Carson: Islam not consistent with Constitution; no Muslim should ever be President

[Moonbeam]

You don't seem to ever post anything sensible, so how could you debate with people?

There are many non-religious morons. What is that supposed to mean? There are also many non-redheaded morons.

Nobody ever said that being non-religious made you non-moronic, moron.

Try to indicate whom you are addressing in your posts. Your 'There are also many non-religious morons.' comment has nothing to do with what I said so it's hard to tell what you are arguing against.

 

[Moonbeam]

It is impossible for you to truly reject anything. It is all just electro-chemical reactions in your brain, you are biological machine running an adaptive program. Beliefs are nothing more than specific atomic patterns in your cranium. Free will is a useful illusion created by the brain. How can you blame another human for simply running the software nature supplied them?

Lol.... not sure of any of that steaming pile resonated with you but it certainly amused me....

Apparently it doesn't take much to amuse you.

 

[bshole]

Apparently it doesn't take much to amuse you.

Yes it only takes a small number of molecules to move in my melon to make me smile. Apparently much more molecular movement is required to amuse you. That strikes me as somewhat sad. Nature has given you the dirty end of the stick.

 

[Moonbeam]

Yes it only takes a small number of molecules to move in my melon to make me smile. Apparently much more molecular movement is required to amuse you. That strikes me as somewhat sad. Nature has given you the dirty end of the stick.

Apparently it doesn't take much to make you sad.

 

[unknown42]

Ben Carson is wrong because tbere is already a muslim in the White House.

 

[BxgJ]

Ben Carson is wrong because tbere is already a muslim in the White House.

You forgot the /s, or ...... nm.

 

[realibrad]

I'm an insufferable snob, granted.

Begging the question is not the same as raising the question.

We can have some fun with this.

Begging the question is a logical fallacy that many people use.

First is my presupposition that if a believe can put aside their beliefs they can make good policy.
Now, implicit in my question is that religion and good policy do not mix. I posed a rhetorical which actually makes a statement. It thus completes the circular logic.

So, while begging the question is a logical fallacy, I in fact used it correctly.

:awe:

 

[realibrad]

Yes they do. For example I learned from religion that I don't know anything. This lead me to reject everything I ever believed. It caused a very painful death to everything in life that gave me emotional support and the illusion of any self importance. I found out that Christ carrying his cross to whips and ridicule would be the life of any who can see that all of ones hatred and scorn for the world is useless and empty, that there is only the nailing down, the bleeding and the farewell of forgiveness and of course, what comes next.

You believe that beliefs lead to actions because you're a believer.

You learned that you cannot learn anything, thus you did not learn that you could not learn?

If you know nothing, how do you know Christ was real?

Seems to me that to know Christ, you must first accept that Christ can give you knowledge of his existence.

 

[justoh]

Religious people are intellectually defective. It doesn't matter if they can "set aside their beliefs in policy making." Even if true (which in most cases it isn't), the real problem is that they cannot think critically.

 

[realibrad]

Religious people are intellectually defective. It doesn't matter if they can "set aside their beliefs in policy making." Even if true (which in most cases it isn't), the real problem is that they cannot think critically.

I don't know about that. There are many religious scientist that do very high level work that takes critical thinking. I think what is happening is that they are compartmentalizing their beliefs from reality. Cognitive dissonance mixed with ignorance allows them to believe that God is real and the Bible is true, and still able to function as a scientist. There is bound to be some overlap, but there are people who seem to be able to compartmentalize their religious beliefs from other areas.

I would not say those people do it 100% of the time though. It does seem that those in the US are more willing accept religious beliefs as justification for actions which is very scary. We are very far from society accepting "God told me to kill that evil person", but we sure do seem to be heading in that direction.

 

[justoh]

Most work we call scientific is simply following instructions to confirm results, not requiring much critical thinking at all. Mechanical.

 

[realibrad]

Most work we call scientific is simply following instructions to confirm results, not requiring much critical thinking at all. Mechanical.

Yes, but not all. Point is some can and do split belief from reality. I wish they would live in reality, but it wont happen for a long time. Faith makes people feel better at the expense of reality.

 

[ivwshane]

Yes, but not all. Point is some can and do split belief from reality. I wish they would live in reality, but it wont happen for a long time. Faith makes people feel better at the expense of reality.

We'll that makes you an idiot according to him so...

 

[Moonbeam]

Yes, but not all. Point is some can and do split belief from reality. I wish they would live in reality, but it wont happen for a long time. Faith makes people feel better at the expense of reality.

You are this person of faith who does not know reality because everything you just said is something you believe and which I can't. Faith doesn't split people from reality, faith creates humility and surrender. That's a place where you don't know anything except that what others say is real is a faith. To know the truth is to be empty of belief, but full of knowledge. You don't know the difference, and the other idiot, justoh is even more around the bend.

 

[Moonbeam]

realibrad: You learned that you cannot learn anything, thus you did not learn that you could not learn?

M: I learned there is nothing to learn and everything to unlearn.

r: If you know nothing, how do you know Christ was real?

M: You ask about a Christ whom you think you know. The world has a meaning to you. I don't know your Christ or who he is. I know what the word means to me.

r: Seems to me that to know Christ, you must first accept that Christ can give you knowledge of his existence. You can know Christ by any means that leads to the understanding of your own existence. All that is is knowing you know nothing. You are all upside down in the world because you want to be smart whereas I need to remember I know nothing and am totally ignorant. Of course, one could say that's being really smart but I won't go there.

 

[bshole]

Religious people are intellectually defective. It doesn't matter if they can "set aside their beliefs in policy making." Even if true (which in most cases it isn't), the real problem is that they cannot think critically.

Well they are either that or probably more afraid of non-existence. Non-existence is morally repugnant to most humans. It is in our DNA. It is an evolved trait which is paradoxically responsible for a massive amount of human suffering. Why did we evolve the trait to think about death and worry about it? We would much happier without it. Unfortunately that gene made it through the evolutionary process and now all humanity must suffer. We willing delude ourselves that we can live after death even if common sense and our native intelligence tells us that we are believing a lie.

 

[Moonbeam]

Well they are either that or probably more afraid of non-existence. Non-existence is morally repugnant to most humans. It is in our DNA. It is an evolved trait which is paradoxically responsible for a massive amount of human suffering. Why did we evolve the trait to think about death and worry about it? We would much happier without it. Unfortunately that gene made it through the evolutionary process and now all humanity must suffer. We willing delude ourselves that we can live after death even if common sense and our native intelligence tells us that we are believing a lie.

Or you could just have no idea. Why do you imagine you know anything? Because you do not see that you are blinded by your dominant concealed prejudice.

 

[realibrad]

realibrad: You learned that you cannot learn anything, thus you did not learn that you could not learn?

M: I learned there is nothing to learn and everything to unlearn.

r: If you know nothing, how do you know Christ was real?

M: You ask about a Christ whom you think you know. The world has a meaning to you. I don't know your Christ or who he is. I know what the word means to me.

r: Seems to me that to know Christ, you must first accept that Christ can give you knowledge of his existence. You can know Christ by any means that leads to the understanding of your own existence. All that is is knowing you know nothing. You are all upside down in the world because you want to be smart whereas I need to remember I know nothing and am totally ignorant. Of course, one could say that's being really smart but I won't go there.

For example I learned from religion that I don't know anything.

If you learn something, you then know something. In this case, you learned that you do not know anything, thus you learned something. Now you say...

I learned there is nothing to learn and everything to unlearn

Sounds like the something to learn is that you have nothing to learn, but that means you first have to learn there is nothing to learn. I'm sure you don't see the conflict there, but I bet most do.

 

[Moonbeam]

If you learn something, you then know something. In this case, you learned that you do not know anything, thus you learned something. Now you say...



Sounds like the something to learn is that you have nothing to learn, but that means you first have to learn there is nothing to learn. I'm sure you don't see the conflict there, but I bet most do.

Basho said to the assembled monks, “If you have a staff, I will give you one. If you have no staff, I will take it away from you.”

Isn't that silly? How could a serious person talk that way?

 

[JD50]

Religious people are intellectually defective. It doesn't matter if they can "set aside their beliefs in policy making." Even if true (which in most cases it isn't), the real problem is that they cannot think critically.

They compartmentalize.

 

[realibrad]

Basho said to the assembled monks, “If you have a staff, I will give you one. If you have no staff, I will take it away from you.”

Isn't that silly? How could a serious person talk that way?

People try to sound "deep" by saying conflicting things.

You can never free yourself from pain because the self is pain.

Those who are not clear are in fear of others realizing there's is nothing to see.

 

[justoh]

They compartmentalize.

Cool story. Still morons.

 

[Jaskalas]

But not being "devout" -- even judged by some theoretically objective standard if there were such a thing - isn't, by any means, the same as being atheist or agnostic...

The journey to being free of religion begins by not caring as much about religion. I'll give you a data point for why I'm saying this.

Mass Attendance Down 2/3 Since Last Papal Visit...

Western people and western values distinguish themselves by having developed in a Christian / Catholic environment that grew to tolerate, that began to harbor, and eventually was overcome by ideals of freedom and democracy.

From the Dark Ages of religious wars, our people have become quite secular and will continue to trend that way until organized religion no longer means anything. Our civilization makes steady progress.

A person of devout faith should be seen as a threat to that progress, depending on who they are and how fervent they are with supplanting western law with their own form of crazy. Muslims, whether they are foreign arrivals or freshly converted, are viewed as more devout and more insistent on a form of religious law that is simply not compatible with the historical values of western civilization.

Their devotion is seen as a change backwards towards something that is not historically western. Not historically free or democratic. Modern political leaders in the west have no such religious devotion, and I see Carson's comment as the logical continuation of our status quo. I stand by such personal qualifications for our elected officials. If you are what you claim, then you should too.

 

[TheSlamma]

This is the same outrage machine that gets mad at gov workers who do not hand out marriage certs to gay couples and that women are not getting paid equally or are on the face of our currency. What do those idiots think Sharia law does with gays and how do they think women are treated?

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/09/24/to-this-secular-muslim-ben-carson-had-a-point.html

I don't care what the religion is, get that hocus pokus BS out of our politics PERIOD.

 

[JD50]

Cool story. Still morons.

I'm pretty anti-religious, but I don't think that's fair. Plenty of them are morons, but plenty of them are not. I was religious for years, and I'm not a moron (maybe?). When it's something that you've grown up with and been around since the day you were born it makes it very hard to get out of that bubble.

I don't know how to explain it, for some reason people just shut off the critical thinking portion of their brain when it comes to religion. Faith (believing without evidence) is for some reason considered a virtue by a lot of people. There's no other part of your life that this would be a good thing, but for some reason when it comes to religion, it is. Did Dr. Carson use faith when he was performing his surgeries, or did he use the knowledge that he gained in school and throughout his career? I wish someone would ask him that question, but I'm sure he has somehow rationalized that in his mind. It doesn't make sense to me at all, I WAS like that and I still have no idea why, other than indoctrination I guess.