Could this election have been fixed?

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: randym431
Well playing the devils advocate, which I often do, there?s an article in today?s Newsweek (I think it was Newsweek) about how bad the Kerry campaign was ran. That his wife caused problems. And how James Carvell almost quit because they would not take his advice or shape up. If all that?s true, that alone would be Kerry?s demise.

The losers will always start eating their own lookig for excuses and finger pointing.

 

[randym431]

Kerry had a big problem making up his mind was also mentioned in Newsweek. That I believe. I often noticed he gave these two sided answers. He was very good at that. Like with Gay marriage. He was against that, but for unions. He would give an answer, but always go on to condition it. I could understand that, but many couldn?t. One thing I also noticed in Kerry, that no one else ever mentioned, ever...was Kerry was a nervous type. I called it the Don Knotts syndrome. Back a few months ago he was on a Sunday morning news show. Sitting in a chair across from Chris Mathews (sp). When the camera was in long shot of the two men, and Kerry was bring ask a question, Kerry was always ringing his hands or fingers. I thought that was weird. I seen him do it again in one of his last interviews just before the election. Also, he had a strange way of wetting his lips when talking. Like a lizard tongue motion. That creeped me out a few times. But, still, he was tons and loads better than Bush ever was/will be!

 

[randym431]

The losers will always start eating their own lookig for excuses and finger pointing.

Not me, just things I noticed. I truly pray he'll run again in 2008. Especially when everyone voting for Bush realize (and they will), that we were right. Maybe when your job is lost and sent to India, or you get ill from eating fish, or when you're paying $9 a gal for gas, or when the troops death tool reach 3000 you'll wake up (then again, probably not)?

 

[AFB]

Sure it could have been, just as Clinton's could have been, and Regan's, and ........ They all could have been, but I doubt it.

 

[imhotepmp]

Originally posted by: randym431
Could this election have been fixed? I keep reading articles on how baffling the exit polls were when compared to the counted vote. Even the Des Moines Register, here, did its own exit polling which found a large turnout for Kerry. When ask why the difference between their exit polls and the count, the Register said ?we don?t know, it doesn?t add up?. I hear and read the same from exit pollers all over the country. Could it just be, the exit polls were right and the count was wrong? One large exit polling company said they had not seen this type of difference since 2000, in Florida. FLORIDA? Hello!!! This needs to be looked into, especially since Ohio was the key here for the winner. And Ohio, like Florida, just had enough votes turn up to favor Bush. Something smells really bad here! Could it possibly be someone, wanting to favor Republicans, could have devised a system to alter the vote that?s turned in? Could thousands and millions of votes been added to the Bush coffers? Sound like a spy novel in the making? Or maybe a ?Mission Impossible? TV show plot? Wouldn?t it be amazing if someone could and did actually devise a system to do this. And do it so that its totally un detected?
Republicans are very loyal. Its always been said they get out and vote, where as Democrats don?t vote. If that?s true, and as a Democrat I know it is, then where did the Republicans find all these ?sleeping? Republican voters? I don?t think there?s such a thing. I haven?t heard of a single Democrat that says they voted Republican, and few independents. But the Republicans claim they found and got out all these ?sleeping? voters who just happened to love an idiot president that has wrecked the air and water , started his own personal war, and lost a lot of jobs people had before he came into office. Do you buy that? I Don?t! And the news media keep saying more voters turned out this time than ever before, but they voted for Bush. What? Makes absolutely no sense at all. So I wonder, could they, did they (someone) actually figure out how to tinker with the system of voting? There are so many areas of voting that are electronic now. Even punch cards are read electronically, not to mention the new all electronic voting machines. Anyone on the internet knows how easy it is to get hacked, viruses or bugs via email or just by being online. Someone always figures out a way to beat security and get a virus into your PC. So what?s so shocking that someone figures out how to tinker and alter your vote after you?ve punched or selected that candidate? All I can say is its becoming more and more fishy the large number of votes cast (in all), and how so many just happened to go to Bush. Will we ever know for sure? How deep is the deception? If this is and was possible, and if it did happen in this country, you know what that would mean. It would mean that freedom in this country is over, friends. All over! If these exit polls were right, then we?re in serious trouble!

See threads:
Here


here

To briefly answer your question:
-Diebold makes electronic voting machines that were used in both florida and ohio
-These machines give abolutely no record of the votes
- These machines were known to be insecure and easily manipulated
- The CEO of DIEBOLD promised to deliver OHIO to bush

Do you see the problem here?

Imouthes

 

[cmdavid]

and so it begins!

 

[chess9]

The federal judge handling the case in Florida declined to order the machines removed prior to the election, BUT he said in his opinion, as I recall, that he was troubled by the lack of a paper record for recounts. Florida law has a recount provision which has to be ignored because in the counties with the Diebold machines, no recount is possible. To me, this scenario is fraught with myriad difficulties in light of the known political affiliation of the manufacturer of the Diebold machines and Florida's almost mythic inability to "get it right".

In addition, I'm now hearing about problems with the optical scanners as well.

This is NOT an entirely baseless possibility (a fixed election), though at first blush I would say that institutionalized indifference to the quality of the vote count is more likely the culprit.

-Robert

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: randym431
I just cant buy that so many hidden people were discovered, and convinced to vote for Bush. And even though Gays aren?t the most liked people in society, I cant believe people would turn out in force thinking Gay marriage was around the corner (which it isn?t & never was). How or why would a voter think some Gay couples are going to be allowed to marry, and be so concerned about that, but ignore the fact jobs are going and costs are rising.

OMG, where are you getting your polls? ATP&N? :roll: Polls all had Bush very slightly ahead going into the election. You liberal message board monkeys need to pull your heads out of the sand and realize you're a bunch of extremist wackos with warped perceptions. Just because you outnumber the conservatives on THIS board doesn't mean you outnumber them throughout the country.

 

[ciba]

Originally posted by: spidey07
heh, I saw on my local news that 20% polled think bush won on a technicality.

Yeah...it...was...fixed....yeah, that's what happened.
:roll:

Yeah... technicality.

 

[chess9]

Ciba:

Oh, that's dusty old parchment and entirely irrelevant to the Bush Administration, to say nothng of 5 of the Supremes.

-Robert

 

[spidey07]

you guys crack me up. You simply can't let go.

This is hilarious.

 

[chess9]

spidey:

We're just holding onto a slender reed of hope that we can prove Bush is a crook as well as a moron.

-Robert

 

[Pliablemoose]

I'm pretty sure the signals to the machines were sent from the International Space Station, originally the plan was to use a shuttle so the Russians wouldn't know about it, but if you noticed Putin's immediate support of Bush must mean that he knew about it.

I will be marketing a disposable tinfoil hat for 06' it should make your vote really count.

I think ~$5 is reasonable to defend our representative democracy, don't you?

 

[spidey07]

Originally posted by: chess9
spidey:

We're just holding onto a slender reed of hope that we can prove Bush is a crook as well as a moron.

-Robert

well one out of two ain't bad.

 

[maluckey]

Yup! It was fixed, as were all the Republican wins in the House and the Senate. Tom Daschles loss was fixed, and the Moon Landing never occurred.

The voters decided....again, that they wanted less liberals running the show, and got their wishes. Conspiracy thoerists used to be limited to the Deep South, but I see their views are spreading.

 

[Rogue]

Hmmm...my guess is that I find it hard to believe that the average Republican is going to sit outside a polling place all day and report this data. I do find it highly likely that a liberal college student or someone similar is far more likely to participate in something like this. I also think that a large contingent of Republican voters turned out after 5pm once they all got off work. The exit polls were likely taken before that time, which would show a high number of out of work, liberal weenies leaving the polling area waiting for their government sponsored paychecks to come in from their liberal candidate.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Today's voters are pretty sophisticated, perhaps a mylar hat with an elastic chin strap for windy days would sell.

Or something like those personal mosquito things that hang from your belt... With a battery that could only be serviced @ the factory, for a small fee...

 

[conjur]

Surprising Pattern of Florida's Election Results
http://ustogether.org/Florida_Election.htm


Look at the Percent Change columns and notice how it appears some counties show 100% voter participation by registered Republicans or even higher.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: imhotepmp

To briefly answer your question:
-Diebold makes electronic voting machines that were used in both florida and ohio
-These machines give abolutely no record of the votes
- These machines were known to be insecure and easily manipulated
- The CEO of DIEBOLD promised to deliver OHIO to bush

Do you see the problem here?

Imouthes

It's simple. You don't bring a marked deck to the poker game unless you plan to cheat.

 

[digitalsm]

Originally posted by: Valvoline6
The exit pollsters are saying the later data that came in showed Bush was going to win. The incorrect data was the preliminary first wave, and was raw data, before taking into consideration formulas and adjustments based on locations and sample.

The main problem was the leaking of raw data. Look around, get the facts.

This is VERY KEY, the first wave of data is often incomplete and error prone thats why exit polling data is NOT supposed to be released until after the first polls close. Someone leaked the first wave of exit polling that under sampled men and republicans and over sampled women and democrats.

 

[phillyTIM]

Yeah it's exactly like last year's Mayoral race here in Philadelphia, where widespread fraud was reported and somehow 100% participation in certain districts oddly showed up.

Call a spade a spade, and a fraud a fraud for what it is.

 

[Pliablemoose]

LOL, and so it begins...

Keep reaching guys.

 

[chess9]

Conjur:

Those numbers are very odd indeed. Who is saying what about those numbers? Just looking at the numbers, without knowing anything else, one could easily conclude that the optical scanners had somehow been rigged or were inaccurate. The Republican vote in my county is very high, by the way. A few thousand votes per county and we have a completely different election.

But, there must be some other explanation other than fraud. Like our stupidity.

One interesting note though. After a candidate concedes, if election fraud is determined, what can be done aboout it? Hmmm, I'll bet nothing. Suppose we find out after GW is sworn in that his people cheated? There's nothing that can be done. The chimp will have stolen TWO elections and never spent a day in jail, assuming guilt of course.

-Robert

 

[chess9]

Ok, why don't you Bush supporters take a look at that graph Conjur just posted above and give us a rational explanation for the numbers?

This could get interesting.

Frankly, I doubt cheating occurred, but nothing surprises me about voting in the South. I'm too old and remember too much.

-Robert

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: chess9
Conjur:

Those numbers are very odd indeed. Who is saying what about those numbers? Just looking at the numbers, without knowing anything else, one could easily conclude that the optical scanners had somehow been rigged or were inaccurate. The Republican vote in my county is very high, by the way. A few thousand votes per county and we have a completely different election.

But, there must be some other explanation other than fraud. Like our stupidity.

One interesting note though. After a candidate concedes, if election fraud is determined, what can be done aboout it? Hmmm, I'll bet nothing. Suppose we find out after GW is sworn in that his people cheated? There's nothing that can be done. The chimp will have stolen TWO elections and never spent a day in jail, assuming guilt of course.

-Robert

Well, a concession is not binding. *IF* fraud is found and enough votes swing to a Kerry EV victory, well, expect a courtroom mess.

But, my opinion is that provisional ballots are coming in to play to cause the increase in %s.