Breaking: Shooting at CT elementary school

[OverVolt]

Actually no, it's because of abortion actually. See: Freakonomics.

I meant it when I said no one knows why, lol. There is alot of controversy about it. Especially since its been on the uptick in a few locales. So they're trying to figure out what made it drop so they can keep it low. But yea, there are theories but no consensus.

 

[aldamon]

[Updated at 3:22 p.m. ET] It appears that another member of the alleged shooter's family is dead. A senior law enforcement official familiar with the investigation says a brother of the alleged shooter was found dead in a home searched in Hoboken, New Jersey. We already knew Ryan Lanza's mother was found dead in the elementary school.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

You guys have to decide what you are talking about. These low-probability mass killings, or the murder rates in aggregate.

The mass killings are usually due to psychological problems (I still bet his parents were divorced, its so common that they are raised by single mothers). Overall in the big picture areas like Chicago with alot of gun restrictions does really just lead to unarmed citizens and armed criminals, and a high crime rate.

Can't they just drive 5 minutes outside the city and get one? Have any true actual data that supports your side of the argument when it's a country wide ban? I'm patiently waiting for your response.

 

[Pr0d1gy]

Actually now they are saying the mother was at school and two other bodies have been found at her home.

Story seems to change every hour. So I am going to pretty rightfully assume the brother is the other reported shooter, and also assume he may or may not have shot anyone and may have even just been a hostage at that point given both his parents are reported dead. Innocent until proven guilty of course. Please check his fingers for residue just in case, though .

Resume pointless gun debate, now.

 

[corwin]

Pretty sure father was killed in hoboken and brother is in custody.

Hell, I'm confused then...it will be much later before the story is really known, too many different things being thrown around right now

 

[torpid]

Murder rates fell because the economy sucked? Would think it would go up but...

The economy improved dramatically from the start of the 90's to the end of the 90's. Therefore for murder rates to have fallen "during" the 90's to me means that it went down from the start of the 90's (bad economy) to the end of the 90's (much better economy).

 

[CVSiN]

Well I guess the mass murders are just collateral damage huh?

Yes exactly.. do you ban cars ( which are a far more dangerous tool) because people cant stop driving with under the influence?

nope.. you lock those people up and take away their rights for that tool.

Do you punish both of your children when 1 of them messes up?

nope.. you punish the culprit.
This country was BUILT and DEFENDED on this right.
Texas itself which you are from if it were not for private citizens with guns would be speaking Spanish and not part of the USA. those were not 100% soldiers.. they were citizens serving as the Militia aiding the armies.
Militia's have served in every single wars during the founding of this country and states.
without the right to bear arms things would have been different.

 

[TallBill]

All the gun shops should be closed all the gun shows cancelled and all the houses searched and guns sized. Law abiding citizens should have a grace period of a couple of months where they have time to turn their guns in after that mandatory prison sentences of 10 years for each gun found.
After that we should start thinking about knifes and other potential weapons. This is the straw that broke the camels back.

Your plan would get a lot of good people killed.

 

[sixone]

Governor is giving press conference now, hopefully more details incoming.

1st new tidbit: Shooter is dead as is his roommate.

Not sure what that means. Did he kill his roommate or was the roommate involved?

The governor did not call the dead person a "roommate". It is the "person with whom the shooter lived".

Guessing one of his parents, but that's only a guess.

 

[rcpratt]

Police just just said 20 dead students, 6 adults at the school (unclear if that included the killer), and then I guess whoever else he killed at other scenes.

 

[sixone]

Yes exactly.. do you ban cars ( which are a far more dangerous tool) because people cant stop driving with under the influence?

nope.. you lock those people up and take away their rights for that tool.

Do you punish both of your children when 1 of them messes up?

nope.. you punish the culprit.
This country was BUILT and DEFENDED on this right.
Texas itself which you are from if it were not for private citizens with guns would be speaking Spanish and not part of the USA. those were not 100% soldiers.. they were citizens serving as the Militia aiding the armies.
Militia's have served in every single wars during the founding of this country and states.
without the right to bear arms things would have been different.

Well said. :thumbsup:

 

[SphinxnihpS]

Holy shit. I just read the news again. Last time I checked this was two dead adults. I'm just sick to my stomach now.

 

[eits]

take away the guns and people will turn to other evil, sick ways to kill people, but nothing as easy as firing off 100+ bullets into the walls of a school and bodies of children and teachers.

i'm not saying take away guns, but control them. it would be hard to imagine shootings happening as frequently when they don't feel as powerful because they cannot legally buy nor can they illegally afford an assault rifle. bolt action rifles and revolvers wouldn't cause nearly the devastation, yet people will still be able to protect themselves and hunt/put food on the table.

as for the case for better gun control:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ushomicidesbyweapon.svg

the brady bill went into effect in november of 1993. you can see the precipitous decline of gun violence that happened due to that bit of gun regulation.

will gun control stop gun violence? no. people are violent and will kill with whatever they can. guns are made specifically to entice people to fire them... there's a thrill people get when shooting guns, which is why people (myself included) love to shoot. that's why there are gun enthusiasts. however, people won't feel powerful enough to go shoot up a mall or a school or a workplace if they are walking around with a ruger bolt action rifle or a smith & wesson revolver as opposed to a mac-10 or an ar-15 or even a glock. muskets only! lol

seriously, though, something you learn from video games is that the longer your reload time is, the higher your probability of getting caught/killed/bitten/trapped becomes. when the threat of being caught is high or the "exhilaration" of taking out scores of people is low, the "glamour" for someone who would be likely to follow through with a shooting will decrease. when we make it harder for someone or at least make it less desirable for someone to pull off a shooting while still allowing people to have the right to protect themselves and their property and hunt for food, that's the answer.

 

[iamwiz82]

They are confirming it was in one area of the building. 27 dead including the shooter at the school, plus anyone else (brother, father, etc).

 

[rcpratt]

Seems pretty obvious that he, at least, massacred his mother's entire classroom.

 

[iamwiz82]

And one additional dead adult at a secondary scene.

 

[corwin]

the brady bill went into effect in november of 1993. you can see the precipitous decline of gun violence that happened due to that bit of gun regulation.

That's a joke right? Cause that little law expired a long ass time ago and the decline is still going...seems it didn't really have any effect at all as has been admitted by a shit ton of people

 

[StinkyPinky]

People are now saying schools need armed cops on campus

They just don't get it do they? Next they'll be saying each class room needs an AK-47.

 

[corwin]

Seems pretty obvious that he, at least, massacred his mother's entire classroom.

Freud would have a field day analyzing this guy...he's a nut and his parents probably knew it

 

[rcpratt]

And one additional dead adult at a secondary scene.

And possibly/probably additional scenes in Hoboken.

 

[preslove]

These killings are happening more and more often. If that continues, I could see a real change in the way we interpret the 2nd amendment.

 

[GagHalfrunt]

Armed police officers or the like would be possibly reasonable. I don't think principals and teachers should be carrying sidearms all day in an elementary school where they are constantly interacting with children. Call me crazy.

If a psycho wanted to kill one specific teacher and as many kids as convenient and expected to be killed in the process there's pretty much no reasonable solution short of ringing the school with SWAT teams and having armed officers in every classroom. There are recess and gym classes outdoors, deliveries, hell, even windows. There's a grammar school in my neighborhood, maybe 2 blocks from my house. It has at least 4 different entrances and every first floor classroom has windows low enough to see in. Even with a cop and metal detector at every entry point a REALLY determined gunman could still cause a lot of carnage pretty quickly even without stepping foot inside the school.

And even if you completely control schools, bulletproof glass, fingerprints for getting on the grounds, armed patrols, a 1:1 guard to student ratio, so what? All you would succeed in doing would be to move the potential mass murder to a new location. A guy that wanted to kill 20 kids could do it at a movie matinee, a gymboree class, a mall, etc etc etc. There's an instant kneejerk reaction to incidents like this where everyone asks "what do we need to do to stop this from happening again?" because nobody wants to face the painful truth. We CAN'T stop it from happening again. Even if we make it impossible for another gunman to do it EXACTLY like this there will still 10,000 other ways and places to do it.

 

[eits]

Yes exactly.. do you ban cars ( which are a far more dangerous tool) because people cant stop driving with under the influence?

nope.. you lock those people up and take away their rights for that tool.

Do you punish both of your children when 1 of them messes up?

nope.. you punish the culprit.
This country was BUILT and DEFENDED on this right.
Texas itself which you are from if it were not for private citizens with guns would be speaking Spanish and not part of the USA. those were not 100% soldiers.. they were citizens serving as the Militia aiding the armies.
Militia's have served in every single wars during the founding of this country and states.
without the right to bear arms things would have been different.

seriously? you're trying to equate something that is designed to seduce people to get from point a to point b efficiently to a weapon that's designed to seduce people to pull the trigger and kill?

how many people here brag about their ugly guns? no one. they brag about attractive-looking guns, just like they brag about their attractive-looking cars. there's a seduction involved in the engineering and marketing of these products... the difference is their purpose. one is to drive. the other is to kill.

apples and oranges.

 

[OILFIELDTRASH]

Yes exactly.. do you ban cars ( which are a far more dangerous tool) because people cant stop driving with under the influence?

nope.. you lock those people up and take away their rights for that tool.

Do you punish both of your children when 1 of them messes up?

nope.. you punish the culprit.
This country was BUILT and DEFENDED on this right.
Texas itself which you are from if it were not for private citizens with guns would be speaking Spanish and not part of the USA. those were not 100% soldiers.. they were citizens serving as the Militia aiding the armies.
Militia's have served in every single wars during the founding of this country and states.
without the right to bear arms things would have been different.

Spare me the stars and bars speech. Today wars are won with nuclear weapons and 100million dollar jets. You and your pea shooter couldn't even piss off a war machine.
Btw the country falls apart without the automobile.

 

[iamwiz82]

And possibly/probably additional scenes in Hoboken.

I think that is what the sheriff was referencing as the secondary scene.