Can you prove the Bible has fallacies?

[OdiN]

You don't. The people who tried found that it confirmed the historical data they were hoping it would differ from.

 

[RCN]

Originally posted by: MrWizzard
RCN

Um, I said not all are real contradictions and for the most part they are not taken out of context.

Use my first example....explain the two deaths....

What two deaths? I really don't know about this one.

of Judas. Matthew 27:3-10 and Acts 1:18-19 along with several other versions in early Christian literature....

 

[Kadarin]

Belief in Christianity requires faith, and one either has it or one does not. I choose not to, because I see no point in believing in "God" (given that there is NOT ONE SHRED of evidence to indicate that "God" is real.)

 

[everman]

Originally posted by: Buck Naked
The thing that has always bugged me is how polytheism came before Monotheism.

That's just the way the tech tree works. I usually race for polytheism, usually trying to establish monotheism is a toss-up. If I can get both, then great

 

[Bartino]

dont let the flamebait take hold of you!!!

 

[MrWizzard]

Astaroth33

Belief in Christianity requires faith, and one either has it or one does not. I choose not to, because I see no point in believing in "God" (given that there is NOT ONE SHRED of evidence to indicate that "God" is real.)

Eh, little confusing yet you are named after a Demon. A rather weird one I might add.

"Astaroth is a Grand Duke of Hell. Astaroth is depicted as a nude man with dragon-like wings, hands and feet, a second pair of feathered wings after the main, wearing a crown, holding a serpent in one hand, and riding a wolf or dog."

Your name comes from the opposite of God. Then again it is just a forum name sooo....

Info source here LINKY

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

The real question is how do you prove it.

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: MrWizzard
quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: DAGTA
How does the Bible contradicting itself disprove God's existance? I've never heard God claim the Bible is perfect.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


RapidSnail

1 Peter 1:23 (King James Version)

Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Psalm 12:6-7 (King James Version)

The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.

Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.

Proverbs 30:5 (King James Version)

Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.


in·cor·rupt·i·ble (nk-rpt-bl)
adj.

1. Incapable of being morally corrupted.
2. Not subject to corruption or decay.

pure (pyr)
adj. pur·er, pur·est

1. Having a homogeneous or uniform composition; not mixed: pure oxygen.
2. Free from adulterants or impurities: pure chocolate.
3. Free of dirt, defilement, or pollution: ?A memory without blot or contamination must be... an inexhaustible source of pure refreshment? (Charlotte Brontë).
4. Free of foreign elements.
5. Containing nothing inappropriate or extraneous: a pure literary style.
6. Complete; utter: pure folly.
7. Having no faults; sinless: ?I felt pure and sweet as a new baby? (Sylvia Plath).
8. Chaste; virgin.
9. Of unmixed blood or ancestry.
10. Genetics. Produced by self-fertilization or continual inbreeding; homozygous: a pure line.
11. Music. Free from discordant qualities: pure tones.
12. Linguistics. Articulated with a single unchanging speech sound; monophthongal: a pure vowel.
13. Theoretical: pure science.
14. Philosophy. Free of empirical elements: pure reason.

I agree with the point by RapidSnail, also there is a disclaimer in the last words of the bible that says some very very un-nice things will happen to the persons who change the meaning of the bible.

But, again, the Bible was written by men, not God. It is said to be divinely inspired, but still written by human hands.

 

[Babbles]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
The real question is how do you prove it.

No, in fact that is anything but "the real question" and is really a gross misunderstanding. Requiring proof, in a sense, is counter to what the Bible would stand for. You need to have faith in it, not empirical evidence.

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: everman

Originally posted by: Buck Naked
The thing that has always bugged me is how polytheism came before Monotheism.

That's just the way the tech tree works. I usually race for polytheism, usually trying to establish monotheism is a toss-up. If I can get both, then great

Civ 4 rocks! Especially at 1600X1200. rool:

 

[RCN]

Originally posted by: RapidSnail

Originally posted by: RCN

Originally posted by: MrWizzard

You can find more here:

Um, a lot of those are really taken out of context....

Um, I said not all are real contradictions and for the most part they are not taken out of context.


Use my first example....explain the two deaths....

2 Samuel 23:8 (King James Version)

These be the names of the mighty men whom David had: The Tachmonite that sat in the seat, chief among the captains; the same was Adino the Eznite: he lift up his spear against eight hundred, whom he slew at one time.

This verse is referring to Adino the Eznite who slew eight hundred men.

1 Chronicles 11:11 (King James Version)

And this is the number of the mighty men whom David had; Jashobeam, an Hachmonite, the chief of the captains: he lifted up his spear against three hundred slain by him at one time.

This verse refers to Jashobeam, an Hachmonite, who slew three hundred men.

Two different people; two different numbers.

I want you to read these and tell me again there is not a contradiction:

http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt25a11.htm
http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt08b23.htm

 

[0roo0roo]

30+ gospels ftw!
gospel of judas ftw!?

 

[RapidSnail]

Originally posted by: RCN

Originally posted by: MrWizzard

Originally posted by: RCN

Um, I said not all are real contradictions and for the most part they are not taken out of context.

Use my first example....explain the two deaths....

What two deaths? I really don't know about this one.

of Judas. Matthew 27:3-10 and Acts 1:18-19 along with several other versions in early Christian literature....

Matthew 27:3-10 (King James Version)

Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,

Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.

And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.

And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood.

And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in.

Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day.



The verses in Matthew record Judas as hanging himself. Obviously, Judas' hanging himself resulted in his death.



Acts 1:18-19 (King James Version)

Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.

And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.



The verses in Acts do not say that he died from the fall. All it says is that he fell and "all his bowels gushed out."

Therefore, we can conclude that Judas was killed in the hanging, and that the fall occured post-mortem.

 

[0roo0roo]

ah well
http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/
has the koran and torah too!

 

[MrWizzard]

quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by: MrWizzard
RCN

quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Um, I said not all are real contradictions and for the most part they are not taken out of context.

Use my first example....explain the two deaths....
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



What two deaths? I really don't know about this one.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RCN
of Judas. Matthew 27:3-10 and Acts 1:18-19 along with several other versions in early Christian literature....

That does seem confusing, it's like he died 2 ways. Some people might say well he hung himself then his neck snapped and he fell then his stomach fell out.


To me it's like this. He committed suicide and died. Because he was so ashamed of what he did. Both stories could be right, even though they seem to contradict. Bottom line it does not change the outcome or the meaning of the message.

That is how it is to me though. Others might get another messages from it.

 

[yhelothar]

dunno about the bible.. but george carlin does pretty good in disproving the 10 commandments

 

[Babbles]

I consider myself a self-described Buddhist, so I don't want to be taken as some sort of Christian fanboy. With that being said, I think it is totally pointless in attempting to point out contradictions in the Bible because everything in life has contradictions. Gravity contradicts itself and as such there are no hard and fast rules regarding gravity, so should we too just abandon our working knowledge of gravity? As a scientist I come across tons of things that have exceptions to the rules or otherwise may act in a contradictory manner. In a weird sense I would be more disturbed if the Bible was indeed 100% perfect without errors. Additionally the Bible makes no effort to hide the fact that it was written by Man, and I don't think anybody out there would consider Man as being perfect without contradictions.

To attempt to disprove something which requires faith is futile and rather silly.

 

[Strk]

You listen to Pat Robertson or Jerry Falwell talk about it.

Ok, that doesn't disprove it, it just makes you think it's a load of crap.

 

[RCN]

Originally posted by: RapidSnail

Originally posted by: RCN

Originally posted by: MrWizzard

Originally posted by: RCN

Um, I said not all are real contradictions and for the most part they are not taken out of context.

Use my first example....explain the two deaths....

What two deaths? I really don't know about this one.

of Judas. Matthew 27:3-10 and Acts 1:18-19 along with several other versions in early Christian literature....

Matthew 27:3-10 (King James Version)

Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,

Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood. And they said, What is that to us? see thou to that.

And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself.

And the chief priests took the silver pieces, and said, It is not lawful for to put them into the treasury, because it is the price of blood.

And they took counsel, and bought with them the potter's field, to bury strangers in.

Wherefore that field was called, The field of blood, unto this day.



The verses in Matthew record Judas as hanging himself. Obviously, Judas' hanging himself resulted in his death.



Acts 1:18-19 (King James Version)

Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity; and falling headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out.

And it was known unto all the dwellers at Jerusalem; insomuch as that field is called in their proper tongue, Aceldama, that is to say, The field of blood.



The verses in Acts do not say that he died from the fall. All it says is that he fell and "all his bowels gushed out."

Therefore, we can conclude that Judas was killed in the hanging, and that the fall occured post-mortem.

Obviously the hanhing did but not the gut split? :roll: The rest of the account doesn't really match either.

Neither jive with the account of Papias or evidence he didn't die at all.......

 

[RapidSnail]

Originally posted by: DAGTA
But, again, the Bible was written by men, not God. It is said to be divinely inspired, but still written by human hands.

God is the author of the Bible, but he does not claim to be the writer. There is a difference.

au·thor (ôthr)
n.

1. a. The writer of a book, article, or other text.
b. One who practices writing as a profession.
2. One who writes or constructs an electronic document or system, such as a website.
3. An originator or creator, as of a theory or plan.
4. Author God.


writ·er (rtr)
n.

One who writes, especially as an occupation.



2 Timothy 3:16 (King James Version)

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

The word inspiration is a compound Greek word meaning "God-breathed." God "breathed" his word to approximately forty writers over the course of 1500 years. They were God's words, yet they were written down by men.

 

[everman]

Originally posted by: Babbles
Gravity contradicts itself and as such there are no hard and fast rules regarding gravity, so should we too just abandon our working knowledge of gravity?

What do you mean by this?

 

[DAGTA]

Originally posted by: RapidSnail

Originally posted by: DAGTA
But, again, the Bible was written by men, not God. It is said to be divinely inspired, but still written by human hands.

God is the author of the Bible, but he does not claim to be the writer. There is a difference.

au·thor (ôthr)
n.

1. a. The writer of a book, article, or other text.
b. One who practices writing as a profession.
2. One who writes or constructs an electronic document or system, such as a website.
3. An originator or creator, as of a theory or plan.
4. Author God.


writ·er (rtr)
n.

One who writes, especially as an occupation.



2 Timothy 3:16 (King James Version)

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

The word inspiration is a compound Greek word meaning "God-breathed." God "breathed" his word to approximately forty writers over the course of 1500 years. They were God's words, yet they were written down by men.

Well I'm simply going to disagree with you on this since I believe human tampering in the Bible does not prove God as not existing.

 

[Babbles]

Originally posted by: everman

Originally posted by: Babbles
Gravity contradicts itself and as such there are no hard and fast rules regarding gravity, so should we too just abandon our working knowledge of gravity?

What do you mean by this?

If you only believed in things that never contradicted itself, in the end you would never believe anything - be it the Bible or science.
Maybe that is just how life is, I dunno.

 

[RapidSnail]

Originally posted by: RCN
Obviously the hanhing did but not the gut split? :roll: The rest of the account doesn't really match either.

Neither jive with the account of Papias or evidence he didn't die at all.......

I'm not sure if you're understanding what I'm saying. Judas was killed when he hung himself (Matt. 27:5). The fall (Acts 1:18) occured post-mortem (after death) and split his stomach open. The fall was the result of the earth quake that happened at that very time.

Matthew 27:51 (King James Version)

And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;

 

[RapidSnail]

Originally posted by: DAGTA
Well I'm simply going to disagree with you on this since I believe human tampering in the Bible does not prove God as not existing.

Are you saying that you believe there was human tampering?