Conan or Warhammer or WoW in 2008?

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gtsing

Member
Jul 28, 2007
151
0
0
i say wow not only because it has a head start with 9 million subscribers but there's rumors of a new expansion for wow being announced at blizzcon this week, burning crusade like totally owned sales when that released so yeah...wow.
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
I didn't qualify WoW PVP as it relates to any other game, simply stating how strong PVP is in that game. Given the number of subscribers of that series, that does put a large swing into the worldwide MMO players want to PVP argument.
 

tHa ShIzNiT

Platinum Member
Feb 15, 2000
2,321
8
81
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Originally posted by: tHa ShIzNiT
I agree with you on the imbalances. Seems like a few classes right now are way overpowered...rogues, warlocks, warriors, and druids. Now, they are quite inferior when they are not geared, but when they are geared they are unstoppable, all 4 of them. Granted, I have a 70 warrior and 70 warlock, but I dont even play them anymore because its just too easy. I have more fun playing my mage, but unfortunately he is squishy as hell and I just dont stand a remote chance against the 4 mentioned classes unless they have terrible gear or no clue how to play.

EDIT: I'm gonna go ahead and throw hunters into that list also. They are unbeatable with good gear, unless of course you are a geared out (x) where x = one of the 5 classes in question.

A Rogue can't beat a protection spec'd Paladin. Why don't you consider good shadow priests in this mix of indomitable characters? Even back when I used to play my shadow priest, my gear wasn't great (only the top tier PVP gear was decent enough), but he still beat the pants off most people. He's holy now, so I have no idea how good he is, but I haven't heard anyone say that shadow priests have become easier.

I'll agree with you there. A geared shadow priest is also impossible to kill. Maybe the most impossible. A poorly geared shadow priest though, is like mincemeat. At least at 70...back when 60 was the cap even a brand new 60 shadow priest pwnt faces because most people had roughly 4k life. I actually have a 66 priest too, very easy to level as shadow. She has been shelved for a while though.
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Originally posted by: tHa ShIzNiT
I'll agree with you there. A geared shadow priest is also impossible to kill. Maybe the most impossible. A poorly geared shadow priest though, is like mincemeat. At least at 70...back when 60 was the cap even a brand new 60 shadow priest pwnt faces because most people had roughly 4k life. I actually have a 66 priest too, very easy to level as shadow. She has been shelved for a while though.

I can't really talk much, because my rogue was beating the pants off shadow priests when I was in EotS last weekend :p. But I can say that; however, I have no idea how good they actually were as they could've been poor at the class. It's also good to note that the scenarios were typically 2v1 against me, but Blind > Shaman without Poison Cleansing Totem ;).
 

Fingolfin269

Lifer
Feb 28, 2003
17,948
34
91
Originally posted by: TheAdvocate
Originally posted by: Acanthus
There is no skill to the PvP in wow beyond knowing your class reasonably well.

There was however plenty of skill involved with other games i play, namely neverwinter nights, diablo, daoc, and shadowbane.

Just funny to read all you youngins talkin about "real PVP" when 99.99% of you never played the original NWN on AOL back in the mid to late 90's.

That's because I was busy pvp'n on muds in the mid-90s. :p
 

Dethfrumbelo

Golden Member
Nov 16, 2004
1,499
0
0
Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
Originally posted by: TheAdvocate
Originally posted by: Acanthus
There is no skill to the PvP in wow beyond knowing your class reasonably well.

There was however plenty of skill involved with other games i play, namely neverwinter nights, diablo, daoc, and shadowbane.

Just funny to read all you youngins talkin about "real PVP" when 99.99% of you never played the original NWN on AOL back in the mid to late 90's.

That's because I was busy pvp'n on muds in the mid-90s. :p

Giant troll massacres you for 344 damage.

(macro: choke giant troll, chop giant troll, e, drink healing potion, w)

server timeout... connection lost...

telnet xxx.xxx...

You have died.

You are a ghost.




 

Wheelock

Member
May 3, 2007
154
0
0
Originally posted by: Dethfrumbelo

Giant troll massacres you for 344 damage.

(macro: choke giant troll, chop giant troll, e, drink healing potion, w)

server timeout... connection lost...

telnet xxx.xxx...

You have died.

You are a ghost.

That made me laugh. Good job.

One thing I'd like to see return to an MMORPG is an elaborate player crafter/merchant system like what was found in the old SWG. That was surprisingly fulfilling, and yet my merchant still had room left over for passable combat skills.
 

Fingolfin269

Lifer
Feb 28, 2003
17,948
34
91
Originally posted by: Dethfrumbelo
Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
Originally posted by: TheAdvocate
Originally posted by: Acanthus
There is no skill to the PvP in wow beyond knowing your class reasonably well.

There was however plenty of skill involved with other games i play, namely neverwinter nights, diablo, daoc, and shadowbane.

Just funny to read all you youngins talkin about "real PVP" when 99.99% of you never played the original NWN on AOL back in the mid to late 90's.

That's because I was busy pvp'n on muds in the mid-90s. :p

Giant troll massacres you for 344 damage.

(macro: choke giant troll, chop giant troll, e, drink healing potion, w)

server timeout... connection lost...

telnet xxx.xxx...

You have died.

You are a ghost.

ROFL. Thanks for the laugh (and the memory). :)

 

ivan2

Diamond Member
Mar 6, 2000
5,772
0
0
www.heatware.com
Originally posted by: Wheelock
Originally posted by: Dethfrumbelo

Giant troll massacres you for 344 damage.

(macro: choke giant troll, chop giant troll, e, drink healing potion, w)

server timeout... connection lost...

telnet xxx.xxx...

You have died.

You are a ghost.

That made me laugh. Good job.

One thing I'd like to see return to an MMORPG is an elaborate player crafter/merchant system like what was found in the old SWG. That was surprisingly fulfilling, and yet my merchant still had room left over for passable combat skills.

That was the reason why I left the old SWG. Some crafting gets too ridiculously good and unbalanced the game, you have 90% kinetic dmg resist armor and 80% mind dmg resist helm. Normal person can solo multiple red con mobs and almost immue to mind damage while the wookiees (me including) will just die in 2 seconds.
 

Reckoner

Lifer
Jun 11, 2004
10,851
1
81
I still have a bad taste over Dark Age of Camelot, as do a lot of former players. Trials of Atlantis was a colossal failure in all aspects, and was the first step to an eventual demise of that game. I loved it beforehand. That said, I'll probably give Warhammer a chance. Mythic is the king of class imbalances though, they make Blizzard look like geniuses.
 

Wheelock

Member
May 3, 2007
154
0
0
Originally posted by: ivan2
Originally posted by: Wheelock

One thing I'd like to see return to an MMORPG is an elaborate player crafter/merchant system like what was found in the old SWG. That was surprisingly fulfilling, and yet my merchant still had room left over for passable combat skills.

That was the reason why I left the old SWG. Some crafting gets too ridiculously good and unbalanced the game, you have 90% kinetic dmg resist armor and 80% mind dmg resist helm. Normal person can solo multiple red con mobs and almost immue to mind damage while the wookiees (me including) will just die in 2 seconds.

That could've been fixed, though. I agree that it wasn't implemented very well (we're talking underfunded, mismanaged SWG here), but elaborate and viable player crafting was a good concept. Lack of rewarding loot was also a problem back in the old version... they needed good loot that didn't compete with, or that complemented, the crafters' products.
 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: effee
Warhmmer duh.

I don't see a WoW clone beating out WoW. I think WoW will still be the number 1 MMO in 2008.

WoW pretty much caters to everyone. Warhammer seems to be catering to PVPers. AoC caters to an adult audience, but as for PVP or PVE, not sure. I'd have to say that most MMORPG players are PVE players.

I don't think I'll ever understand the PVP aspect of an MMO. there's just no skill involved at all. If you want PVP, go play an FPS game.

So how does game mechanics for a game that came out 4 years before wow become a "wow clone"?
 

Skacer

Banned
Jun 4, 2007
727
0
0
Greatest gimmicks: AoC
Most potential: Warhammer
Realistic best of 2008: WoW

It is very easy to provide lots of hype based on what if scenarios and being the new shiny thing, but as every EQ clone learned years back, success is often hard to duplicate.
 

Beev

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2006
7,775
0
0
Wasn't Warhammer the game that sucked so bad in beta that they closed the beta and reverted it to alpha? Yeah, I have high hopes for that game :roll:

I mean, it's good that they were willing to admit that it wasn't on par with where it should be, but still...
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,712
427
126
tbqhwy.com
Originally posted by: Beev
Wasn't Warhammer the game that sucked so bad in beta that they closed the beta and reverted it to alpha? Yeah, I have high hopes for that game :roll:

I mean, it's good that they were willing to admit that it wasn't on par with where it should be, but still...

yep that was it
 

Aikouka

Lifer
Nov 27, 2001
30,383
912
126
Once Wrath of the Lich King comes out, WoW players will be happy for a couple months again :p.
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Originally posted by: Schadenfroh
EA restructures / relocates / downsizes Ultima Online and Mythic divisions
Electronic Arts CEO John Riccitiello has begun a cost-cutting and restructuring initiative, which includes layoffs within the EA Mythic team and both layoffs and relocations for the Ultima Online team.
Not good.....

I'm not sure UO is still making enough money to do much more than keep the servers on. As for the rest, EA has been involved in several MMO projects before; that most of them are no longer around/no longer an EA property so any new doom and gloom scenarios only have an effect if you've been ignorant to the past.
 

Anubis

No Lifer
Aug 31, 2001
78,712
427
126
tbqhwy.com
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Once Wrath of the Lich King comes out, WoW players will be happy for a couple months again :p.

and then a bunch will EMO out because its the same thing again as it was at 60 and 70,

if you dont expect it to be any different you will be fine, i have fun doing things at my own pace, questing is fun and i look forward to the new enviroments
 

pontifex

Lifer
Dec 5, 2000
43,804
46
91
Originally posted by: Acanthus
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: effee
Warhmmer duh.

I don't see a WoW clone beating out WoW. I think WoW will still be the number 1 MMO in 2008.

WoW pretty much caters to everyone. Warhammer seems to be catering to PVPers. AoC caters to an adult audience, but as for PVP or PVE, not sure. I'd have to say that most MMORPG players are PVE players.

I don't think I'll ever understand the PVP aspect of an MMO. there's just no skill involved at all. If you want PVP, go play an FPS game.

So how does game mechanics for a game that came out 4 years before wow become a "wow clone"?

i never said anything about game mechanics...although how was WAR released 4 years before WoW when its not even out yet? i assume you mean DAoC? So its a DAoC clone in a WoW skin clone?
 

lupi

Lifer
Apr 8, 2001
32,539
260
126
Originally posted by: Anubis
Originally posted by: Beev
Wasn't Warhammer the game that sucked so bad in beta that they closed the beta and reverted it to alpha? Yeah, I have high hopes for that game :roll:

I mean, it's good that they were willing to admit that it wasn't on par with where it should be, but still...

yep that was it

I recall that WC3 was scrapped twice; and given the time till TF2 came out,I wouldn't be surprised if that had at least one major redevelopment period. The list could go on, so making statements about what a game will be based on previous version of code doesn't hold much water.
 

Beev

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2006
7,775
0
0
Originally posted by: lupi
I recall that WC3 was scrapped twice; and given the time till TF2 came out,I wouldn't be surprised if that had at least one major redevelopment period. The list could go on, so making statements about what a game will be based on previous version of code doesn't hold much water.

Neither game made it all the way to beta before their revamps, possibly not even late alpha.
 

Engraver

Senior member
Jun 5, 2007
812
0
0
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: Acanthus
Originally posted by: pontifex
Originally posted by: effee
Warhmmer duh.

I don't see a WoW clone beating out WoW. I think WoW will still be the number 1 MMO in 2008.

WoW pretty much caters to everyone. Warhammer seems to be catering to PVPers. AoC caters to an adult audience, but as for PVP or PVE, not sure. I'd have to say that most MMORPG players are PVE players.

I don't think I'll ever understand the PVP aspect of an MMO. there's just no skill involved at all. If you want PVP, go play an FPS game.

So how does game mechanics for a game that came out 4 years before wow become a "wow clone"?

i never said anything about game mechanics...although how was WAR released 4 years before WoW when its not even out yet? i assume you mean DAoC? So its a DAoC clone in a WoW skin clone?


He was talking about the Warhammer table top game that had been out years before WoW was ever dreamed up. If you read up on it you'll see the how much WoW derived from it.

Chaos plaque -> Undead plague
Dark Elves exiled -> High Elves -> Blood Elves
Greenskins (Orcs & Goblins)
 

Beev

Diamond Member
Apr 20, 2006
7,775
0
0
Originally posted by: Engraver
He was talking about the Warhammer table top game that had been out years before WoW was ever dreamed up. If you read up on it you'll see the how much WoW derived from it.

Chaos plaque -> Undead plaque
Dark Elves exiled -> High Elves -> Blood Elves
Greenskins (Orcs & Goblins)

I believe orcs are from WAY before Warhammer. Blood elves aren't really exiled... The plague, sure, or should I say "plaque?" Join the fight to prevent undead tooth decay.