Conservatives should get weak on drugs

[xj0hnx]

Try looking back at who started the namecalling and took this in this direction. Seriously, do you have any self-awareness whatsoever?

Just trying to keep you from derailing one of the only discussion's not infected with the left/right bullshit with your inappropriate partisan douchebaggery.

 

[Mani]

Just trying to keep you from derailing one of the only discussion's not infected with the left/right bullshit with your inappropriate partisan douchebaggery.

Ah, so that's what it is? Let me get this straight - namecalling to prevent a thread from getting derailed? Brilliant strategy there.

 

[xj0hnx]

Ah, so that's what it is? Let me get this straight - namecalling to prevent a thread from getting derailed? Brilliant strategy there.

Can you stop crying and get on topic?

 

[Mani]

By the way, it's awesome that you're accusing me injecting partisan stuff into a thread entitled "Conservatives should get weak on drugs". Keep it up, man, you're on fire with this stuff.

 

[Mani]

Can you stop crying and get on topic?

lol, you are a piece of work. Again, self-awareness.

 

[xj0hnx]

By the way, it's awesome that you're accusing me injecting partisan stuff into a thread entitled "Conservatives should get weak on drugs". Keep it up, man, you're on fire with this stuff.

lol, you are a piece of work. Again, self-awareness.

Like I said, try actually reading the thread instead of being a little loony left robot stuck on "hate conservatives". All I am seeing from you is "OMG conservatives in the thread title let me pop in and blurt out some completely unrelated to the topic of discussion shit to show how evil republicans are while completely ignoring the democrats taking the same contributions, and doing the same actions I am crying about republicans doing".

 

[Mani]

Like I said, try actually reading the thread instead of being a little loony left robot stuck on "hate conservatives". All I am seeing from you is "OMG conservatives in the thread title let me pop in and blurt out some completely unrelated to the topic of discussion shit to show how evil republicans are while completely ignoring the democrats taking the same contributions, and doing the same actions I am crying about republicans doing".

I read the OP, and responded to the OP. I must not have gotten the memo that all responses on AT forums must be to immediately preceding posts in a thread. Thanks for setting me straight on posting etiquette. By the way, is using terms like "partisan hack" and "loony left robot" part of the proper etiquette memo as well? Thanks in advance.

 

[William Gaatjes]

They are already doing the drugs. The only difference is now some of them get caught, loose their jobs and often go to jail. When they are released they often have a very difficult time getting meaningful employment when they are released from jail.

Again, how are you helping or solving a problem? From where I sit all I can see is the WOD doing nothing but harming our society. I don't buy the argument that everyone will all of a sudden become crackheads if we make crack legal either. Will you be drawn to smoking crack or shooting up heroin simply because it is legal to do so?

Well, these drugs are taken because of the mind altering behaviour. How can you expect anybody to function properly while on drugs ? The people i have seen and haven spoken with, using drugs, where not living on the street, some of them where but they are really the people who need serious help.

No i am talking about the group that still has a job, and a house. But what was very clear as they noticed themselves was the change of behaviour. The increasingly calling in sick or canceling appointments because of using. And some where able to control it sort of but in the end all had to seek help. These are the people who still had a job, a house, a car, a girlfriend or a boyfriend/ wife or husband. None of these people was able to keep it under control. Only a certain group could, but those are the people one could call welfare workers because shortly after a job they end up without the job again, because they just do not care about anything but getting a high. This is sad. The other point is , who thinks of the kids ? The young and naive will always try anything when you tell them not (Most adults including the deranged individuals above who replied are exactly the same). Now because it is illegal there is still some barrier. But when you legalize the heavy forms of drugs, what will happen. The barrier to use get's smaller. Now it is already known that drugs are not beneficial to the development of the brain of adolescents.

The advantage of taking drugs... There really are none. Medicine are used because people need them to heal. It should never be the case that people need medicines to keep functioning. It is now, because the real solution to a certain illness is not known yet or is a very dangerous procedure with current technology. That is why medicine are here. Better to have some solution to an illness then none at all.

When it comes to the war on drugs :
Who is the number 1 supplier ?
And why ?
What are the political motives ?
Why is there no real solution ?

You should ask these questions yourself and do the research.
I will be curious to find out what you come up with.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I don't use "dope". You appear to do so, however.

Well, once i was young and tried several versions. Seemed fun, but i realized the effects and moved on. I really do not understand why people make such a big deal out of it, that drugs has to be in their lives. Well, actually from observing others i do, that is why some of the responses give me an itch. Plus i have an natural advantage over most people to kind of cancel out the effects when i push my adrenaline and cortisol levels to the max, which is kind of easy because of how i am.

 

[William Gaatjes]

But this opens up a new can of worms. One could say sugar is addictive because it is tied to diabetes - the body can no longer produce enough insulin. That's quite similar to how taking too much meth for too long causes your body to not produce enough dopamine to function properly.

You should look at food as building blocks and fuel. Take for example proteins.
These are build up of amino acids. Some are essential, which means taking our body for example, our body cannot synthesize from loose molecules on it's own. It does not mean we are addicted to these amino acids. It just means we need it to support our body. A non essential amino acid our body can synthesize from loose molecules on it's own.
The difference is, that some form of drugs seem to turbo charge a person while nutrients are just nothing more then nutrients, that is to sustain yourself. That is why these forms of drugs are called stimulants.
You can perform this test if you like and if you are susceptible to the effects of coffee.Like coffee for example. When you sleep enough hours everyday , and you drink coffee everyday and then just stop drinking coffee do you stil have withdrawal effects ?

When it comes to sugar, i do not know all the details anymore but some research suggested that some forms of sugar are even having an withdrawal effect when humans stop taking them. But in the end feel better and healthier when not taking that particular form. I don't know if the research was correct and would like to know if someone has a comment on that.

 

[William Gaatjes]

The only one that hasn't made any worthwhile debate here is you, and your clear lack of understanding in this field. The whole of your argument rest on denying the reality that is, and that somehow keeping them illegal, and continuing to treat it as a criminal matter are somehow going to make it better even though decades of documented history say it will not.

Your documented history does not exist. And please do not bring up the American prohibition of 1920 as an example. It has no value. Because although cocaine and opium where legal once (pre WW2). It did nothing to improve the quality of life. If it did, it was for the following : The royal families of England and the Netherlands got very very rich of it(think 10 millions to 100 millions during the 1900 and before). The common people just lived in misery. This wil not change when you legalize the heavy forms of drugs.

 

[xj0hnx]

-snip-mindless babble-/snip-

Now because it is illegal there is still some barrier. But when you legalize the heavy forms of drugs, what will happen. The barrier to use get's smaller. Now it is already known that drugs are not beneficial to the development of the brain of adolescents.

You live in a dream world if you think laws against drugs have any bearing whatsoever on their availability. Heroin, and coke have both been illegal for several decades yet I could leave work for half an hour and come back with and ounce of each.

The advantage of taking drugs... There really are none. Medicine are used because people need them to heal. It should never be the case that people need medicines to keep functioning.

You are CLEARLY uneducated on this subject. Millions of people use opiate pain killers to improve functionality and give them the ability to work, and live a normal life.

When it comes to the war on drugs :
Who is the number 1 supplier ?
And why ?
What are the political motives ?
Why is there no real solution ?

There's no "solutions" because keeping them illegal is a multibillion dollar a year industry that lines a LOT of pockets. The political motivations are to keep the status quo.

You should ask these questions yourself and do the research.
I will be curious to find out what you come up with.

I did the research long ago, maybe you should try it.

 

[xj0hnx]

Your documented history does not exist. And please do not bring up the American prohibition of 1920 as an example. It has no value. Because although cocaine and opium where legal once (pre WW2). It did nothing to improve the quality of life. If it did, it was for the following : The royal families of England and the Netherlands got very very rich of it(think 100 millions to billions during the 1900 and before). The common people just lived in misery. This wil not change when you legalize the heavy forms of drugs.

More lies.

 

[William Gaatjes]

You live in a dream world if you think laws against drugs have any bearing whatsoever on their availability. Heroin, and coke have both been illegal for several decades yet I could leave work for half an hour and come back with and ounce of each.

And ? I do not know where you live or how the quality of life is there or who you know.

You are CLEARLY uneducated on this subject. Millions of people use opiate pain killers to improve functionality and give them the ability to work, and live a normal life.

Yes. and that is where the flaw in your reasoning lies. These people need to because they have no choice. They did not start using because they wanted too. Because they live in serious pain. How difficult is it to see that...
For example, people with a psychological problem do not take lithium for fun. Because they have no other choice to live a normal life and what i was writing about since the beginning was normal people taking drugs. Some have some genetic fluke that might cause a mental disorder. Normal people start to experience psychological problems when using often. Prevention , ever heard of that word, do you know what it means ?

There's no "solutions" because keeping them illegal is a multibillion dollar a year industry that lines a LOT of pockets. The political motivations are to keep the status quo.
I did the research long ago, maybe you should try it.

And now you show your true face. You just want to make some money of other people while these people are on drugs. You , are a pathetic disgrace of a human being. :thumbsdown:

 

[xj0hnx]

And ? I do not know where you live or how the quality of life is there or who you know.


Yes. and that is where the flaw in your reasoning lies. These people need to because they have no choice. They did not start using because they wanted too. Because they live in serious pain. How difficult is it to see that...

It doesn't matter because it proves that people can indeed use drugs to better their lives. You need to get to the root cause of why people use drugs that do NOT need them for things like pain. Once you figure that out you will see that prison, and a life of persecution is not the cure for what ails them.

And now you show your true face. You just want to make some money of other people while these people are on drugs. You , are a pathetic disgrace of a human being. :thumbsdown:

You just want to continue to make money off of people suffering you are a disgrace to the human race, and a pathetic example of a human being :thumbsdown:

Two can play your stupid game.

 

[William Gaatjes]

No. You're a fucking dolt troll who doesn't even know the difference between psychological dependence and addiction. You may be smart but you are woefully uneducated on this subject directly and equally ill-informed on the history, psychology, sociology, and politics required to make a valid point about drug policy and its effects. You are as free as anyone to empty your sewer of a brain here, but it is as plain as day to many people that you simply buy into the views of those who have indoctrinated you in a very uninformed and fear-based way.

I keep replying to you because I find great humor every time you suggest anyone get an education. Perhaps someone will get an education however... in how to come across like an idiot.

Back to bong snorting this pile of coke.

You do not even have the guts to do so if it was true...

No, all i see is empty words of frustration. No arguments, no hard evidence.
No dialog. No reasoning why you have come to your conclusions and why i should be wrong. Nothing... Only the shallow emptiness of a skull where no amount of drugs have any effect because their resides no brain in it. Congratulations, you are a medical mystery.

 

[William Gaatjes]

You're just jealous that your mental issues are genetic and not drug induced.

I know i am eccentric. . People tell me daily and they love me for it too. Life is great ! ^_^

 

[xj0hnx]

No arguments, no hard evidence.
No dialog. No reasoning why you have come to your conclusions and why i should be wrong. Nothing...

You say that is if you have provided anything other than your fantasy of opinions ...you haven't.

 

[William Gaatjes]

More lies.

*laughs like the cenobite version of doctor Channard.
I have such sites to show you... ()

http://www.idfa.nl/industry/Festival/films/film.aspx?id=fd1e4d8d-b872-40ca-9802-3d9a7f035382

http://culiblog.org/2007/11/the-dutch-cocaine-factory-to-debut-at-the-idfa/

It’s not a food, it’s a crop, and until World War II, the Netherlands was the largest producer of quality cocaine in the world. Reserve your tickets now for Jeanette Groenendaal’s debut documentary, the Dutch Cocaine Factory. The film will enjoy celebrate its world premier next week at the IDFA (International Documentary Festival Amsterdam).

I even translated it for you :

http://translate.google.com/transla...fo.nl/coke-allerlei/geschiedenis/&sl=nl&tl=en

You might want to do a little research on the VOC. The VOC (verenigde oostindische company) and what they transported was called heulsap. This was no other then opium.

The dutch and the english had numerous battles during that time about who would have the opium monopoly on traffic and sale.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_East_India_Company

EDIT:
Now if you will excuse, i want to make some healthy food : rice with various vegetables, eggs, herbs and spices and 2 different versions meat. You can taste food for a reason, you know. To enjoy it while in essence it is just nutrients.

 

[xj0hnx]

*laughs like the cenobite version of doctor Channard.
I have such sites to show you... ()

http://www.idfa.nl/industry/Festival/films/film.aspx?id=fd1e4d8d-b872-40ca-9802-3d9a7f035382

http://culiblog.org/2007/11/the-dutch-cocaine-factory-to-debut-at-the-idfa/



I even translated it for you :

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&layout=1&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cocaineinfo.nl%2Fcoke-allerlei%2Fgeschiedenis%2F&sl=nl&tl=en

You might want to do a little research on the VOC. The VOC (verenigde oostindische company) and what they transported was called heulsap. This was no other then opium.

The dutch and the english had numerous battles during that time about who would have the opium monopoly on traffic and sale.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_East_India_Company

EDIT:
Now if you will excuse, i want to make some healthy food : rice with various vegetables, eggs, herbs and spices and 2 different versions meat. You can taste food for a reason, you know. To enjoy it while in essence it is just nutrients.

Um ...so what? Some how you think this is some kind of proof that decriminalization of harder drugs will lead to societies downfall? Can you start making some sense?

Since you like Wiki so much ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin-assisted_treatment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_the_Netherlands
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_liberalization

The fact is that everywhere that it is treated as a social problem instead of a criminal problem has reduced use, especially in the younger population.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Um ...so what? Some how you think this is some kind of proof that decriminalization of harder drugs will lead to societies downfall? Can you start making some sense?

Since you like Wiki so much ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin-assisted_treatment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_the_Netherlands
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_liberalization

The fact is that everywhere that it is treated as a social problem instead of a criminal problem has reduced use, especially in the younger population.

The drugs does work on you does it.
pfff....
First you respond with the claim i lie. As always i deliver information with my arguments. And yet you have something to complain about... Typical behaviour...


From your link :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin-assisted_treatment

Heroin assisted treatment, or diamorphine assisted treatment, refers to the prescribing of synthetic, injectable heroin to opiate addicts that do not benefit from or cannot tolerate treatment with one of the established drugs used in opiate replacement therapy like methadone or buprenorphine. For this group of patients, heroin assisted treatment has proven superior in improving their social and health situation.[

What do you know... Why do these people have to use heroin ? Because they are addicted to opiates. And how would that have happened...

From your link :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_policy_of_the_Netherlands

The drug policy of the Netherlands officially has four major objectives:
1 To prevent drug use and to treat and rehabilitate drug users.
2 To reduce harm to users.
3 To diminish public nuisance by drug users (the disturbance of public order and safety in the neighborhood).
4 To combat the production and trafficking of drugs

This would not have been necessary if people did not use drugs. We have to spend tax payers money to do all this while this money could have been used for better schools or research, anything.
Because you want to use, others have to pay for your comfort.
pfff...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drug_liberalization
Milton Friedman has always been an idiot.

 

[xj0hnx]

Hahaha just as I thought, you have nothing.

First you respond with the claim i lie. As always i deliver information with my arguments. And yet you have something to complain about... Typical behaviour...

What information? All you have provided is speculation, and opinion based on the same fear mongering that fuels today's draconian policy, and creates criminals out of non-violent users, and perpetuates a system that demonizes peoples problems instead of solving them.

What do you know... Why do these people have to use heroin ? Because they are addicted to opiates. And how would that have happened...

Once again, they are addicts under our current system. Obviously it isn't helping to reduce the number of drug addicts, or help those that are.

All you can do is fall back on fear mongering, completely ignoring the facts.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Hahaha just as I thought, you have nothing.

Keep convincing yourself. I advice you to go to a mirror. And look into it.
Say out loud "I can stop being an ignorant fool " 193 times. ()

 

[William Gaatjes]

Hahaha just as I thought, you have nothing.

Added some text ?

What information? All you have provided is speculation, and opinion based on the same fear mongering that fuels today's draconian policy, and creates criminals out of non-violent users, and perpetuates a system that demonizes peoples problems instead of solving them.

Every intelligent person can see the what will happen in the long run. Why can you not ?

Once again, they are addicts under our current system. Obviously it isn't helping to reduce the number of drug addicts, or help those that are.

The prevention in the Netherlands is to help the addicts that already exists to get them of the addiction ( is only going to work if they want to themselves) And to prevent getting more addicts. While it seems al you want are new buddies to play with. If i was religious and would have to describe a real evil satan, this would be it: Someone with no fun in life, does not care about others but feels alone in his hell. And thus tries to influence as much people as he can to join him in his misery. That he would no longer be alone. Instead of denying his curse to others, he only thinks of him self. Everything good about him is gone...

All you can do is fall back on fear mongering, completely ignoring the facts.

Actually i have the facts of life. I would love to be wrong. But i have spoken with addicts in real life. I knew people closely who where addicts. I have seen horrific documentaries about people who would kill themselves if they would not succeed that last time to try to stay of the drugs. But all they here is that little voice "Just one more, then i will stop forever".

 

[nakedfrog]

Every intelligent person can see the what will happen in the long run. Why can you not ?

Obviously YOU can't see what will happen, then.