• We’re currently investigating an issue related to the forum theme and styling that is impacting page layout and visual formatting. The problem has been identified, and we are actively working on a resolution. There is no impact to user data or functionality, this is strictly a front-end display issue. We’ll post an update once the fix has been deployed. Thanks for your patience while we get this sorted.

News CNN REPORTS AL-BAGHDADI BELIEVED DEAD (Isis Leader)

Page 4 - Seeking answers? Join the AnandTech community: where nearly half-a-million members share solutions and discuss the latest tech.
Besides the obvious vulnerabilities in your system, the infection that is Trumpism and company(50% of GOP), I think you have a good thing going here! You have career public servants, patriots, coming out in droves against this current vector for your country.
If I was an American I'd be a little proud. Trump will pass. Build on the good stuff going forward.
 
I love how Trump says the reason he didn't tell the Democratic Senate leaders about the raid (but told the Republicans. And the Russians) because he was afraid of security leaks,

Then does this:

As part of the same White House event in which he suggested Democrats might not be trustworthy to be discrete with sensitive intelligence, Donald Trump shared all kinds of operational details that he could’ve easily kept to himself, including the precise number of commando helicopters used and the route they took to the raid.

Throughout the rest of the news conference, Trump eagerly divulged operational details that would normally be reserved for expert officials to share at their discretion. The move immediately drew criticism from national security analysts who said they were alarmed by the volume of information he shared regarding the location and specifics of the nighttime raid.

Over the course of his remarks, Trump revealed that Baghdadi had been “under surveillance for a couple of weeks”; the number of helicopters involved in the mission and their time of liftoff; how special forces teams managed to penetrate the compound where Baghdadi was found; how lab technicians administered a “genius” DNA test after he killed himself by detonating a suicide vest; and which “element of the attack [U.S. forces] were most afraid of.”

“Taken together, some of the details Trump revealed could help terrorist groups piece together new information about how U.S. counterterrorism forces gather intelligence and execute such dangerous missions, said veterans of previous operations.”
Click to expand...

www.politico.com

A quintessential Trumpian performance marks the death of the most-wanted terrorist

Even the most significant moments of his presidency can be overshadowed by an awkward governing style.
www.politico.com www.politico.com

Trump -
"Bin Laden was big but this was bigger"
Click to expand...

Lol..Meh..Whatever al-Baghdadi's importance, he was - and I am being very generous here - maybe one hundredth as notorious in the USA as Obama bin Laden. If on Friday you'd gone around asking random Americans "who is the leader of ISIS?" or "Who is Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi?" fewer than one in ten would have answered either question correctly. I doubt one person in a hundred could have named him if shown a photograph.

Even the poorly informed are not caring as much as Agent Orange thinks they are...

Anyway..Congrats to all that where involved in the planing and execution of the raid.
 
VRAMdemon said:
I love how Trump says the reason he didn't tell the Democratic Senate leaders about the raid (but told the Republicans. And the Russians) because he was afraid of security leaks,

Then does this:
Click to expand...
It honestly won't surprise me if we find out later that in this instance (as well as others) Trump was fed false information assuming he'd probably leak it. Mission information like number of assets and direction of approach are pure gold to foreign intelligence, and make the crafting of a really ugly diplomatic display pretty easy to fabricate. With appropriate info, Russian intel probably could have gotten something shot down one way or another, generating another major embarrassment for the west as well as maintain chaos in the ME for a while longer.
 
VRAMdemon said:
Lol..Meh..Whatever al-Baghdadi's importance, he was - and I am being very generous here - maybe one hundredth as notorious in the USA as Obama bin Laden. If on Friday you'd gone around asking random Americans "who is the leader of ISIS?" or "Who is Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi?" fewer than one in ten would have answered either question correctly. I doubt one person in a hundred could have named him if shown a photograph.
Click to expand...
Baghdadi was basically a figurehead. His successor (Qardash) imo is more significant as he is involved in the planning, day to day running of whats left of ISIS. From a practical standpoint, targetting him should have been a higher priority. But he is unknown in the media and would not gotten as much attention as taking out Baghdadi.
 
In what universe did any of us think that we'd live to see a time when Vladimir Putin would be briefed on a planned secret raid before the members of the House intel committee and the Speaker. It is the perfect example of how the executive branch is essentially saying that it intends to overpower the legislative, and if it can do that, particularly with the one mechanism of federal power that relies upon direct democratic influence, well then there you have it. American Democracy: 1776 - 2019.
 
amenx said:
Baghdadi was basically a figurehead. His successor (Qardash) imo is more significant as he is involved in the planning, day to day running of whats left of ISIS. From a practical standpoint, targetting him should have been a higher priority. But he is unknown in the media and would not gotten as much attention as taking out Baghdadi.
Click to expand...
The psychological blow to Isis members and potential recruits is more important than his operational role. Qardash is on the target list and the CIA are pursuing him (As well as others from Isis leadership positions). Hopefully, forensics turns up actionable intel from the raid.
 
Ajay said:
The psychological blow to Isis members and potential recruits is more important than his operational role. Qardash is on the target list and the CIA are pursuing him (As well as others from Isis leadership positions). Hopefully, forensics turns up actionable intel from the raid.
Click to expand...
Sure, initially, but they have already begun conditioning their members and followers that their struggle is beyond one man, that Baghdadi achieved his divine purpose of martyrdom and which is incumbent upon all of them. They will get over Baghdadi quick enough imo. Pretty sure they are trying hard to plan and carry out a retaliatory atack of some sort to send a message they are still alive and kicking and still relevant.
 
To add more irony. Trump claims he was worried about Nancy leaking when Trump leaked secret intel to the Russians in the Oval Office.

I guess if we planned actions against Russia for election interference Trump would notify Putin before the Speaker of the House.
 
Hayabusa Rider said:
Pics of Trump taking him out?

We know that Trump didn't, nor did Obama with Bin Laden. Instead it was professionals trained to do this. That the politicians got out of the way is the best that can be said for them.
Click to expand...
Trump's Syria Troop Withdrawal Complicated Plans for al-Baghdadi Raid
news.yahoo.com

Trump's Syria Troop Withdrawal Complicated Plans for al-Baghdadi Raid

WASHINGTON -- President Donald Trump knew the Central Intelligence Agency and Special Operations commandos were zeroing in on the location for Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, the Islamic State leader, when he ordered U.S. troops to withdraw from northern Syria earlier this month, intelligence, military...
news.yahoo.com news.yahoo.com

Ha ha ha ha. cheeto, the eternal fuck up.
The military was successful in spite of the orange pus bag. Not because of anything he did.

"But Trump’s abrupt withdrawal order three weeks ago disrupted the meticulous planning underway and forced Pentagon
officials to speed up the plan for the risky night raid before their ability to control troops, spies and reconnaissance aircraft
disappeared with the pullout, officials said.

Al-Baghdadi’s death in the raid Saturday, they said, occurred largely despite, and not because of, Trump’s actions."
 
Hayabusa Rider said:
Pics of Trump taking him out?

We know that Trump didn't, nor did Obama with Bin Laden. Instead it was professionals trained to do this. That the politicians got out of the way is the best that can be said for them.
Click to expand...


Absolutely. I see a lot of contrast with the raid in Pakistan though. Obama was very involved, and had been advised not to do the raid IIRC. He believed the intel that stood out and went with his gut feeling. Then after giving the order, he handled it all like a boss, putting on a poker face and well, not notifying the Russians for starters. Also absent; a childish, kinda pompous, slightly disturbing embellishment of the raid events. In the case of OBL in Abbottabad I think we were lucky that a politician who was an actual leader didn't step out of the way until his part was done.

Trump almost scuttled the raid with his sudden birthday present for Putin. Hardly the involved, smooth operator Obama was, but I'm glad he allowed people to do their jobs in this case. I'm sure he'll be infuriated when he doesn't see the substantial bump in public approval he needs.
 
Gradually I think it will start to dawn on some of the trumpets that this isn't 'Obama taking out OBL.' It's republicans crying wag the dog at Clinton when he sent Tomahawks at AQ.

*sad trombone here*
 
VRAMdemon said:
I love how Trump says the reason he didn't tell the Democratic Senate leaders about the raid (but told the Republicans. And the Russians) because he was afraid of security leaks,

Then does this:



www.politico.com

A quintessential Trumpian performance marks the death of the most-wanted terrorist

Even the most significant moments of his presidency can be overshadowed by an awkward governing style.
www.politico.com www.politico.com

Trump -

Lol..Meh..Whatever al-Baghdadi's importance, he was - and I am being very generous here - maybe one hundredth as notorious in the USA as Obama bin Laden. If on Friday you'd gone around asking random Americans "who is the leader of ISIS?" or "Who is Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi?" fewer than one in ten would have answered either question correctly. I doubt one person in a hundred could have named him if shown a photograph.

Even the poorly informed are not caring as much as Agent Orange thinks they are...

Anyway..Congrats to all that where involved in the planing and execution of the raid.
Click to expand...

Bagdahdi was important to ISIS, certainly more than the figurehead another poster described him as. However, I agree his public profile in the US is nowhere near what OBL was. Which is why Trump will not get the political lift he's hoping for out of this.

Within two days, we'll be back to the daily bump and grind over impeachment.
 
woolfe9998 said:
Bagdahdi was important to ISIS, certainly more than the figurehead another poster described him as. However, I agree his public profile in the US is nowhere near what OBL was. Which is why Trump will not get the political lift he's hoping for out of this.
Click to expand...
The leadership of ISIS with Baghdadi as their head or Caliph is far from what it was in 2014 (the year he began to control vast stretches of territory from Iraq to Syria), to 2018-9 when he was forced to be on the run with only a few bodyguards to protect him. THAT changed the effectiveness of his leadership which led him to rely on other top trusted figures as Qardash to inherit his role. By 2019 and on the run, he was basically reduced to a figurehead from a practical standpoint, as others, namely Qardash were effectively running ISIS (with Baghdadis blessing).

I think it may help for people NOT to presume the structure of leadership of ISIS is similar to that of any other militant organization, but is driven by an ideology that cannot be dependent on the well being of any one man or leader. It is structured to include such eventualities as the death of its leaders and to pass on the torch to others when the need arises. Baghdadi was not held to the same kind of reverence as Kim Jong Un or Stalin, as that goes against their ideology that no man is greater than their cause.
 
amenx said:
The leadership of ISIS with Baghdadi as their head or Caliph is far from what it was in 2014 (the year he began to control vast stretches of territory from Iraq to Syria), to 2018-9 when he was forced to be on the run with only a few bodyguards to protect him. THAT changed the effectiveness of his leadership which led him to rely on other top trusted figures as Qardash to inherit his role. By 2019 and on the run, he was basically reduced to a figurehead from a practical standpoint, as others, namely Qardash were effectively running ISIS (with Baghdadis blessing).

I think it may help for people NOT to presume the structure of leadership of ISIS is similar to that of any other militant organization, but is driven by an ideology that cannot be dependent on the well being of any one man or leader. It is structured to include such eventualities as the death of its leaders and to pass on the torch to others when the need arises. Baghdadi was not held to the same kind of reverence as Kim Jong Un or Stalin, as that goes against their ideology that no man is greater than their cause.
Click to expand...

Didn't say ISIS would die without him. I rejected your use of the term "figurehead" to describe him.
 
amenx said:
Always easy to argue with a yes or no or reject or dismiss with zero elaboration. 🙄
Click to expand...

Or to elaborate in a way which is nothing more than tearing down a straw man. I'm not sure what part of me disagreeing with your description of him as figurehead warranted you refuting a phantom argument that ISIS would suddenly go poof and vanish because the man was killed.

What I will say, if you want further elaboration, is that while he was always in hiding (not just near the end), strictly speaking, we don't know how much operational control he had, but he seems to have had more contact with followers and lieutenants than did OBL in his final years. Yet OBL retained some operational control of AQ though it undoubtedly had limits due to his isolation and extreme security precautions. And also, AQ didn't go poof either when OBL was killed, nor should anyone have expected it would.
 
woolfe9998 said:
Or to elaborate in a way which is nothing more than tearing down a straw man. I'm not sure what part of me disagreeing with your description of him as figurehead warranted you refuting a phantom argument that ISIS would suddenly go poof and vanish because the man was killed.

What I will say, if you want further elaboration, is that while he was always in hiding (not just near the end), strictly speaking, we don't know how much operational control he had, but he seems to have had more contact with followers and lieutenants than did OBL in his final years. Yet OBL retained some operational control of AQ though it undoubtedly had limits due to his isolation and extreme security precautions. And also, AQ didn't go poof either when OBL was killed, nor should anyone have expected it would.
Click to expand...
ISIS "suddenly going poof" without him was not the main point I was trying to rebuff, only providing context that I thought you may have needed given your brief, sparsely worded rejections. Baghdadis practical leadership in his final months was by necessity diminished with him being on the run. He could not travel with large retinues of people or communicate effectively without risk being discovered or turned in. From a practical standpoint THAT basically made him a figurehead. This of course, not to touch upon the splits within ISIS which further weakened the group and of course his leadership. 2014 for ISIS and their leaders was a far cry from 2019, even before his death. You can reject all you want if it makes you feel 'right' and unrebuttable.
 
hal2kilo said:
Oh, he is one sick fuck. He spent way too much time describing the violence, and how much of a coward Bagdadi was.
Click to expand...
You feeling sorry for the austere religious scholar that died? I'm sure you wished Bagdadi got the mental health care he needed so it could have prevented another suicide.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

TRENDING THREADS

Back
Top