Chicago resident kills man with illegal handgun

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TwinsenTacquito

Senior member
Apr 1, 2010
821
0
0
IMHO, Chicago maybe has a right to ban the carrying of firearms outside of the my house is my castle domain, but not within anyone's castle.

No. It's pretty fucking clear that they don't and that it isn't up to anyone's opinion.

http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html


I believe they only support it in organized militias, but I'm not sure, the legalese is torturing my brain.

For the topic, good for the old guy.

ACLU is anti-gun, as they are rabidly pro-government and anti-freedom.
 

MJinZ

Diamond Member
Nov 4, 2009
8,192
0
0
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/05/26/year-old-chicago-man-kills-armed-home-invader/?test=latestnews



Grandpas defending themselves and their homes have become a real problem in this country. What more can we do to get this gun problem under control and make the world safe for home invaders again?

I would have to disagree with outlawing handguns, but you seemed to have missed that little point as well.

I'm sure Chicago has no problem with Shotguns and other less-concealable self defense weapons.
 

NoStateofMind

Diamond Member
Oct 14, 2005
9,711
6
76
i bet a nickel this actually happens... after he is prosecuted criminally... wait until the 'but the perp was a swell guy down on his luck' relatives come out...

Think that possible? How about this one:

Owning a firearm is legal, however, discharging one is not.
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,153
6
81
I would have to disagree with outlawing handguns, but you seemed to have missed that little point as well.

I'm sure Chicago has no problem with Shotguns and other less-concealable self defense weapons.

Chicago also has an AWB. So yes, they DO have a problem with less-concealable weapons
 

Zargon

Lifer
Nov 3, 2009
12,218
2
76
they do some good things


but they waste too much time overcompensating for perceived past racial wrongs imo.



why wouldnt I want to conceal a weapon on myself in my home if I saw fit? why should I have to own a shotgun instead of a handgun?

they are cumbersome in the confines of a house, especially since they are limited to 18" of lenght or more.
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,153
6
81
Fact: Switzerland has relatively lenient gun control for Europe35, and has the third lowest
homicide rate of the top nine major European countries, and the same per capita
rate as England and Wales.36

Fact: Brazil has mandatory licensing, registration, and maximum personal ownership quotas. It now bans any new sales to private citizens. Their homicide rate is almost three (3) times higher than the U.S.39

Fact: In 2003, Canada had a violent crime rate more than double that of
the U.S. (963 vs. 475 per 100,000).

Fact: Many of the countries with the strictest gun control have the highest rates of violent crime. Australia and England, which have virtually banned gun ownership, have the highest rates of robbery, sexual assault, and assault with force of the top 17 industrialized countries.42

Fact: The crime rate is 66% higher in four Canadian Prairie Provinces than in the
northern US states across the border.43

Fact: Strict controls over existing arms failed in Finland. Despite needs-based licensing,
storage laws, transportation restrictions,44 Finland experienced a multiple killing school
shooting in 2007.45

Myth: Britain has strict gun control and a low crime rate

Fact: Since gun banning has escalated in the UK, the rate of crime – especially violent
crime – has risen.

Fact: Ironically, firearm use in crimes has doubled in the decade since handguns were
banned.46

Fact: Street robberies soared 28% in 2001. Violent crime was up 11%, murders up 4%,
and rapes are up 14%.48

Fact: Handgun homicides in England and Wales reached an all-time high in 2000, years
after a virtual ban on private handgun ownership. More than 3,000 crimes involving
handguns were recorded in 1999-2000, including the 42 homicides, 310 cases of
attempted murder, 2,561 robberies and 204 burglaries.54

Fact: Handguns were used in 3,685 offenses in 2000 compared with 2,648 in 1997, an
increase of 40%.55

Fact: Between 1997 and 1999, there were 429 murders in London, the highest two-year
figure for more than 10 years – nearly two-thirds of those involved firearms – in a
country that has virtually banned private firearm ownership.56

Fact: Over the last century, the British crime rate was largely unchanged. In the late
nineteenth century, the per capita homicide rate in Britain was between 1.0 and 1.5 per
100,000.57 In the late twentieth century, after a near ban on gun ownership, the homicide rate is around 1.4.58 This shows that the homicide rate does not vary with either the level of gun control or gun availability.

Myth: Gun control in Australia is curbing crime

Fact: Crime has been rising since a sweeping ban on private gun ownership. In the first
two years after gun-owners were forced to surrender 640,381 personal firearms,
government statistics show a dramatic increase in criminal activity.61 In 2001-2002,
homicides were up another 20%.62

From the inception of firearm confiscation to March 27, 2000, the numbers are:
• Gun murders up 19%
• Armed robbery up 69%
• Home invasions up 21%
The sad part is that in the 15 years before national gun confiscation:
• Firearm-related homicides dropped nearly 66%
• Firearm-related deaths fell 50%

Fact: Gun crimes are rising throughout Australia after guns were banned. In Sydney
alone, robbery rates with guns rose 160% in 2001, more in the previous year.63

Fact: A ten year study that concluded Australian firearm confiscation had no effect on
crime rates.64 A separate study concluded Australia’s 1996 gun control laws “found [no]
evidence for an impact of the laws on the pre-existing decline in firearm homicides.”65

Myth: Japan has strict gun control and a less violent society

Fact: In Japan, the murder rate is almost 1 per 100,000. In the U.S., there are about 3.2 murders per 100,000 people each year by weapons other than firearms.66 This means that even if firearms in the U.S. could be eliminated, we would still have three times the murder rate of the Japanese. Japan’s murder rate may be low, but its suicide rate is over 20 per 100,000 people. Japanese are being murdered and committing suicide at a rate of about 21 per 100,000. In the U.S., our combined murder and suicide rate is about 21 also.

http://www.gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-facts/5.1/gun-facts-5.1-screen.pdf

I can go on an on, but I hope you anti-gun nuts get the point. I'm sure you wont though. Ignorance FTL
 

kitchiku

Senior member
Nov 6, 2009
277
1
81
What about the crime rates in States/Countries that have no strict gun controls like say Texas, any data?
 

MJinZ

Diamond Member
Nov 4, 2009
8,192
0
0
Fact: Switzerland has relatively lenient gun control for Europe35, and has the third lowest
homicide rate of the top nine major European countries, and the same per capita
rate as England and Wales.36

Fact: Brazil has mandatory licensing, registration, and maximum personal ownership quotas. It now bans any new sales to private citizens. Their homicide rate is almost three (3) times higher than the U.S.39

Fact: In 2003, Canada had a violent crime rate more than double that of
the U.S. (963 vs. 475 per 100,000).

Fact: Many of the countries with the strictest gun control have the highest rates of violent crime. Australia and England, which have virtually banned gun ownership, have the highest rates of robbery, sexual assault, and assault with force of the top 17 industrialized countries.42

Fact: The crime rate is 66% higher in four Canadian Prairie Provinces than in the
northern US states across the border.43

Fact: Strict controls over existing arms failed in Finland. Despite needs-based licensing,
storage laws, transportation restrictions,44 Finland experienced a multiple killing school
shooting in 2007.45

Myth: Britain has strict gun control and a low crime rate

Fact: Since gun banning has escalated in the UK, the rate of crime – especially violent
crime – has risen.

Fact: Ironically, firearm use in crimes has doubled in the decade since handguns were
banned.46

Fact: Street robberies soared 28% in 2001. Violent crime was up 11%, murders up 4%,
and rapes are up 14%.48

Fact: Handgun homicides in England and Wales reached an all-time high in 2000, years
after a virtual ban on private handgun ownership. More than 3,000 crimes involving
handguns were recorded in 1999-2000, including the 42 homicides, 310 cases of
attempted murder, 2,561 robberies and 204 burglaries.54

Fact: Handguns were used in 3,685 offenses in 2000 compared with 2,648 in 1997, an
increase of 40%.55

Fact: Between 1997 and 1999, there were 429 murders in London, the highest two-year
figure for more than 10 years – nearly two-thirds of those involved firearms – in a
country that has virtually banned private firearm ownership.56

Fact: Over the last century, the British crime rate was largely unchanged. In the late
nineteenth century, the per capita homicide rate in Britain was between 1.0 and 1.5 per
100,000.57 In the late twentieth century, after a near ban on gun ownership, the homicide rate is around 1.4.58 This shows that the homicide rate does not vary with either the level of gun control or gun availability.

Myth: Gun control in Australia is curbing crime

Fact: Crime has been rising since a sweeping ban on private gun ownership. In the first
two years after gun-owners were forced to surrender 640,381 personal firearms,
government statistics show a dramatic increase in criminal activity.61 In 2001-2002,
homicides were up another 20%.62

From the inception of firearm confiscation to March 27, 2000, the numbers are:
• Gun murders up 19%
• Armed robbery up 69%
• Home invasions up 21%
The sad part is that in the 15 years before national gun confiscation:
• Firearm-related homicides dropped nearly 66%
• Firearm-related deaths fell 50%

Fact: Gun crimes are rising throughout Australia after guns were banned. In Sydney
alone, robbery rates with guns rose 160% in 2001, more in the previous year.63

Fact: A ten year study that concluded Australian firearm confiscation had no effect on
crime rates.64 A separate study concluded Australia’s 1996 gun control laws “found [no]
evidence for an impact of the laws on the pre-existing decline in firearm homicides.”65

Myth: Japan has strict gun control and a less violent society

Fact: In Japan, the murder rate is almost 1 per 100,000. In the U.S., there are about 3.2 murders per 100,000 people each year by weapons other than firearms.66 This means that even if firearms in the U.S. could be eliminated, we would still have three times the murder rate of the Japanese. Japan’s murder rate may be low, but its suicide rate is over 20 per 100,000 people. Japanese are being murdered and committing suicide at a rate of about 21 per 100,000. In the U.S., our combined murder and suicide rate is about 21 also.

http://www.gunfacts.info/pdfs/gun-facts/5.1/gun-facts-5.1-screen.pdf

I can go on an on, but I hope you anti-gun nuts get the point. I'm sure you wont though. Ignorance FTL

I support guns, and I'm going to be getting a license to carry shortly, but many of those "facts" you put up could easily have little to no correlation or relevance to gun control. Socioeconomic success (first world country vs third world) and societal norms are far more likely (MIT here in Mass = massive suicide rate, not so in most colleges).
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,153
6
81
I support guns, and I'm going to be getting a license to carry shortly, but many of those "facts" you put up could easily have little to no correlation or relevance to gun control. Socioeconomic success (first world country vs third world) and societal norms are far more likely (MIT here in Mass = massive suicide rate, not so in most colleges).


What kind of facts would you like to see? Why do you put parentheses around facts? Are you doubting their validity? Look at the sources from them, they are almost all government agencies crime data.


I can debunk pretty much any anti-gun myth out there.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
I am all for gun control, see sig.
Hey if mindless drones like Whitey07 have guns I want to be able to own one myself so I can defend myself. Besides whats more fun than drinking a twelver and go out blasting?:twisted:

I'm all for owning guns, especially for shooting Klans..err..cans
 

thepd7

Diamond Member
Jan 2, 2005
9,423
0
0
Good for him! Where does the ACLU stand on the gun issue?

I've never seen them involved in anything related to guns at all.


i bet a nickel this actually happens... after he is prosecuted criminally... wait until the 'but the perp was a swell guy down on his luck' relatives come out...

Absolutely. If criminals or criminals families can prosecute for negligence they can certainly prosecute for breaking the law by shooting a gun.


The U.S. should be the safest place in the world then, with all of the guns in private hands.

How's England's crime rate? It should be 0 since they don't allow handguns, right?
 

frostedflakes

Diamond Member
Mar 1, 2005
7,925
1
81
What, he couldn't have used a legal shotgun to shoot the guy? The reason they are trying to ban handguns is they are easily concealable by criminals and are used in most murders.
80 year old man using a shotgun. I could see that working out well. :awe:

Then again he was able to handle a pistol. Still, even a 20 gauge is a lot more unwieldy than your average handgun.
 

cubeless

Diamond Member
Sep 17, 2001
4,295
1
81
Hey if mindless drones like Whitey07 have guns I want to be able to own one myself so I can defend myself. Besides whats more fun than drinking a twelver and go out blasting?:twisted:

I'm all for owning guns, especially for shooting Klans..err..cans

see how what you really think comes out when you get excited... using slang codewords for your violent, racist inclinations... your desire to shoot 'cans' (well known racist code for mexicans, africans, and puerto ricans) exposes the true you...
 

daishi5

Golden Member
Feb 17, 2005
1,196
0
76
from your source-

"We do not, however, take a position on gun control itself. In our view, neither the possession of guns nor the regulation of guns raises a civil liberties issue."

Read it again, they do not think you have a right to own a gun, and that it is perfectly ok for the government to take away every individual's guns.
 

nick1985

Lifer
Dec 29, 2002
27,153
6
81
from your source-

"We do not, however, take a position on gun control itself. In our view, neither the possession of guns nor the regulation of guns raises a civil liberties issue."

Did you even read that? They dont see the 2nd amendment as a civil liberties issue.


Some of our left wing posters make good argument and good points from time to time, but Tom you are always fail.
 

CPA

Elite Member
Nov 19, 2001
30,322
4
0
The old man should be sued. Clearly too old to own a gun and needs to learn restraint when someone breaks into his home.

And next time needs to aim for the legs....oh, wait that would be the case if he lived in NYC.
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
see how what you really think comes out when you get excited... using slang codewords for your violent, racist inclinations... your desire to shoot 'cans' (well known racist code for mexicans, africans, and puerto ricans) exposes the true you...
The only thing my post exposes me as is sarcastic():)
 

MotF Bane

No Lifer
Dec 22, 2006
60,801
10
0
from your source-

"We do not, however, take a position on gun control itself. In our view, neither the possession of guns nor the regulation of guns raises a civil liberties issue."

But they already have taken a position, right there.