Can't shoot someone unless they have a gun too

[soulcougher73]

I know some conservatives that are anti-gun. Most of you think im a liberal and im pro gun. /shrug.

 

[Zaap]

Personally I've just heard too much utterly stupid, retarded bullshit spewing forth from people with a leftwing bent that (right or wrong) I don't trust any left-leaning political type to set policy when it comes to crime.

As I see it, criminals are universally able to outsmart left-leaning political hacks at every turn, and rely on those types to make it easier to commit, get away with, or get off with lighter sentences for their chosen occupation as criminals.

For those few leftwingers that possible aren't outsmarted by criminals- take it up with your fellow leftwingers who constantly prove they are.

 

[Munky]

What a friggin loon. Violent criminals are not simply looking for a fist fight. And they will never attempt to play on a level field, instead they will seize every advantage they can, and attack their target when he/she is most vulnerable. Leave it to a sheltered leftist liberal to dictate how people should defend themselves

 

[Juddog]

Personally I've just heard too much utterly stupid, retarded bullshit spewing forth from people with a leftwing bent that (right or wrong) I don't trust any left-leaning political type to set policy when it comes to crime.

As I see it, criminals are universally able to outsmart left-leaning political hacks at every turn, and rely on those types to make it easier to commit, get away with, or get off with lighter sentences for their chosen occupation as criminals.

For those few leftwingers that possible aren't outsmarted by criminals- take it up with your fellow leftwingers who constantly prove they are.

I could say the same thing about criminals using white collar crime to take advantage of politicians with a rightwing bent (maybe they're in cahoots instead of being taken advantage of, but either way it's enabling the white collar crime to occur).

The reality of things is that the best approach is often one of a moderate bent, instead of polarizing everything into left / right.

 

[1prophet]

MARK GLAZE: Very often somebody will come at you. They might want to have a fistfight. They might come at you with an axe handle.

CHRIS MATTHEWS: Would you consider the guy with the axe handle armed or not?

MARK GLAZE: Not with a gun.

CHRIS MATTHEWS: I would consider him armed [laughter].

MARK GLAZE: I have a word for him. I grew up in Colorado where my dad was a gun dealer, and a guy who shoots somebody who has anything other than a gun when they could have done something else like talk or fight with their fists –

CHRIS MATTHEWS: How do you talk to a guy with an axe handle?

MARK GLAZE: Well, you fight him. You run away. You deescalate the situation.

Guy with axe, no gun, no problem.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDQPIJSO0XA

 

[irishScott]

Yeah this liberal = anti-gun rhetoric is getting a bit ridiculous. Not all liberals are against guns, and not all conservatives are pro-gun. My wife's grandfather is an example - hates guns and is against them, but similar to thraashman's parents, has never ever even once voted for anything but a republican. He watches Fox news, etc., all the classic conservative stances on marriage, abortion, etc..

Also my liberal buddies are some of the biggest gun nuts I know; one guy I know has something like 6 guns, goes shooting on the weekends at the range, etc..

Well given that the pro-gun control position is entirely dominated by democrats at every level of politics, and the most strict gun control is often favored by the most liberal democrats...

Sure there may be some conservatives who are staunchly anti-gun, but I'd bet thousands that they're an extreme minority of conservatives.

 

[Thebobo]

I hate the fact that everybody who is anti-gun is automatically a liberal now; I know a ton of liberals who are pro-gun.

Once you label me you negate me..

 

[bshole]

Personally I've just heard too much utterly stupid, retarded bullshit spewing forth from people with a leftwing bent that (right or wrong) I don't trust any left-leaning political type to set policy when it comes to crime.

As I see it, criminals are universally able to outsmart left-leaning political hacks at every turn, and rely on those types to make it easier to commit, get away with, or get off with lighter sentences for their chosen occupation as criminals.

For those few leftwingers that possible aren't outsmarted by criminals- take it up with your fellow leftwingers who constantly prove they are.

If that is a true why does America lead the WORLD in incarceration rate? We are appear to be little more than a glorified penal colony. But hey most criminals are still on the street according to some people......

 

[DucatiMonster696]

If that is a true why does America lead the WORLD in incarceration rate? We are appear to be little more than a glorified penal colony. But hey most criminals are still on the street according to some people......

Two reasons, most criminals are stupid in addition the "War on Drugs" and government's ever increasing creation of laws which turns many people into criminals is also part of the problem.

However I'll be the first one to disagree with the assertion that the pro-gun prohibition left is anything but stupid. If anything they are very smart in their ability to push their agenda by playing on the emotions and fear in this situation.

 

[OverVolt]

Yeah this liberal = anti-gun rhetoric is getting a bit ridiculous. Not all liberals are against guns, and not all conservatives are pro-gun. My wife's grandfather is an example - hates guns and is against them, but similar to thraashman's parents, has never ever even once voted for anything but a republican. He watches Fox news, etc., all the classic conservative stances on marriage, abortion, etc..

Also my liberal buddies are some of the biggest gun nuts I know; one guy I know has something like 6 guns, goes shooting on the weekends at the range, etc..

Hmm liberals are trying to separate themselves from the anti-gun perspective now that it has massively backfired? Typical? Yes? No?

Liberals are never wrong, always impartial! And take a stance of progressive neutrality on all issues! Except ones that backfire, that was the... er.... conservatives... yup.

 

[Zaap]

I could say the same thing about criminals using white collar crime to take advantage of politicians with a rightwing bent (maybe they're in cahoots instead of being taken advantage of, but either way it's enabling the white collar crime to occur).

And just as many of those are taking advantage of politicians with a leftwing bent, and in fact I'd argue that many of those white collar criminals ARE the politicians themselves, fleecing untold billions out of state, local and federal coffers, and enriching themselves and their cronies at the expense of the taxpayers. Sorry, but once more it's not the most left-leaning among us standing in the way of any of that. Most of the time, the left doesn't even think of that as a problem- just force someone else to pay more taxes to cover all the fraud, waste and outright theft.

 

[Zaap]

If that is a true why does America lead the WORLD in incarceration rate? We are appear to be little more than a glorified penal colony. But hey most criminals are still on the street according to some people......

The irony of this within the context of this thread, is that if some crazy leftwingers had their way, we'd have people going to jail for the "crime" of defending themselves with a firearm against "unarmed" attackers. "Unarmed" that is with things like axe-handles, knives and baseball bats.

 

[Juddog]

Hmm liberals are trying to separate themselves from the anti-gun perspective now that it has massively backfired? Typical? Yes? No?

Liberals are never wrong, always impartial! And take a stance of progressive neutrality on all issues! Except ones that backfire, that was the... er.... conservatives... yup.

Butthurt that the world isn't black and white? Welcome to the real world, which isn't made solely of talking points.

 

[bshole]

I found this video hysterical. In it FOX news shreds every thing in the constitution EXCEPT the right to keep and bear arms....

Basically they support torture, illegal search and seizure, religious oppression, removal of Miranda rights, the ninth amendment, etc.... Stewart got tape of the FOX commentators spouting this stuff. It is utterly remarkable. The only amendment they consistently supported was gun access. Um.... guys.... without any of those other rights, a country can't be free. Japan is freer in many ways than the USA but they don't have gun rights.
Please watch the video....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWuzezm1vL0

 

[irishScott]

I found this video hysterical. In it FOX news shreds every thing in the constitution EXCEPT the right to keep and bear arms....

Basically they support torture, illegal search and seizure, religious oppression, removal of Miranda rights, the ninth amendment, etc.... Stewart got tape of the FOX commentators spouting this stuff. It is utterly remarkable. The only amendment they consistently supported was gun access. Um.... guys.... without any of those other rights, a country can't be free. Japan is freer in many ways than the USA but they don't have gun rights.
Please watch the video....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PWuzezm1vL0

That's nice, and completely irrelevant to the thread. And what's with your hard-on for Japan? It's a completely different country with a completely different culture and is in many respects a completely different society. Comparing it to the United States and implying that their gun control methods work better, or would work here is kinda dumb.

The US is historically unique in its disposition towards guns on literally every front. You can't compare us to other nations on this issue, period. It's also one of the weakest arguments you can possibly make in favor of gun control, so kindly stop making it.

TLDR: Please. Fucking noob.

 

[IEC]

I don't care if the wannabe despot has a (D) or an (R) after their name(s) - if they are trying to be despots they should be removed from office.

And stripped of their armed bodyguards of course. I'd suggest arming their bodyguards with cans of potpourri instead to cover up the bullshit they spew.

 

[Scotteq]

The irony of this within the context of this thread, is that if some crazy leftwingers had their way, we'd have people going to jail for the "crime" of defending themselves with a firearm against "unarmed" attackers. "Unarmed" that is with things like axe-handles, knives and baseball bats.

It's already the law in some places (NJ, for example) that the police *must* arrest in the wake of any incident involving a firearm. So (here) a defending homeowner will be arrested, will be booked, will go to jail, will be charged, will be araigned, and will go to a Grand Jury.... The state will then determine whether the homeowner's affirmative defense of a justifiable shooting is accepted (or not); and therefore whether our homeowner may be released or would then proceed to a full criminal trial.

Now.... Does anyone honestly think they'd still have a job, a house, and any savings left after paying your lawyers to defend against the state after defending yourself from an attacker???

Alternatively, you can attempt to scoop up your kids and jump out the nearest window. I'm sure the hospital bills would be cheaper.

 

[bshole]

The US is historically unique in its disposition towards guns on literally every front. You can't compare us to other nations on this issue, period. It's also one of the weakest arguments you can possibly make in favor of gun control, so kindly stop making it.

If its the weakest argument in favor of gun control, what exactly is the strongest argument in favor of gun control?

 

[PrinceofWands]

If its the weakest argument in favor of gun control, what exactly is the strongest argument in favor of gun control?

There are none, as supported by the reviews of gun control by the CDC and NAS.

 

[irishScott]

If its the weakest argument in favor of gun control, what exactly is the strongest argument in favor of gun control?

Personal accountability (ensuring gun owners know how to use their firearms) and accident prevention IMO. On the surface licensing is a very sensible proposal. The counter-argument is fear of government overreach and abuse of any such licensing system; and given that we're in the age of the NSA raping the 4th amendment, that argument has all too much weight. Never mind that the gun control lobby rarely makes any sensible proposals. The entire idea of an "assault weapons ban" would have at best a miniscule effect on gun deaths, yet they focus on that and refuse to even consider more effective solutions that don't involve banning guns based on arbitrary requirements.

A prime example is the insistence on banning guns with bayonet lugs. I challenge you to find a single instance of a criminal, with a bayonet mounted on the muzzle of his rifle, using it to kill anyone within the last 50 years. But the gun control lobby continues to push for it. Reminds me of that episode of The Office when Michael had his "run for the cure" for rabies. Only it's actually worse, because bayonets mounted on rifles kill even fewer people than rabies.

 

[davmat787]

Oddly enough yes.

on being asked if he knew any antigun conservatives.

I hate the fact that everybody who is anti-gun is automatically a liberal now; I know a ton of liberals who are pro-gun.

Case in point that we need to elevate the maturity of any discussions here regarding firearm politics. I once had a great chart that illustrated gun ownership among D's and R's, wish I could find it at the moment.

And besides, I have yet to meet someone (lib or con) shooting a gun for the first time that doesn't have a huge grin on their face.

Who knows, maybe an P&N gunclub could bring us all together and help break down this stupid wall between the sides? :awe:

Of course rule #1 would have to be: NO POLITICAL DISCUSSIONS! That would be a recipe for disaster. :hmm:

 

[Pray To Jesus]

lmao

the idiocy of gun control nuts is amazing

 

[IGBT]

elections have consequences.

 

[Abraxas]

Fuck that. They're ignorant, insane fucktards and a danger to all mankind. They ever get this thinking anywhere near reality and I'll personally raise an army to kill them all before they destroy what's left of the world.

As one person who supports keeping the ownership and possession of firearms to another, shut the fuck up you infantile moron.

You embody in this post everything I loathe in the pro-guns camp. I don't mean to single you out, your brand of stupid is merely emblematic of a much deeper problem, but this is exactly why we can't have nice things. Your big solution to bringing people to the pro-gun side of the debate is threaten to murder people for having a different political opinion than you if they start to get it accomplished? To encourage people to let you keep and bear dangerous devices by threatening to use them on people who disagree? You mindless, crotch-drooling dumbass, do you have even have the slightest idea how your inane ranting impacts the rest of us?

Every time you open your big, dumb mouth and plop out a big dumb turd like this one, you make their case for the people who want to restrict ownership. You aren't showing why it is just and right that you should be allowed to keep guns, you are showing yourself, and by extension, those on the same side of the debate as you, as mentally unbalanced, dangerous, psychotics who not only need their guns taken away, they need to be locked up before they hurt someone.

Next time you think about threatening to murder people for having different politics, stop for a moment, pray to "hunts pandas from a helicopter with an RPG Republican Jesus" or whatever deity you believe in for guidance on whether you are helping people to understand the value the freedom to own guns imparts or if you are helping them to understand your prescriptions have lapsed again and the men in white need to make a house call. Please, think before hitting that submit reply button before you and those like you ruin shit for everyone. You are more dangerous to gun freedoms than they are and so if you can't say anything intelligent, don't say anything at all.

 

[PrinceofWands]

As one person who supports keeping the ownership and possession of firearms to another, shut the fuck up you infantile moron.

You embody in this post everything I loathe in the pro-guns camp. I don't mean to single you out, your brand of stupid is merely emblematic of a much deeper problem, but this is exactly why we can't have nice things. Your big solution to bringing people to the pro-gun side of the debate is threaten to murder people for having a different political opinion than you if they start to get it accomplished?

I'm not trying to bring them to my side, that's impossible. I'm warning them that the ultimate result of their side is armed revolution. It's a factual warning...a bright line. Nothing more, nothing less.

To encourage people to let you keep and bear dangerous devices by threatening to use them on people who disagree? You mindless, crotch-drooling dumbass, do you have even have the slightest idea how your inane ranting impacts the rest of us?

Couldn't care in the least. The only things that matter are factual knowledge and honesty. How people deal with or react to that is 100% their own problem.

The fact is, firearm bans will result in open warfare. Now the ball is in their court.

Every time you open your big, dumb mouth and plop out a big dumb turd like this one, you make their case for the people who want to restrict ownership. You aren't showing why it is just and right that you should be allowed to keep guns,

Not trying to. I did for two decades, eloquently and passionately. Nobody listened because nobody cares. People believe what they want. Intelligence and knowledge are looked down on, and half the planet is too stupid to get it even if they cared (which almost none do). My only remaining responsibility is to warn people of the eventual outcomes of their continued evil and stupidity.

you are showing yourself, and by extension, those on the same side of the debate as you, as mentally unbalanced, dangerous, psychotics who not only need their guns taken away, they need to be locked up before they hurt someone.

Next time you think about threatening to murder people for having different politics, stop for a moment, pray to "hunts pandas from a helicopter with an RPG Republican Jesus" or whatever deity you believe in

Sorry, not Republican, conservative, or religious. I'm anti-religious, anti-partisan, and a classical liberal overall. But keep trying.

for guidance on whether you are helping people to understand the value the freedom to own guns imparts or if you are helping them to understand your prescriptions have lapsed again and the men in white need to make a house call. Please, think before hitting that submit reply button before you and those like you ruin shit for everyone. You are more dangerous to gun freedoms than they are and so if you can't say anything intelligent, don't say anything at all.

You're as welcome to your opinion as I am to mine. That's a euphemism for fuck right the hell off and die in a fire you wise and beautiful woman.