Originally posted by: ed21x
it's officially 'ruined' when you're a democrat.Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
Our country is ruined?
For everyone else, we're just experiencing the highest economy of all times.
Really, how so?
Wages going down
40 million plus can't afford Health care
It's the "highest" alright, only good for the high and almighty.
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: ed21x
it's officially 'ruined' when you're a democrat.Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
Our country is ruined?
For everyone else, we're just experiencing the highest economy of all times.
Really, how so?
Wages going down
40 million plus can't afford Health care
It's the "highest" alright, only good for the high and almighty.
I agree, I don't understand how some people think that this is the highest economy. I heard that under President Clinton, our country hit the peak of its economic devolopment, I don't know how true that is though.
Chaotic42
Lifer
- Jun 15, 2001
- 35,213
- 2,359
- 126
I'm sorry, but I don't know if I buy this argument. I used to be dirt poor. All of my money went to paying for housing and food. I ate cabbage a lot of days. I couldn't afford power for a while. I decided that it wasn't the lifestyle for me, so I applied myself. I worked hard, I worked 80 hours per week, sometimes more. It took a few years, but I finally really went to college. I got a degree. I got a decent job.
Can everyone do it? No. Some people have legitimate reasons for being unable to provide for themselves. If people would stop having kids that they can't afford, stop putting things on credit that they can't afford, and start living within their means, the problems that Americans have with not being able to get by would start to wane.
If I've missed your point, I'm sorry.
Originally posted by: Smartazz
Originally posted by: dmcowen674
Originally posted by: ed21x
it's officially 'ruined' when you're a democrat.Originally posted by: Fingolfin269
Our country is ruined?
For everyone else, we're just experiencing the highest economy of all times.
Really, how so?
Wages going down
40 million plus can't afford Health care
It's the "highest" alright, only good for the high and almighty.
I agree, I don't understand how some people think that this is the highest economy. I heard that under President Clinton, our country hit the peak of its economic devolopment, I don't know how true that is though.
I get very tired of the phrase "I heard...." You can hear or read a lot of things, but that doesn't make them correct.
People may or may not agree with the war. They may or may not think that Bush is doing a good job.
But... unemployment is down significantly. People are getting jobs. Low unemployment unlimately will lead to higher wages.
By the way, I personally don't believe the president has much to do with the economy, either good or bad. Economies run in cycles. Those cycles can be stretched a bit, but they occur regardless. Being in a good economy is more a matter of timing than anything else. But, that's just my opinion.
In all technicality, the majority of things said on the internet are what people heard. In real life, perception rules over actual facts. If you're tired of that, then I suggest only talking to people who exclusively discuss things that they've seen themselves, and don't infer or come up with ideas that they can't back up.
I guess that leaves going to the amazon and living with tribesmen. Hopefully some of them don't have any religion, cause you'll be tired of that, too.
As long as we're talking about economic prosperity...I had to drop out of school because I couldn't afford to work and go to school with the increased tuition costs caused by a combination of Rick Perry, and a slight increase brought on by my university's new facilities' construction costs.
Unfortuately, I can't contribute a lot to the conversation when it comes down to economic prosperity, because I'm new to the "real" job market (salary, insurance, etc., not an hourly job).
As to what Chaotic42 said, I personally couldn't work hard enough to get myself through school. The problem I faced was, if I worked hard enough to afford school, I couldn't study enough, and be well enough rested to do well in school.
My solution? I had my fiance finish her school, while I got a job that pays well, but demands 70 hours a week, minimum. Looking back, that's probably the best decision that I made. Now the plan is, once she's got a good salary, I quit and go back to school. We'll see how long until that happens, we've gotta get our wedding paid off before we have it, that's what we promised ourselves we'd do (Debt is something we're trying to crawl out from underneath, not amass), and we've gotta stick to our guns.
Anyhoo, enough personal jibba jabba.
Suppose she liked Bush, and flashed a V for victory sign..should she be fired for expressing a political view ?
What if she gave Bush a thumbs down sign, should she be fired for a non obscene disapproval ?
If the issue is obscenity, should every bus driver who ever muttered a bad word for any reason be fired too ?
What if she gave Bush a thumbs down sign, should she be fired for a non obscene disapproval ?
If the issue is obscenity, should every bus driver who ever muttered a bad word for any reason be fired too ?
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
- 57,501
- 20,103
- 146
The company made it very clear the firing was for the obcsene gesture in front of students and had nothing to do with politics.
Furthermore, according to this article:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/eastsidenews/2003336906_busdriver02e.html
The driver had a pattern of unprofessional conduct on the job, and this was the last straw.
Finally, her boss says this:
"If the bus driver had made the gesture to a driver who cut her off on a local road, we would have taken the same action."
I'm pretty sure that it's been beaten to death that even if it was for political reasons, the obscene gesture would be enough of a reason for firing.
And yes, bus drivers (or anyone) who curse loud enough for a child to hear while working should be punished. I feel that teachers and other school employees should be held to a higher standard, given they're around children constantly. That's just my opinion, though.
eits
Lifer
it's a once in a lifetime chance. i applaud her. it's not like the kids will be scarred for life.
:thumbsup: to the bus driver
:thumbsdown: to the decider
eits
Lifer
eits
Lifer
Well, going by that logic, it's pretty likely that these kids have stumbled upon some pictures of naked women at some point. So I guess if someone sold some Playboys to a 12 year old, it really shouldn't be punishable.
While we're at it, they've probably been exposed to second hand smoke. That's going to indicate that selling tobacco products to a minor shouldn't be punished, either.
As long as we're being apathetic about our next generation of youth, we should just go ahead and completely corrupt them.
If you really beleive that it's appropriate for a child's authority figure to openly perform obscene gestures, then maybe you're the part of the problem (rather than the solution) regarding the US's lacking moral values.
I can't even begin to pretend that kids aren't exposed to things that they shouldn't be. But seeing it from authority figures is something completely different. What if a kid flipped off the bus driver the next day while getting off the bus? I guess it wouldn't really matter, since they've seen it before...right guys?
While we're at it, they've probably been exposed to second hand smoke. That's going to indicate that selling tobacco products to a minor shouldn't be punished, either.
As long as we're being apathetic about our next generation of youth, we should just go ahead and completely corrupt them.
If you really beleive that it's appropriate for a child's authority figure to openly perform obscene gestures, then maybe you're the part of the problem (rather than the solution) regarding the US's lacking moral values.
I can't even begin to pretend that kids aren't exposed to things that they shouldn't be. But seeing it from authority figures is something completely different. What if a kid flipped off the bus driver the next day while getting off the bus? I guess it wouldn't really matter, since they've seen it before...right guys?
FelixDeCat
Lifer
- Aug 4, 2000
- 31,212
- 2,770
- 126
eits
Lifer
haha it's so funny to see bush apologists trolling
the only salute your dumbass president deserves is the finger. at what other point in life would she get the chance to salute him properly?
these were middle schoolers, by the way. your sense of reality is askew if you think that they've never seen or heard of worse.
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
- 57,501
- 20,103
- 146
Originally posted by: eits
haha it's so funny to see bush apologists trolling
the only salute your dumbass president deserves is the finger. at what other point in life would she get the chance to salute him properly?
these were middle schoolers, by the way. your sense of reality is askew if you think that they've never seen or heard of worse.
I also see that your assumptions as to my politics are equally as bad as your knowledge of history and sense of propriety.
I would support the firing if it were any Democrat, Communist, Socialist, Green Party member, Republican or Libertarian being given the bird by a school bus driver. It's not who she flipped off while on the job... it's that she flipped off anyone while on the job.
And SoylentG completely destroyed the "I bet they've seen worse" argument. I see no need to repeat it.
eits
Lifer
Originally posted by: Amused
Originally posted by: eits
haha it's so funny to see bush apologists trolling
the only salute your dumbass president deserves is the finger. at what other point in life would she get the chance to salute him properly?
these were middle schoolers, by the way. your sense of reality is askew if you think that they've never seen or heard of worse.
I also see that your assumptions as to my politics are equally as bad as your knowledge of history and sense of propriety.
And SoylentG completely destroyed the "I bet they've seen worse" argument. I see no need to repeat it.
haha it's funny that you keep trying to talk about my lack of historical knowledge, as if i'd be terribly offended or upset about it... and what's even funnier is that the only reason you think i have a lack of historical knowledge is because i said that there was some truth to the statement someone made about muslims modeling their policy of violence after the christians.
i don't see what's so wrong about finding some truth in that statement... justinian spread his empire and christian orthodoxy throughout northern africa, southern spain, and the middle east through military conquests. the arabs, basically, learned from the past and copycatted what the christians did to spread islam. i never said anything about the muslims learning from the christian crusades... i said there was some truth to the statement, which there was... the muslims learned from what the christians did to spread religion.
anyways, this isn't the proper thread to discuss this... i'm basically defending myself from your incessant trolling.
back to the topic at hand:
opportunity seldom knocks more than once... you've got the chance to either answer or let the chance go by. either give the most powerful man in the world a piece of your mind or let the chance go by just because two or three children might see you give him a piece of your mind.
Amused
Elite Member
- Apr 14, 2001
- 57,501
- 20,103
- 146
Then she obviously shouldn't mind losing her job... since it was such an opportunity.
She made the choice. She knew the rules. If you break the rules of your employer, don't whine about being fired. Ya know, she could have made a NON-obscene gesture such as a thumbs down. But no... She choose an obscene gesture with full knowledge that doing so in front of the children in her charge was against the rules.
Her actions while on the job are indefensible. You immaturity shines through in your vain attempts to defend her actions.
dmcowen, you're an idiot. Suppose I don't need to reiterate the fact, but free speech was upheld perfectly in this situation, you know why? Because she wasn't fvcking arrested on the spot you jerkoff. Many countries would have hauled her away and locked her up, but the free speech you say wasn't upheld, WAS UPHELD YOU DOUCHE.
eits
Lifer
i was unaware that she did mind losing her job. if she's bitching about losing her job, she's a frigging idiot. she took the opportunity so many in the world wish they had and put her job on the line. she should have known that there was a big probability of getting fired.
i didn't read the article because the link wouldn't work for me... it was just a blank charter news page with no news.
the only thing i defended was her giving bush the finger. i'm not defending her being fired... that's justified.
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