Conflict between rich and poor strongest in 24 years

[the DRIZZLE]

Persons should pay at personal income tax rates.

You are being obtuse. The corporate form exists for real economic reasons that no one disputes. In fact there is a strong correlation between liberal incorporation laws and economic prosperity. You want a punitive full double tax structure that will be bad for everyone because you don't like a court ruling. Grow up.

 

[theeedude]

You are being obtuse. The corporate form exists for real economic reasons that no one disputes. In fact there is a strong correlation between liberal incorporation laws and economic prosperity. You want a punitive full double tax structure that will be bad for everyone because you don't like a court ruling. Grow up.

It's not double taxation, each person is only going to pay tax once.

 

[Londo_Jowo]

ok ok I'll give you that.

But you gotta admit Londo was offended. He started the whole thing.

I wasn't offended, I just wanted to point out your country owes a lot to the American service personnel that protect it.

 

[Matt1970]

The sooner the control of the United States is transferred from the hands of those that have built enterprises, invented stuff and generally know how to create wealth into the hands of those who can protest and ask for money, the better off is everyone.

This.

 

[SamurAchzar]

You are being obtuse. ... Grow up.

He's just trolling what could have been a rather interesting discussion. It seems like he can't understand what a corporation is and why is it formed, so he's crapping all over the thread.

 

[Matt1970]

So let me see where we are so far. Tax corporations higher, force them to pay higher wages, force them to have health coverage, force more regulations and wonder why they can't compete with cheap import crap. I like it.....

 

[etrigan420]

So let me see where we are so far. Tax corporations higher, force them to pay higher wages, force them to have health coverage, force more regulations and wonder why they can't compete with cheap import crap. I like it.....

Or, we could not tax corporations, have no labor laws, no health coverage, and no regulations, and *become* the third world. I like that even better.

 

[SamurAchzar]

Or, we could not tax corporations, have no labor laws, no health coverage, and no regulations, and *become* the third world. I like that even better.

The situation is given: over the next years there will be growing disparity and lower standard of living for many. It's no one's fault, that's just the way it is with manufacturing moving away and jobs offshored. It's bigger than USA itself, there are numerous ways to enhance efficiency today and these are utilized by companies both domestic and foreign. To stay in business, USA companies must be global and must be competitive.

This process will taper off when the standard of living goes low enough for USA to be an attractive employment target again.

On the other hand, many people in sought after jobs and investors will benefit from this process, as they have been benefiting up to now.

 

[dmcowen674]

We are getting closer to full revolution everyday

1-13-2012

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/nearly-one-third-middle-class-102300614.html

Nearly one-third of middle class suffer downward mobility

The middle class is defined as those between the 30th and 70th income percentile.

Nearly one third of Americans who were raised in the middle class dropped down the economic ladder as adults -- and that's before the Great Recession hit.

Long-term unemployment has devastated the ranks of the middle class, with many people losing their homes and forced to turn to food banks and government aid after they run through their savings

Young adults may find it particularly difficult to hold onto their parents' middle class status. That's because they are having a much harder time landing jobs, particularly well-paying positions in their field.

This could hurt their earning potential for decades to come, which has earned them the nickname "The Lost Generation."

 

[cybrsage]

If corporations are people like USSC is telling us, they should pay same tax rates on profits as individuals pay on income. US does not exempt individuals from paying taxes on foreign profits.

Corps are not people, they are US Persons.

 

[theeedude]

Corps are not people, they are US Persons.

Persons should pay personal income tax.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

We are getting closer to full revolution everyday

1-13-2012

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/nearly-one-third-middle-class-102300614.html

Nearly one-third of middle class suffer downward mobility

The middle class is defined as those between the 30th and 70th income percentile.

Nearly one third of Americans who were raised in the middle class dropped down the economic ladder as adults -- and that's before the Great Recession hit.

Long-term unemployment has devastated the ranks of the middle class, with many people losing their homes and forced to turn to food banks and government aid after they run through their savings

Young adults may find it particularly difficult to hold onto their parents' middle class status. That's because they are having a much harder time landing jobs, particularly well-paying positions in their field.

This could hurt their earning potential for decades to come, which has earned them the nickname "The Lost Generation."

Maybe they should have made better choices in life. Sure, some probably did and still got the shaft but I'd wager that most had/have a lifestyle that exceeds their income or or wasn't sufficient if times got rough. It's part of life - there are ups and downs - you have to be prepared to deal with both. But no, people like you dave just sit there and whine and look to more gov't to suck from.

 

[blankslate]

So let me see where we are so far. Tax corporations higher, force them to pay higher wages, force them to have health coverage, force more regulations and wonder why they can't compete with cheap import crap. I like it.....

That's not the problem. The problem is that we have given up on protecting our manufacturing industries. Clinton's worst decision ever. However, we shouldn't forget that he wasn't the sole agency in getting us into NAFTA. One can say that is was a truly bi-partisan failure.

 

[Jhhnn]

Maybe they should have made better choices in life. Sure, some probably did and still got the shaft but I'd wager that most had/have a lifestyle that exceeds their income or or wasn't sufficient if times got rough. It's part of life - there are ups and downs - you have to be prepared to deal with both. But no, people like you dave just sit there and whine and look to more gov't to suck from.

What you offer is the idea that choices aren't limited, and basically that nobody is subject to forces beyond their personal control, which is bullshit. It's not like 14M unemployed Americans weren't doing their jobs before they got laid off. It's not like people don't have to work for what they can get, either, regardless of qualifications, education & experience.

I'm sure that if we lived in the middle ages that you'd be telling the serfs to suck it up, because the Lords & masters were in their positions according to Divine Right.

 

[Jhhnn]

That's not the problem. The problem is that we have given up on protecting our manufacturing industries. Clinton's worst decision ever. However, we shouldn't forget that he wasn't the sole agency in getting us into NAFTA. One can say that is was a truly bi-partisan failure.

That's not really accurate. When we went for Reaganomics, we blew it. When it became obvious that federal revenues were inadequate, we should have raised taxes at the top. When it became obvious that offshoring & automation were driving millions down the economic scale & very few into financial orbit, we should have raised taxes at the top & spent it on more socialism- healthcare, childcare, foodstamps, education & anything else that serves the common welfare rather than just the welfare of a very few.

When we allowed the income share of the bottom 50% to suffer so that the share of the top 1% could double, we were stupid, and will be stupid so long as we allow it to continue.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

What you offer is the idea that choices aren't limited, and basically that nobody is subject to forces beyond their personal control, which is bullshit. It's not like 14M unemployed Americans weren't doing their jobs before they got laid off. It's not like people don't have to work for what they can get, either, regardless of qualifications, education & experience.

I'm sure that if we lived in the middle ages that you'd be telling the serfs to suck it up, because the Lords & masters were in their positions according to Divine Right.

Nowhere did I suggest that being laid off was because they didn't make the right choices but it's effects certainly can be mitigated with proper planning. Having an emergency fund instead of spending all your money on whatever you think you "need". But again, a person chooses to work for XYZ corp knowing that they could be laid off and if they didn't - well - they should have been more aware of reality.

 

[Jhhnn]

Nowhere did I suggest that being laid off was because they didn't make the right choices but it's effects certainly can be mitigated with proper planning. Having an emergency fund instead of spending all your money on whatever you think you "need". But again, a person chooses to work for XYZ corp knowing that they could be laid off and if they didn't - well - they should have been more aware of reality.

Yeh, everybody should plan on being jobless for a few years at a time, huh? And all those well educated people who lost their jobs when Bear Stearns & Lehman collapsed should have known better than to work for those guys, anyway. Should have figured that the roof could cave in at any second, despite the glad tidings & warm fuzzy pronouncements from the pundits & prognosticators of the Right.

And nobody should have listened to Dubya when he touted the Ownership Society from the Bully pulpit, either- they should have known better.

You seem to think that this lesser depression isn't that at all, that people should, yeh, just Get a Job! even when there aren't any... and that it's fine when others get thrown under the bus, just so long as it's not you... I mean, you got yours, and that's all that matters, right?

 

[blankslate]

That's not really accurate. When we went for Reaganomics, we blew it. When it became obvious that federal revenues were inadequate, we should have raised taxes at the top. When it became obvious that offshoring & automation were driving millions down the economic scale & very few into financial orbit, we should have raised taxes at the top & spent it on more socialism- healthcare, childcare, foodstamps, education & anything else that serves the common welfare rather than just the welfare of a very few.

When we allowed the income share of the bottom 50% to suffer so that the share of the top 1% could double, we were stupid, and will be stupid so long as we allow it to continue.

That's part of the picture... We shouldn't have entered into NAFTA either.

 

[dmcowen674]

Nowhere did I suggest that being laid off was because they didn't make the right choices but it's effects certainly can be mitigated with proper planning. Having an emergency fund instead of spending all your money on whatever you think you "need". But again, a person chooses to work for XYZ corp knowing that they could be laid off and if they didn't - well - they should have been more aware of reality.

and your post is written in black and white for all to see how out of touch with reality you are, that you have so much money that you have no clue and how much you hate Americans and the Country.

What are you doing here?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally Posted by dmcowen674
We are getting closer to full revolution everyday

1-13-2012

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/nearly...102300614.html

Nearly one-third of middle class suffer downward mobility

The middle class is defined as those between the 30th and 70th income percentile.

Nearly one third of Americans who were raised in the middle class dropped down the economic ladder as adults -- and that's before the Great Recession hit.

Long-term unemployment has devastated the ranks of the middle class, with many people losing their homes and forced to turn to food banks and government aid after they run through their savings

Young adults may find it particularly difficult to hold onto their parents' middle class status. That's because they are having a much harder time landing jobs, particularly well-paying positions in their field.

This could hurt their earning potential for decades to come, which has earned them the nickname "The Lost Generation."

Maybe they should have made better choices in life. Sure, some probably did and still got the shaft but I'd wager that most had/have a lifestyle that exceeds their income or or wasn't sufficient if times got rough. It's part of life - there are ups and downs - you have to be prepared to deal with both. But no, people like you dave just sit there and whine and look to more gov't to suck from.

Post after post you make in black and white for all to see cement in history how much you hate Americans and this Country.

Your Republican ideology has you so blinded from reality.

It is obvious you have never had to deal with anything real Americans have to deal with on a daily basis.

and to just spew shit like people "sit there and whine and look to more gov't to suck from" I don't even have the words to say.

With so much hate why in the hell are you here? It doesn't make any sense. What is your goal?

 

[Cerb]

The sooner the control of the United States is transferred into the hands of those that have built enterprises, invented stuff and generally know how to create wealth from the hands of those who can network well and ask for money, the better off is everyone.

FTFY. Now it reflects reality.

Unregulated banking worked so much better.

The bust that we are still in is due to reduction of good regulations, and intentionally poor enforcement of much of what was left.

Banks should be tightly confined in their behaviors. I will agree, however, that cheap borrowing has made things far worse, both in public and private arenas, and our regulations allow the foxes to run the henhouse, when it comes to that. It has allowed mountains of debt to pile up, backed by very little capital, with an assumption that the debt will become capital before TSHTF.

There is no number to tax, "the rich," that will fix our problems. We do, however, need taxation to be less burdensome on the working classes, including actual job creators, such as small business owners, and we need a way to increase tax revenue, because our government is so far up shit creek that only major increases in revenue, major decreases in spending, and government and private economic investments that will genuinely pay themselves off several times over, can even hope to get us out.

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Originally Posted by dmcowen674
We are getting closer to full revolution everyday

1-13-2012

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/nearly...102300614.html

Nearly one-third of middle class suffer downward mobility

The middle class is defined as those between the 30th and 70th income percentile.

Nearly one third of Americans who were raised in the middle class dropped down the economic ladder as adults -- and that's before the Great Recession hit.

Long-term unemployment has devastated the ranks of the middle class, with many people losing their homes and forced to turn to food banks and government aid after they run through their savings

Young adults may find it particularly difficult to hold onto their parents' middle class status. That's because they are having a much harder time landing jobs, particularly well-paying positions in their field.

This could hurt their earning potential for decades to come, which has earned them the nickname "The Lost Generation."




Post after post you make in black and white for all to see cement in history how much you hate Americans and this Country.

Your Republican ideology has you so blinded from reality.

It is obvious you have never had to deal with anything real Americans have to deal with on a daily basis.

and to just spew shit like people "sit there and whine and look to more gov't to suck from" I don't even have the words to say.

With so much hate why in the hell are you here? It doesn't make any sense. What is your goal?

Dave, I've posted many times about where I came from and how I made decisions that got me to where I'm at. I'm not rich or perfect but I try to live my life in a fashion that allows me to affect my direction - not allow others to decide for me. I was dirt poor for a few years before making a move that allowed me to take control of my destiny. Basically I grew up and took responsibility for myself and my family - no more excuses. Hopefully someday you'll have that moment so you can live a happier and more fulfilling life. Good luck. 🙂

 

[CADsortaGUY]

Yeh, everybody should plan on being jobless for a few years at a time, huh? And all those well educated people who lost their jobs when Bear Stearns & Lehman collapsed should have known better than to work for those guys, anyway. Should have figured that the roof could cave in at any second, despite the glad tidings & warm fuzzy pronouncements from the pundits & prognosticators of the Right.

And nobody should have listened to Dubya when he touted the Ownership Society from the Bully pulpit, either- they should have known better.

You seem to think that this lesser depression isn't that at all, that people should, yeh, just Get a Job! even when there aren't any... and that it's fine when others get thrown under the bus, just so long as it's not you... I mean, you got yours, and that's all that matters, right?

lol, you people are a hoot. Do you really not understand that people need to take responsibility for their own lives and own the actions and choices they've made? Yes, getting laid off or fired sucks. I've been there but instead of whining - I moved forward. Always having a plan B option or atleast not becoming so complacent would be a good start for most people... but that'd take effort .... so we can't go having that now... :roll;

 

[Jhhnn]

lol, you people are a hoot. Do you really not understand that people need to take responsibility for their own lives and own the actions and choices they've made? Yes, getting laid off or fired sucks. I've been there but instead of whining - I moved forward. Always having a plan B option or atleast not becoming so complacent would be a good start for most people... but that'd take effort .... so we can't go having that now... :roll;

Nice bit of apologism for the economic bust created by the collapse of the Ownership Society, along with the usual smugness.

Sometimes taking responsibility needs to move to a higher level, the level of politics & policy, simply because the system isn't structured in such a way that individual effort will carry people. It's what happened in 1932, and to a lesser extent today. 14M unemployed vs 4M job openings isn't a problem that can be solved by the individual- it's structural, beyond the control of those affected at an individual level.

Meanwhile, Corporate profits & cash reserves are at near record levels, and it's not like the true Bush constituency has been called upon to make any sacrifices of their own... They think they need a tax cut- ask any of the Repub presidential hopefuls, Paul Ryan or the right wing punditocracy. They think we need for all States to be Right to work for less, and that we need to cut, cut, cut! govt spending, force layoffs, to "create jobs", and that we need to make sacrifices, with "we" only applying to people at the bottom of the economic food chain. If we could just turn back the clock to a time before any of us were born, the Gilded Age, why, everything would be peachy, for them. Not to mention that they don't think we need financial reform- huh-uhh! Self Regulated banking has worked out fine for them, stripping value from everybody' else's pension funds & 401K plans... and creating millions of underwater mortgage debt slaves for at least another decade.

Since you worship the perps, when they tell you to denigrate & ridicule the victims, you do...

 

[blackangst1]

Which section of the constitution mentions corporations specificly? It's only through very loose interpetations of the constitution that they have rights.

None, of course. But how in the world could our government prevent a company from relocating? They could no more force a company to stay as they could no more force a person to stay.