Bullet Serialization

[Socio]

When push comes to shove gun owners can reload their own cartridges so they won?t have to buy the serialized rounds. So what is going to stop them from removing the serial numbers? In fact it will probably create a black market for de- serialized reloaded rounds.

 

[theflyingpig]

Originally posted by: NeoV
you are wasting your time

ANY suggestion EVER made on this forum to even remotely slow or reduce the availability of any gun or ammo to any American is met with nothing but "great, criminals will still have all of their guns/ammo, common citizens get screwed" - despite any points made to the contrary - our drug laws, or laws, our police, etc, etc, etc - it's all their fault, it's not the fact that just about any schmuck can buy a gun and sell it to whomever he pleases.

Meanwhile, another 25-50 people were killed this weekend across the country at the hands of a gun - but it's no big deal, put your heads back in the sand

Why yes, guns are running rampant across this country, slaughtering innocents whenever they get the chance. Guns do this on their own because they have a singular purpose; to kill anything that moves. Each gun is imbued with the desire to rape, torture, and murder anything it encounters. Guns kill. Guns kill everything.

 

[AFMatt]

California SB357 was attempted in 2005 and was pulled before it even went for vote. It came back in 2006 as AB352, where they added microstamping firearms, and did not pass for many reasons.
I would be surprised to see Obama's administration try and get any bill of that nature going.

 

[glenn1]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: DrPizza

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Nebor
This is just ridiculous. I can make my own ammunition. Serializing ammo would just drive the costs through the roof and price firearms further out of the reach of those who need them the most (the poor.) Gun control is an elitist policy. Liberals don't care that I own machine guns, because I paid tens of thousands of dollars for them, so I must be an ok guy.

For this to work, you would not be permitted to use your homemade Ammunition. Possible exception being for Target Shooting.

LMAO. You're only allowed to use homemade ammunition for target shooting, but if you're going to commit a crime and shoot someone, then you have to use the serialized ammunition.

Yep. Criminals always listen about using the right ammunition when committing a crime.

Crime is committed with Unmarked bullet, another Charge is added.

So for shotguns, do you plan to have every pellet serialized individually? Or how about for my Glaser Safety Slugs frangibles? It's hard to even take those who support gun control seriously in the conversation, since they know so little about the subject of their desired bans.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: glenn1
It's hard to even take those who support gun control seriously in the conversation, since they know so little about the subject of their desired bans.

This.

Stay the fuck away from my guns... and bullets!

 

[bamacre]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
When the rare and as yet unknown farm animal virus knows as Red Neck Killing Spree Virus, the symptoms of which are that rural folk go nuts and start shooting up their neighbors for a hundred miles around, breaks the animal human barrier and starts an epidemic, we will see a new population, presently enamored of the NRA, drift off into active support for banning guns.

I don't how things are in San Fran, but here in Memphis, it isn't the rednecks shooting their neighbors. Of course, you being all the way in CA may know more about what goes on in the South more than, you know, people who actually live in the South.

 

[OCGuy]

:roll:

 

[AFMatt]

Originally posted by: glenn1
So for shotguns, do you plan to have every pellet serialized individually? Or how about for my Glaser Safety Slugs frangibles? It's hard to even take those who support gun control seriously in the conversation, since they know so little about the subject of their desired bans.

glenn, I was just about to come back and post something like that as I glanced over at the 12 gauge ammo (#6) sitting next to my desk. I couldn't imagine how much it would add to the cost of ammo if they had to do that.

 

[Kirby]

Sadly, there are no bounds on stupidity.

 

[glenn1]

Originally posted by: bamacre

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
When the rare and as yet unknown farm animal virus knows as Red Neck Killing Spree Virus, the symptoms of which are that rural folk go nuts and start shooting up their neighbors for a hundred miles around, breaks the animal human barrier and starts an epidemic, we will see a new population, presently enamored of the NRA, drift off into active support for banning guns.

I don't how things are in San Fran, but here in Memphis, it isn't the rednecks shooting their neighbors. Of course, you being all the way in CA may know more about what goes on in the South more than, you know, people who actually live in the South.

Cognitive dissonance; very common among many gun contol supporters. They use "rural redneck" in place of what they really mean, "urban black men approx. 15-24 years old." Deep down that's what their true fear actually is, but are unable to bring themselves to say it aloud for politically correct reasons. Their stated worry about "rural rednecks" is laughable on its face, since it's not as if they'd actually lower themselves to going out to the "flyover country" where rednecks actually live.

 

[TallBill]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
When the rare and as yet unknown farm animal virus knows as Red Neck Killing Spree Virus, the symptoms of which are that rural folk go nuts and start shooting up their neighbors for a hundred miles around, breaks the animal human barrier and starts an epidemic, we will see a new population, presently enamored of the NRA, drift off into active support for banning guns.

What the fuck are you (ever) talking about?

 

[Sacrilege]

Originally posted by: AFMatt

Originally posted by: glenn1
So for shotguns, do you plan to have every pellet serialized individually? Or how about for my Glaser Safety Slugs frangibles? It's hard to even take those who support gun control seriously in the conversation, since they know so little about the subject of their desired bans.

glenn, I was just about to come back and post something like that as I glanced over at the 12 gauge ammo (#6) sitting next to my desk. I couldn't imagine how much it would add to the cost of ammo if they had to do that.

This proposed bill is what happens when someone clueless about a subject attempts to delve into the thick of it with legislation, or lets their emotions get in the way of common sense.

As you earlier stated, many pie in the sky bills are constantly being proposed for feel good reasons, but never even get taken up for discussion because its not a priority or anyone with common sense sees the immediate problems in the proposal.

What ends up wasting everyone's time more is when some right wing website searching legislation archives for any hit of "gun" or "firearm" drags some proposed legislation out into internet discussion, and right wingers moan and groan as if Western Civilization is about to end.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: NeoV
you are wasting your time

ANY suggestion EVER made on this forum to even remotely slow or reduce the availability of any gun or ammo to any American is met with nothing but "great, criminals will still have all of their guns/ammo, common citizens get screwed" - despite any points made to the contrary - our drug laws, or laws, our police, etc, etc, etc - it's all their fault, it's not the fact that just about any schmuck can buy a gun and sell it to whomever he pleases.

Meanwhile, another 25-50 people were killed this weekend across the country at the hands of a gun - but it's no big deal, put your heads back in the sand

Legal guns, or guns that criminals obtained. Do you plan to stop factories in Mexico, China, South America from producing them?

 

[Brovane]

Originally posted by: DixyCrat
Test done by california (PDF warning)

from the NSFF

"This massive reduction in ammunition would translate into substantially lower sales and profitability and ultimately force major ammunition manufacturers to abandon the market. In turn, there would be a severe shortage of serialized ammunition and all consumers, including federal, state and local law enforcement agencies, would be faced with substantial price increases."

Personally: I think this is a good thing.

Why don't we see how this works out in CA before we start going down this road.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_microstamping

 

[Zebo]

And people thought I was crazy to talk about stock piling in OT. I currently have ~ 40,000 rounds and already selling my older Lake City 5.56 stuff for 300% profit right now - just imagine if this gets though nationally. Damn I wish I owned a gun store about now. Obama is already doing good things for the economy!!!

 

[LTC8K6]

They will simply make whatever you would do to get around it, illegal.

No reloading allowed, for example. Jail for being found with unserialized bullets. Etc.

The fact that the idea won't work in reality, and that it makes no sense to outlaw all that, won't matter.

They never think more than 2 seconds ahead when they propose these laws.

It never seems to occur to them that criminals don't obey the law and don't care what laws are passed.

It never occurs to them that they are only affecting people who weren't going to break the law in the first place.

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: DrPizza

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Nebor
This is just ridiculous. I can make my own ammunition. Serializing ammo would just drive the costs through the roof and price firearms further out of the reach of those who need them the most (the poor.) Gun control is an elitist policy. Liberals don't care that I own machine guns, because I paid tens of thousands of dollars for them, so I must be an ok guy.

For this to work, you would not be permitted to use your homemade Ammunition. Possible exception being for Target Shooting.

LMAO. You're only allowed to use homemade ammunition for target shooting, but if you're going to commit a crime and shoot someone, then you have to use the serialized ammunition.

Yep. Criminals always listen about using the right ammunition when committing a crime.

Crime is committed with Unmarked bullet, another Charge is added.

You got to be kidding me. I can hear the criminal now "Oh no, not shooting him, I don't think I want that extra 10 years for unmarked bullets tacked on to my murder sentence"

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: Zebo

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: MotF Bane

Originally posted by: DrPizza

Originally posted by: sandorski

Originally posted by: Nebor
This is just ridiculous. I can make my own ammunition. Serializing ammo would just drive the costs through the roof and price firearms further out of the reach of those who need them the most (the poor.) Gun control is an elitist policy. Liberals don't care that I own machine guns, because I paid tens of thousands of dollars for them, so I must be an ok guy.

For this to work, you would not be permitted to use your homemade Ammunition. Possible exception being for Target Shooting.

LMAO. You're only allowed to use homemade ammunition for target shooting, but if you're going to commit a crime and shoot someone, then you have to use the serialized ammunition.

Yep. Criminals always listen about using the right ammunition when committing a crime.

Crime is committed with Unmarked bullet, another Charge is added.

You got to be kidding me. I can hear the criminal now "Oh no, not shooting him, I don't think I want that extra 10 years for unmarked bullets tacked on to my murder sentence"

There is no "Deterence". That is not the point.

 

[palehorse]

Originally posted by: sandorski
There is no "Deterence". That is not the point.

What is the point?

 

[heyheybooboo]

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
When the rare and as yet unknown farm animal virus knows as Red Neck Killing Spree Virus, the symptoms of which are that rural folk go nuts and start shooting up their neighbors for a hundred miles around, breaks the animal human barrier and starts an epidemic, we will see a new population, presently enamored of the NRA, drift off into active support for banning guns.

Sorry Moonie, but city folks are far more murderous.

http://www.ojp.gov/bjs/abstract/usrv98.htm

There's the facts. You and your fellow city-folk are far more dangerous to be around than Cletus and his redneck kin.

Jesus, where did I say otherwise? The virus hasn't hit yet.

Your PDF is misleading and disingenuous. See Figure 4 on page 3.

They don't use the "Rate per 1,000 persons" in that statistic while using it in all others - and if you compare (during the study period) what appears to be a 35-40% decline in the total number homicides since the early 90's in urban areas to the relatively flat line in the total number of homicides in rural areas it totally refutes your contention.

I don't want to get in a p'ing contest but we had our first homicide of the year in my 'rural' county.

Two neighbors got likkered-up, started an argument and one of 'em whipped out his gun and shot the other guy ...

 

[KB]

They try this bill in every state and luckily it has failed in every one. I actually saw the guy who owned the patent for serialized bullets arguing for its review in committee. From the discussion it was determined by the committee members that he stood to gain enormous sums of money from each bullet manufacturer for the use of his patents. His opinion was then seen as suspect.

There are many problems with this. Sure some stupid criminals would be caught, but most would reload their own, scratch off the serial number, steal bullets from homeowners or sporting good stores. Just like the bullet finger-printing database the bullet serialization database will do nothing to stop crime.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: heyheybooboo

Originally posted by: Moonbeam

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: Moonbeam
When the rare and as yet unknown farm animal virus knows as Red Neck Killing Spree Virus, the symptoms of which are that rural folk go nuts and start shooting up their neighbors for a hundred miles around, breaks the animal human barrier and starts an epidemic, we will see a new population, presently enamored of the NRA, drift off into active support for banning guns.

Sorry Moonie, but city folks are far more murderous.

http://www.ojp.gov/bjs/abstract/usrv98.htm

There's the facts. You and your fellow city-folk are far more dangerous to be around than Cletus and his redneck kin.

Jesus, where did I say otherwise? The virus hasn't hit yet.

Your PDF is misleading and disingenuous. See Figure 4 on page 3.

They don't use the "Rate per 1,000 persons" in that statistic while using it in all others - and if you compare (during the study period) what appears to be a 35-40% decline in the total number homicides since the early 90's in urban areas to the relatively flat line in the total number of homicides in rural areas it totally refutes your contention.

I don't want to get in a p'ing contest but we had our first homicide of the year in my 'rural' county.

Two neighbors got likkered-up, started an argument and one of 'em whipped out his gun and shot the other guy ...

Hack much?

You find one thing you take issue, and the whole document is misleading. :roll:

And am I supposed to be impressed by your first murder of the year happening one month into the year? Sounds pretty damn safe to me.

 

[BoberFett]

Originally posted by: manowar821

Originally posted by: BoberFett

Originally posted by: manowar821
I'm against gun control, I'm also against drug control, nuclear control, alcohol control, mind control, or information control.

You can't have it both ways, you social conservative assholes. It's either freedom, or fascism with varying degrees of control. You all bitch about gun control, but then cheer on other forms of social constraints. You're just as bad, or worse than "gun-grabbers". Suck it.

"Liberals" in the US are also against drugs, nukes, alcohol and freedom of information. They're every bit as bad when it comes to freedom. Suck it.

No, those are not liberals, they're socially conservative democrats, or social conservatives who are lying to you and/or themselves because they want to appear to be freedom loving.

Don't try to fucking group true social permissive types with a political category, it's insulting to my intelligence, and it's incorrect. If they're for any kind of social control, they're not socially liberal, it's as simple as that. There is no "but but but, they call themselves liberals", it doesn't work like that. If I call myself a doctor, it doesn't make me a fucking doctor. Going through the motions, getting my doctorate, and healing people makes a doctor.

Hence the quotes around the word "liberals" in my post. The term liberal has been perverted over time and modern US liberals are just leftist authoritarians. True old-school liberals might be called libertarians today, but around here that's a bad word because people don't understand libertarianism and how big government actually creates corporatism.

 

[Zebo]

Liberals don't mind guns. Go to democratic underground there is a whole forum there with advocacy. It's only a small minority - like fundis repubs have in their party - that push for it.

 

[theflyingpig]

Originally posted by: palehorse

Originally posted by: sandorski
There is no "Deterence". That is not the point.

What is the point?

Sandorski wants guns banned. That is Sandorski's point.