging Rs.15000 for a 20 km ride. In some government hospitals (I wont take names), bribes are required to be paid even for getting basic services like an injection of a medicine. Dont be surprised if you hear news of adulterated drugs being sold at ex-orbitant prices. For cremating bodies, prices are jacked up by 6-7 times. Meanwhile, many beds at most high-end private hospitals are reserved for influential figures like politicians, movie-stars, cricket-players, celebrities. These celebrities get admitted to a high-end hospital at the first sign of illness as a measure of "abundant pre-caution", while an average person is not guaranteed a bed, even if critically ill. In case an average person manages to get a bed at a private hospital, the bill will be so high that she/he will lose her/his life savings. The pandemic has really exposed an ugly side of our nation. Thanks for reading and sorry for this rant.

INDIA DISPATCH

‘This Is a Catastrophe.’ In India, Illness Is Everywhere.
As India suffers the world’s worst coronavirus crisis, our New Delhi bureau chief describes the fear of living amid a disease spreading at such scale and speed.


Beginning of story:

By Jeffrey Gettleman

April 27, 2021Updated 3:16 p.m. ET
NEW DELHI — Crematories are so full of bodies, it’s as if a war just happened. Fires burn around the clock. Many places are holding mass cremations, dozens at a time, and at night, in certain areas of New Delhi, the sky glows.
Sickness and death are everywhere.
Dozens of houses in my neighborhood have sick people.
One of my colleagues is sick.
One of my son’s teachers is sick.
The neighbor two doors down, to the right of us: sick.
Two doors to the left: sick.
“I have no idea how I got it,” said a good friend who is now in the hospital. “You catch just a whiff of this…..” and then his voice trailed off, too sick to finish.
He barely got a bed. And the medicine his doctors say he needs is nowhere to be found in India.
I’m sitting in my apartment waiting to catch the disease. That’s what it feels like right now in New Delhi with the world’s worst coronavirus crisis advancing around us. It is out there, I am in here, and I feel like it’s only a matter of time before I, too, get sick.
 
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brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
20,526
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It’s really bad. At this point it isn’t so much a cover up as they can’t test enough people to get an accurate count. The excess death data will tell the true tale in several months.
Someone I work with that has most of their family there told me that their entire family was sick now. The assumption of course is it’s COVID but it hasn’t been formally diagnosed because they can’t get tested.
 
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brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
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Is it though ? I mean compared to what other nations have been through ?

I guess they are burning corpses in parks because it isn’t that bad………

Still waiting for you to identify a vaccine that has negative health effects that showed up long after the vaccine was given.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
30,152
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Is it though ? I mean compared to what other nations have been through ?

This guy's clearly full of shit. After a couple of minutes he says there were no lockdowns in India. That's absolute bullshit. Plus he's talking about nothing but published data and the data from India is bullshit. Prevarication and lies of the first order.
 

manly

Diamond Member
Jan 25, 2000
8,827
431
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It’s really bad. At this point it isn’t so much a cover up as they can’t test enough people to get an accurate count. The excess death data will tell the true tale in several months.
Someone I work with that has most of their family there told me that their entire family was sick now. The assumption of course is it’s COVID but it hasn’t been formally diagnosed because they can’t get tested.
They don't even have semi-accurate mortality data, and the majority of deaths aren't assigned a cause. The depths of this disaster will probably never be fully known.
 
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esquared

Forum Director & Omnipotent Overlord
Forum Director
Oct 8, 2000
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Yeah, this has been going on for a few weeks now
They don't even have semi-accurate mortality data, and the majority of deaths aren't assigned a cause. The depths of this disaster will probably never be fully known.
I've read where it's been said that 80% of the COVID-19 deaths aren't even listed.
Last week I read that the 24/7 non-stop cremations were causing metal fatigue in the cremation devices.

"Mukherjee’s research of India’s first wave concludes that there were 11 times more infections than were reported, in line with estimates from studies in other countries.

In Surat, Gujarat’s second largest city, Sailor’s Kurukshetra crematorium and a second crematorium known as Umra have cremated more than 100 bodies a day under COVID protocols over the last week, far in excess of the city’s official daily COVID death toll of around 25, according to interviews with workers.

Elsewhere, India Today reported two crematoriums in Bhopal, the capital of the central state of Madhya Pradesh, 187 bodies were cremated following COVID protocols in four days this month, while the official COVID death toll stood at five.

Last week Sandesh, a Gujarati newspaper, counted 63 bodies leaving a single COVID-only hospital for burial in the state’s largest city, Ahmedabad, on a day where government data showed 20 coronavirus deaths."

But fewer than a quarter of deaths in India are medically certified, particularly in rural areas, meaning the true COVID death rate in many of India’s 24 other states may never be known.

“Most of the deaths are not registered so it’s impossible to do a validation calculation,” Mukherjee said.


It appears that we will not know the true numbers of lives lost and COVID-19 infections in India.
 

Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
30,152
3,556
126
It appears that we will not know the true numbers of lives lost and COVID-19 infections in India.
Assuming there's a way to determine how many people have been dying in India we will have the above average deaths and can attribute those to covid. We're doing that here. In fact the % of above average deaths in 2020 was higher than at the height of the 1918 Spanish flu epidemic:

The difference lies in baseline mortality rates. People died of causes not associated with H1N1 in 1918, because of poorer hygiene, public health and safety. Therefore, researchers found the relative increase during the early period of the COVID-19 epidemic was "substantially greater" than the peak of the Spanish flu pandemic.
 

manly

Diamond Member
Jan 25, 2000
8,827
431
126
Yeah, this has been going on for a few weeks now

I've read where it's been said that 80% of the COVID-19 deaths aren't even listed.
Last week I read that the 24/7 non-stop cremations were causing metal fatigue in the cremation devices.

"Mukherjee’s research of India’s first wave concludes that there were 11 times more infections than were reported, in line with estimates from studies in other countries.

In Surat, Gujarat’s second largest city, Sailor’s Kurukshetra crematorium and a second crematorium known as Umra have cremated more than 100 bodies a day under COVID protocols over the last week, far in excess of the city’s official daily COVID death toll of around 25, according to interviews with workers.

Elsewhere, India Today reported two crematoriums in Bhopal, the capital of the central state of Madhya Pradesh, 187 bodies were cremated following COVID protocols in four days this month, while the official COVID death toll stood at five.

Last week Sandesh, a Gujarati newspaper, counted 63 bodies leaving a single COVID-only hospital for burial in the state’s largest city, Ahmedabad, on a day where government data showed 20 coronavirus deaths."

But fewer than a quarter of deaths in India are medically certified, particularly in rural areas, meaning the true COVID death rate in many of India’s 24 other states may never be known.

“Most of the deaths are not registered so it’s impossible to do a validation calculation,” Mukherjee said.


It appears that we will not know the true numbers of lives lost and COVID-19 infections in India.
Reported today by CNN, and the numbers are staggering:

It's hard to fathom or understand, but I guess they prematurely spiked the football in January when official counts were low; which subsequently led to exponential growth that's ongoing.

NYT and WSJ have both reported on excess mortality worldwide in 2020 and IIRC, India didn't have any meaningful data to report.

Assuming there's a way to determine how many people have been dying in India we will have the above average deaths and can attribute those to covid. We're doing that here. In fact the % of above average deaths in 2020 was higher than at the height of the 1918 Spanish flu epidemic:

There are many poor countries that don't have modern public health infrastructure to collect this data.
 
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Muse

Lifer
Jul 11, 2001
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Reported today by CNN, and the numbers are staggering:

It's hard to fathom or understand, but I guess they prematurely spiked the football in January when official counts were low; which subsequently led to exponential growth that's ongoing.

NYT and WSJ have both reported on excess mortality worldwide in 2020 and IIRC, India didn't have any meaningful data to report.


There are many poor countries that don't have modern public health infrastructure to collect this data.
"I don't think any family has been spared a Covid death," said Laxminarayan. "There's a missing person in every family that I can think of."
:oops:
 

Greenman

Lifer
Oct 15, 1999
17,276
2,526
126
Indian friends of mine have family back home, six have died of the rona over the last year. They said it's out of control.
 

UNCjigga

Lifer
Dec 12, 2000
22,922
5,338
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As bad as it sounds in India, the reality is much worse. Lost 2 family members within 48 hours of each other last week. The worst part was how surviving family had to wait 7 hours next to their dead relative in the heat just to get their turn at the crematorium. Yes, they had to pay extra just to get the ambulance and a hospital bed but it didn’t do much good when the oxygen ran out. What’s worse, when you call the hospital and ask questions or recommend a treatment the staff will get angry with relatives and threaten to give the bed away.
 

brycejones

Lifer
Oct 18, 2005
20,526
12,158
136
As bad as it sounds in India, the reality is much worse. Lost 2 family members within 48 hours of each other last week. The worst part was how surviving family had to wait 7 hours next to their dead relative in the heat just to get their turn at the crematorium. Yes, they had to pay extra just to get the ambulance and a hospital bed but it didn’t do much good when the oxygen ran out. What’s worse, when you call the hospital and ask questions or recommend a treatment the staff will get angry with relatives and threaten to give the bed away.
So sorry for your family's loss.
 

Moonbeam

Elite Member
Nov 24, 1999
67,136
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pmv

Diamond Member
May 30, 2008
8,166
3,166
136
I wish our government would go on a war footing to produce enough vaccine for the whole world.
I assume the limited supply of vaccines isn't just down to a choice not to try hard enough, or incompetence. But I don't really have any understanding of what the real bottleneck/limiting factor is. Does seem like it's time to go full WW2/"arsenal of democracy" on this thing. With everyone I know with family in India, almost all of them over there seem to be seriously ill with COVID. If it's down to more contagious variants, we can probably be sure they are coming this way very soon. If it's down to behaviour, that's probably coming as well, as people won't be able to stand social distancing indefinitely.
 
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Leeea

Senior member
Apr 3, 2020
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Biden is the only reason this is not happening to us in the USA.

We need to release vaccine sales to India. At the very least, those Astra Zeneca vaccines sitting on ice* need to go. That is the only hope in this disaster.

*and yes, it is all Trumps fault:
About 10 million AstraZeneca doses already made in the US are ensnared in the problems of Emergent BioSolutions, the contract vaccine manufacturer notorious for ruining 15 million doses of Johnson & Johnson’s COVID-19 vaccine.
Federal lawmakers, meanwhile, are investigating whether Emergent used ties to the Trump administration to unduly earn millions of dollars’ worth of federal grants, despite a long track record of failings and persistent quality-control problems.
yep, this holdup is yet another disaster committed by the republicans.

although, at least Biden is able to salvage something from the Trump's AstraZeneca disaster:
Lastly, though the US can’t yet send already-made doses of AstraZeneca’s vaccine to India, administration officials have diverted US orders of supplies for making AstraZeneca’s vaccine directly to India.
 
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