Bulldozer "delayed" until September 2011 (Rumor)

[RussianSensation]

According to Anand in one of his recent articles, BD is delayed until late July as AMD has to spin a B2 stepping.

It's worse than that. It appears it has been delayed at least until September, possibly even beyond that.

Xbitlabs has the story.

The fact that there's not even a hint being given of what's wrong certainly doesn't instill much confidence.

"The currently available B0 and B1 stepping Zambezi/Bulldozer processors can function at around 2.50GHz/3.50GHz (nominal/turbo) clock-speeds and at such frequency they cannot deliver performance AMD considers competitive, a person with knowledge of the situation said on Monday. As a consequence, AMD needs to tune the design of the processor and create B2 stepping of the chip with better clock-speed potential amid similar thermal design power (TDP), which will take several months to complete. Therefore, the Sunnyvale, California-based chip designer will release its highly-anticipated Bulldozer processors for desktops in September, not in June, as planned."

 

[Khato]

It's worse than that. It appears it has been delayed at least until September, possibly even beyond that.

Xbitlabs has the story.

The fact that there's not even a hint being given of what's wrong certainly doesn't instill much confidence.

"The currently available B0 and B1 stepping Zambezi/Bulldozer processors can function at around 2.50GHz/3.50GHz (nominal/turbo) clock-speeds and at such frequency they cannot deliver performance AMD considers competitive, a person with knowledge of the situation said on Monday. As a consequence, AMD needs to tune the design of the processor and create B2 stepping of the chip with better clock-speed potential amid similar thermal design power (TDP), which will take several months to complete. Therefore, the Sunnyvale, California-based chip designer will release its highly-anticipated Bulldozer processors for desktops in September, not in June, as planned."

I'll hide behind the fact that that story was posted after my comment

That said, while that explanation is within the realm of possibility, I don't expect that it's the entire story. If they had a speed path/timing issue on the B0 stepping that only required a metal layer change, then it would have been fixed on B1. The only exception being if they introduced and missed another issue in the process of that change, which, as we saw with the cougar point chipset glitch, can happen all too easily. Or I guess the change that they made could have not made enough of a difference, but it's doubtful... That's the problem with design issues affecting frequency - it's typically not very feasible to change the logic to something that meets timing using whatever bonus gates are available. Unless, of course, AMD has strayed from the industry norm for stepping labels and B1 -> B2 isn't just a metal layer change.

 

[Vesku]

I wouldn't treat this rumor as gospel, guess we'll know in a couple of weeks. It's definitely in the realm of possibility. They ended up not demoing BD at that last computer conference even though it was on the schedule in advance.

 

[OCGuy]

"The currently available B0 and B1 stepping Zambezi/Bulldozer processors can function at around 2.50GHz/3.50GHz (nominal/turbo) clock-speeds and at such frequency they cannot deliver performance AMD considers competitive, a person with knowledge of the situation said on Monday. As a consequence, AMD needs to tune the design of the processor and create B2 stepping of the chip with better clock-speed potential amid similar thermal design power (TDP), which will take several months to complete. Therefore, the Sunnyvale, California-based chip designer will release its highly-anticipated Bulldozer processors for desktops in September, not in June, as planned."

Wow...just.....wow!

 

[JSt0rm]

no matter what side you are on this isnt good. Consumer loses in this type of market.

 

[poohbear]

well that seals it, SB is the way to go this summer. Come august you'll have plethora of very mature, bios updated, Z-68 mobos or brand new bug infested & issue laden mobos for BD for $20 cheaper. The choice seems like a no brainer.

 

[poohbear]

I smell a dog coming up.

Perhaps they'll include a free copy of Duke Nukem Forever with every CPu sold?

lol it would be very fitting as it IS becoming the Duke Nukem Forever of the CPU world.

 

[Joseph F]

well that seals it, SB is the way to go this summer. Come august you'll have plethora of very mature, bios updated, Z-68 mobos or brand new bug infested & issue laden mobos for BD for $20 cheaper. The choice seems like a no brainer.

The Socket AM3+ motherboards that have already been released don't have any serious issues. What makes you think that the ones that are going to be released later will?

 

[Avalon]

Ugh, that sucks if true. I've been anticipating its launch for a long time now.

 

[formulav8]

What I kinda see interesting is AMD was to release on a B1 revision. The past couple cpu designs released has been retail quality at revision 02. For instance, the original Phenom1 was released on B2 silicon. Phenom2 was released on C2 silicon.

But AMD did release some cpu's on revision 01 silicon like the ddr2 based 90nm F1 and 65nm G1. But I could be reading these things wrong...

Anyways, while I don't like the delay I won't lose any sleep over it.

 

[exar333]

Now we know why AMD has not released B0/B1 samples for review, they would just be a dog and generate negative buzz. Better to keep working on it and get it right, even if it is late. Kind of reminds me of NV lately...

 

[Vesku]

Now we know why AMD has not released B0/B1 samples for review, they would just be a dog and generate negative buzz. Better to keep working on it and get it right, even if it is late. Kind of reminds me of NV lately...

I'm sure the memory of the TLB bug will keep them from releasing a "mostly" working revision. Not even a whiff of BD buzz at the start of Computex, seems like a delay is very possible. That or AMD is running an extremely tight PR ship ahead of E3.

 

[drizek]

Nevermind the memory of Cougarpoint

I'd love to believe that this is all reverse psychology on AMDs part, getting all of us to go out and buy Intel systems, only to put Bulldozer and all its amazingness out there just in time to be able to return our Z68 systems.

 

[Gigantopithecus]

Nevermind the memory of Cougarpoint

I'd love to believe that this is all reverse psychology on AMDs part, getting all of us to go out and buy Intel systems, only to put Bulldozer and all its amazingness out there just in time to be able to return our Z68 systems.

That made me chuckle. Unfortunately, that scenario seems unlikely. I'm pulling the trigger on a SB system later this week.

Fortunately for AMD, Zacate seems very successful, and it looks like Llano is on track and looks very promising as well. I hope that will see them through the difficulties arising from a BD debacle.

 

[nanaki333]

maybe it was delayed because it only achieved SB-level performance and they want to have it at IB-level performance but at SB pricing. it could very well be great performance, but they know it's capable of more and want to do this right.

with the AM3+ mobos coming out, AMD should make some sort of incentive. if you purchase an AM3+ mobo with an AM3 chip, have sort of like a trade-up or step-up program. trade in your old CPU + cash for a BD.

 

[sm625]

You guys remember these articles?

from 4/2003
http://www.anandtech.com/show/1098/4

and from 4/2004
http://www.anandtech.com/show/1308

It wasnt until april of 2004 that I had any interest in AMD's new chip because only then was it cheap enough to be within the realm of reason. (Under $200) But evenso I do remember that it took a loooong time for their new uA to finally be available for a reasonable price. I expect this to be the same, though much harder because they cant release a few chips at a high price if they cant beat intel.

 

[RussianSensation]

maybe it was delayed because it only achieved SB-level performance and they want to have it at IB-level performance but at SB pricing. it could very well be great performance, but they know it's capable of more and want to do this right.

I am not sure I buy this explanation. If BD is already as fast as SB today, surely AMD would have released it since IB won't be out until Q1 2012. Therefore, AMD could sell cheaper to produce 32nm BD cores and regain some profit margins. Since AMD motherboards tend to be cheaper, this would have made BD extremely attractive without having to achieve IB performance levels. Obviously this is just a rumor and not a confirmation, but it's more likely that BD isn't competitive with SB, hence the delay. This smells exactly like Phenom launch which I hope it isn't because that would be very unfortunate.

 

[nyker96]

this is sad, AMD PheII is at Q9xxx generation, it's about 2 generations behind Intel. Now with this delay that could possibly push the BD to end of 2011 or beginning of 2012 means It may have to go up against Ivy Bridge which is bad news for AMD.

 

[Inspire]

I'm glad I pulled the trigger on SB early instead of waiting for BD.

I figured if BD was really good, I would just have an excuse to build another rig The 2500K is very nice.

 

[formulav8]

IIRC IB isn't supposed to be much faster than SB right? So in the performance aspect, BD will still be up against SB like performance. Besides the shrink, it looks like the biggest change is their crappy graphics. I haven't done any major research or anything though. I don't remember....

 

[Schmide]

... is their crappy graphics...

Until Llano their crappy graphics are the fastest integrated graphics out there?

 

[nanaki333]

I am not sure I buy this explanation. If BD is already as fast as SB today, surely AMD would have released it since IB won't be out until Q1 2012. Therefore, AMD could sell cheaper to produce 32nm BD cores and regain some profit margins. Since AMD motherboards tend to be cheaper, this would have made BD extremely attractive without having to achieve IB performance levels. Obviously this is just a rumor and not a confirmation, but it's more likely that BD isn't competitive with SB, hence the delay. This smells exactly like Phenom launch which I hope it isn't because that would be very unfortunate.

i was trying to be as optimistic as possible. BullDozer Forever!

 

[formulav8]

Until Llano their crappy graphics are the fastest integrated graphics out there?

Oh yeah and they have the greatest features as well right? How are their drivers? Outside of the typical gaming titles is their performance consistant? The single channel fusion can already give their gfx a run for their money. Peak performance may not be all that important when you see all of the stuff Intels gfx is missing. So personally I still see their gfx as quite bad. Obviously with everything opinions vary. Always will be that way.

 

[Terzo]

So how official is the Bulldozer delay? I know Anand said we're looking at late July but others have said September and potentially retail availability as late as December. But I don't think AMD has said anything, have they?

Just above Llano we will have the long awaited Bulldozer CPU. AMD originally wanted to launch Bulldozer at Computex but performance issues with its B0 and B1 stepping chips pushed back the launch. Now we're looking at a late July launch with B2 silicon, but performance today is a big unknown. Apparently the performance of B1 stepping silicon doesn't look too good.

From the above it sounds pretty clear that Bulldozer will be delayed, but is that considered official? Anand doesn't quote an AMD representative or statement, but sounds pretty sure that we will not see Bulldozer in this month.

Is Bulldozer shipping in H1 2011 a fact, straight from AMD, or just something everyone has inferred? And if AMD has previously stated Bulldozer will ship in H1, will they have to make an announcement if the shipment is delayed, or will they stay silent on the matter?

More concisely, Bulldozer is supposed to ship within a month. If it is indeed delayed, how late could we expect to hear AMD make a statement confirming that?

 

[Phynaz]

From the above it sounds pretty clear that Bulldozer will be delayed, but is that considered official? Anand doesn't quote an AMD representative or statement

Anand is pretty widely read. If he made a statement like this that wasn't correct you can bet AMD would be contacting him quickly for him to issue a correction.