Can we ever remake public schools to get costs under control and better results?

[DominionSeraph]

heh, women's lib is the cause of the two income household? it's more like it has become more expensive to live and the two household income has become a requirement. even for people who live below their means, a single income house is too hard

It isn't more expensive to live. The problem is that the economy is more inefficient, demanding low-pay service workers to service the needs of the two-income family; those workers due to their low-pay status thus needing to be two-income themselves, and thus needing service workers themselves...
You have a whole lotta service being paid for by a very few producers.
There are far fewer inefficiencies in a system where the men produce and the women serve for their desires for their household. Instead of shuffling everybody around -- men, women, and children; only the men need independent transit, and the school age children need only make one round-trip by mass transit.

It is cheaper than ever to live, but people demand more and more while the inefficiencies of straight labor pile up.
Making things even worse is everyone's propensity to sue. That segment of the legal profession is a straight drain on the economy. It's just a stupid Lottery with huge overhead.

 

[PrinceofWands]

Schools can only do so much, no matter the budget. Until parents start being parents again schools are going to continue to suck. I agree there needs to be change, and more money isn't the answer. I just want to see change where it will help the most first, and that's at home.

 

[Zorkorist]

You gonna mandate change at home?

Otherwise, it's a public policy/Government issue.

How about mandating change there?

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

Keep your meddling little ass, out of my home.

-John

 

[PrinceofWands]

Keep your meddling little ass, out of my home.

-John

I want nothing to do with your home (and no one said anything about mandating such). Just don't blame school & government for your precious snowflake being an ignorant, worthless piece of shit until you first provide an environment and attitude conducive to their betterment.

 

[Zorkorist]

You're very wrong, Prince...

It's your "structurally sound" Government, like School Systems, that is allowing kids to go crazy.

Once they leave their parents supervision, they have no respect at all for Government.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

There is no room in Government for Authority, only fear.

-John

 

[PrinceofWands]

You're very wrong, Prince...

It's your "structurally sound" Government, like School Systems, that is allowing kids to go crazy.

Once they leave their parents supervision, they have no respect at all for Government.

-John

You have the IQ of a kumquat, AND you're a lying piece of shit.

I NEVER said anything about 'structurally sound government', you pulled that out of your ass. I won't even begin to discuss the eleventy-billion ways you're full of shit about government being the cause because you're too fucking stupid to understand any of it anyway.

Basically I'm just sitting here in shock that your brain can generate the voltage necessary to carry on autonomous functions.

 

[Zorkorist]

Great post.

-John

 

[DominionSeraph]

Keep your meddling little ass, out of my home.

-John

Quote, button, learn, to, use, it.

-DominionSeraph
-Master of All
-Intellect Supreme
-Embodiment of Inconceivable Modesty
-<3er of Kuchiki Rukia
-Currently a Listener of Gumi's "Coward Mont Blanc."
-Pants Status: On.
-Mocker Extraordinaire

 

[Zorkorist]

Quote, button, learn, to, use, it.

-DominionSeraph
-Master of All
-Intellect Supreme
-Embodiment of Inconceivable Modesty
-<3er of Kuchiki Rukia
-Currently a Listener of Gumi's "Coward Mont Blanc."
-Pants Status: On.
-Mocker Extraordinaire

Keep your pants on.

-John

 

[DominionSeraph]

Keep your pants on.

-John

Why do you feel the need to sign every post with your generic surname when you have been given the ability to customize the identifiers that automatically attach to the left of each post?

-DominionSeraph
-Implier of The Obvious

 

[Zorkorist]

To the OP, Krasky... of course we can.

It has to start with students giving respect to their teachers (and teachers demanding respect.)

If the teachers are scared of the students, their parents, or the Government, then no, we can't fix it.

Vouchers, like Private Schools, give more repect to teachers.

But the fact is that Public School teachers should be respected and they should not fear having to hit a child, etc.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

Why do you feel the need to sign every post with your generic surname when you have been given the ability to customize the identifiers that automatically attach to the left of each post?

-DominionSeraph
-Implier of The Obvious

Why do you challenge me, rather than post to the thread?

-John

 

[shortylickens]

For reference I believe schools do much better when the parents dont care.
Modern public education is good evidence that caring by itself is more detrimental than anything else. You need to move beyond your parental instincts to protect, and leave the god damn schools alone. All this "caring" is why we focus on everything except the education itself. That shit needs to stop. Parents are incapable of being objective and keep suing the schools to get all kinds of ridiculous bullshit installed in the school system.

 

[Zorkorist]

School is a haven for the kids, and the only time parents get involved is when whiny kids run home with a busted nose.

But, in that kid haven, something has been lost and that is the respect for teachers. No, they are not your parents away from home, but they are your teachers, and you damn well better respect them.

-John

 

[Brigandier]

The problem with education in this country is it is taught not by those that can't, but by those that never tried.

Can one take classes to learn how to communicate with humans of lesser development(children)? Can one take classes to learn all the details of what they are trying to teach? Can one effectively control a crowd of humans under many circumstances? Can one human accomplish all these tasks without compromising one of them?

Our school systems lump all this authority on one single human, and bitches when our system doesn't work. Instead of questioning the system, we add administrators, consultants, and student advocacy groups; they don't change any fundamental detail so they can't affect any great change. The problem is we want people to act in teams while never showing them a practical team in practice. If a single classroom had 3-5 teachers they could handle a lot of students and improve education. Not only that, but the teamwork the teachers showed would rub off on the students. It's funny how we want everyone to work together without actually showing them how it works in the real world.

 

[Zorkorist]

You may be right that a single person cannot handle a room full of kids, but I would like to believe otherwise.

A teacher can and should demand respect, and captivate a room.

That's how I grew up... my teacher was boss.

-John

 

[Brigandier]

You may be right that a single person cannot handle a room full of kids, but I would like to believe otherwise.

A teacher can and should demand respect, and captivate a room.

That's how I grew up... my teacher was boss.

-John

You grew up in a society where one man was allowed to have that power, now it is not so. Today's society demonstrates how teamwork of average individuals trumps a single incredibility in nearly every circumstance. In a society where each child, each thought, each whim is sacred, how can another individual have any power? Power comes from aligning yourself with competent individuals that make up for your deficiencies so you can just focus on what makes you good.

 

[Zorkorist]

Ellesworth Toohey says we need one adult per child, if only to tackle the children quickly.

-John

 

[Brigandier]

Ellesworth Toohey says we need one adult per child, if only to tackle the children quickly.

-John

Toohey is a rat bastard, but unfortunately he was always "correct."

 

[Zorkorist]

Nah, he was always wrong.

-John

 

[Zorkorist]

Roarke was right.

-John

 

[Brigandier]

Nah, he was always wrong.

-John

I'll invoke Kenobi on you and say from a certain point of view. Any civilization and society can work, so any decision for that society is correct, the trick comes in supporting the society that is actually good. You can make 1 trillion right decisions and still be doing wrong.

 

[Zorkorist]

One person, a teacher, should be able to command a room full of kids.

-John