Boehner proposes leaving 52 Million Americans without insurance.

[halik]

The simple fact of the matter is that Obamacare essentially outlaws plans with a low premium and high deductible. This should scare anyone who is young shitless. Now you will not be able to get a plan that only covers what you need (a la cart), rather everyone is now forced to buy a plan that includes many things free, without a copay. Somehow the "progressives" believe by mandating more services to be provided for free after your premiums are paid will bring down costs.....right....

Get a 2nd job.

Catastrophic coverage plans were available, yet people still chose to go w/o it. Your solution only really works if hospitals can reject patients a la Africa.

 

[blackangst1]

The fact that Obama's bill, and the GOP's proposals do NOTHING to address the COST of medical care makes all these arguments moot. Even after bankruptcy reforms, in 2009 medical bankruptcies accounted for 60% (give or take) for all bankrupticies in 2009, and of those 80% of the people had medical insurance (lots of articles confirming this). Before Obamacare passed, 85% of Americans were insured. Im not seeing where Boehner's or the GOP's plan will make anything worse, but Im also not seeing where the Dem's plan or Obamacare is going to improve things for people.

I had a conversation with my primary care doc last week, and told him due to changes in my insurance next year Im going to have to get creative with how I plan my visits. Ive usually gone for bloodwork/checkup every 3-4 months, and starting next year my cost will increase approx 20-25%, as well as raising my deductable. Now, thats not Obama's fault per se, but it is what it is. Here's another example. When my doc orders blood work my cost is about $200; however, you dont need a doc's order to order bloodwork. You can order it yourself, go to a lab, get it all done for about $75 out of pocket with no insurance. My doc said I can just do that and give him the results.

The bottom line is, neither the Dems nor the GOP are doing ANYTHING to address the COST of care, which is the biggest issue of all.

IMHO.

 

[umbrella39]

Fuck you and anyone who shows up at the ER without insurance then.

You OK with that Karl? Seriously... do we the people have you on board with this plan?

Hello spidey... is this thing on? We already have armed off duty police and metal detectors on the doors...

 

[sactoking]

Administrative costs are too high. What can be done to bring those down?

Based on what? Average health insurer admin costs are 15-20%. Compare that to life insurers: average admin costs are 12-14%. Compare that to P&C insurers: average admin costs are 23-30%. Health insurer costs are in line with life insurer costs and much lower than P&C costs.

Compare the industry's costs to other industries. Microsoft (a software company) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 6.4%, 6.3%, and 8.5%. Amazon (an e-tailer) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 1.3%, 1.5%, and 1.6%. Ford (an auto manufacturer) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 11.2%, 14.8%, and 12.4%. Bank of America (a financial company) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 55.8%, 57%, and 56.1%.

Health insurer industry costs are much higher than a low-overhead "pass through" company, higher than a "light manufacturer", similar to a "heavy manufacturer", and much lower than a financier.

 

[BoberFett]

In USA we refuse to address cost side . Basically so Phizer CEO can make 120 million. I've never heard of buying in bulk and not negotiating like Medicare part D. Essentially we give them monopoly power and allow them to charge whatever they want. The other countries where it costs 2-3x less (an happen to insure everyone) dont play that game they say if you want monopoly power we expect reasonable prices in return. And yes Insurance tacks on 20% to HC which they don't have.

Same goes for Drs too BTW - you can't practice w/o a license, a DEA # very closed cartel no free market about it. Same for Insurance Companies, congress must sanctify you. Monopolies.

Is it reasonable for consumer to ask for price protection against monopolies?

Drugs are a different issue. The US is financing the rest of the world's sweet deals. The rest of the world and their legislated pricing can pay cost + a small profit because we here in the US are picking up the cost of the R&D through our hugely inflated prices.

 

[zsdersw]

Based on what? Average health insurer admin costs are 15-20%. Compare that to life insurers: average admin costs are 12-14%. Compare that to P&C insurers: average admin costs are 23-30%. Health insurer costs are in line with life insurer costs and much lower than P&C costs.

.. but not lower than Medicare's.

Medicare isn't the answer, as I'm quite sure private insurance admin costs can be lowered through things like tort reform, inter-state availability, etc., but let's not make the claim that private insurance's admin costs are "just fine" and there's nothing about them that can be cut/reduced.

Compare the industry's costs to other industries. Microsoft (a software company) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 6.4%, 6.3%, and 8.5%. Amazon (an e-tailer) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 1.3%, 1.5%, and 1.6%. Ford (an auto manufacturer) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 11.2%, 14.8%, and 12.4%. Bank of America (a financial company) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 55.8%, 57%, and 56.1%.

Health insurer industry costs are much higher than a low-overhead "pass through" company, higher than a "light manufacturer", similar to a "heavy manufacturer", and much lower than a financier.

Useless comparisons, for the most part. The markets and competitive landscapes are different than the insurance industry in general and health insurance in particular.

 

[BoberFett]

Administrative costs are too high. What can be done to bring those down?

You think government run services would be more efficient? You must be new to the US.

 

[potluv]

You think government run services would be more efficient? You must be new to the US.

The government seems to know how to run the military just fine. Maybe thats the problem? Too much focus on running the military instead of the country?

 

[zsdersw]

You think government run services would be more efficient?

Where'd you get that idea?

 

[nobodyknows]

Want health insurance? Then pay for it. The people have spoken, shut the fuck up communists, we don't want what you're selling. This. Is. America!!!!

/thread

I fucking told you we were coming after people that don't work or pay taxes. We're here. We are taking the country back. Fuck Obama and anybody that believes his agenda.

LOL@U Keep up the good work and we'll see how the next election goes down.

 

[ShawnD1]

Get a 2nd job.

Yeah, Americans are such idiots. At something like 17% U6 unemployment and underemployment, clearly those 1 in 6 people are all just stupid fucks. There are lots of jobs to go around.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

The government seems to know how to run the military just fine. Maybe thats the problem? Too much focus on running the military instead of the country?

Running a military is simplicity itself compared to health care. Politicians have shown time and again that it's beyond their comprehension. Ok, not everyone knows the subject. You defer to those who do. Nope not a chance. So the clueless lead the blind to reform that which is not understood. That's going to turn out well.

 

[nobodyknows]

The bottom line is, neither the Dems nor the GOP are doing ANYTHING to address the COST of care, which is the biggest issue of all.

Now ask yourself why that is?

 

[potluv]

Running a military is simplicity itself compared to health care. Politicians have shown time and again that it's beyond their comprehension. Ok, not everyone knows the subject. You defer to those who do. Nope not a chance. So the clueless lead the blind to reform that which is not understood. That's going to turn out well.

So you're saying health care shouldn't be complicated as it is presently? Yeah taking health insurance companies out of the mix would make health care in the USA more simplistic and easier to manage by an entity like the government, since they do manage health care for military personnel.

 

[Suspicious-Teach8788]

Based on what? Average health insurer admin costs are 15-20%. Compare that to life insurers: average admin costs are 12-14%. Compare that to P&C insurers: average admin costs are 23-30%. Health insurer costs are in line with life insurer costs and much lower than P&C costs.

Compare the industry's costs to other industries. Microsoft (a software company) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 6.4%, 6.3%, and 8.5%. Amazon (an e-tailer) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 1.3%, 1.5%, and 1.6%. Ford (an auto manufacturer) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 11.2%, 14.8%, and 12.4%. Bank of America (a financial company) has 3 year trailing admin costs of 55.8%, 57%, and 56.1%.

Health insurer industry costs are much higher than a low-overhead "pass through" company, higher than a "light manufacturer", similar to a "heavy manufacturer", and much lower than a financier.

Thank you! Of course people will always cite Medicare's 2% administrative costs or whatever, but this 2% fails to account for a lot of costs that health insurance companies deal with, so the 2% is in reality much higher...

 

[nobodyknows]

Incidentally when i first got it it was around 78/mo in '07 (grad school) and climbed to 95/mo in the two years i had it.

There is the problem in a nutshell. The "healthcare" industry just doesn't care about the people it serves, only about their own bottom lines.

 

[extra]

When did this board get over-run with rightwing nutjobs?

 

[Nebor]

The government seems to know how to run the military just fine. Maybe thats the problem? Too much focus on running the military instead of the country?

Bahahahahaha. Hahahahaha. No, seriously, what are you smoking? Have you ever BEEN in the military? It's institutionalized inefficiency at it's best. $250 crutches? How about a $3000 paper shredder? It won't even shred CDs. Only paper.

 

[halik]

There is the problem in a nutshell. The "healthcare" industry just doesn't care about the people it serves, only about their own bottom lines.

Is that supposed to be a surprise? It's a business - they provide service and expect to be compensated.

Do you work for free?

 

[ShawnD1]

I had a conversation with my primary care doc last week, and told him due to changes in my insurance next year Im going to have to get creative with how I plan my visits. Ive usually gone for bloodwork/checkup every 3-4 months, and starting next year my cost will increase approx 20-25%, as well as raising my deductable. Now, thats not Obama's fault per se, but it is what it is. Here's another example. When my doc orders blood work my cost is about $200; however, you dont need a doc's order to order bloodwork. You can order it yourself, go to a lab, get it all done for about $75 out of pocket with no insurance. My doc said I can just do that and give him the results.

For starters, wtf man. You better have a damn good reason why you need blood tests every few months. Are you a porn star or something?

Also, I seriously doubt $75 is what it costs to do blood work unless you're getting the most basic test imaginable. My first profession was chemistry, and I was an analytical chemist in a lab. Lab work is extremely expensive. I would estimate a minimum of about $50 for every single test marked on the blood test sheet. Check your T4 levels? That'll be $50. Check your hemogoblins? $50. HDL and LDL cholesterol? $50 each. A quick google search says a thyroid test is about $60.



When people estimate how much lawsuits cost the medical industry, what is their methodology? When every duck with a quack tries suing for $10,000 and some of the more serious ones are in the millions, I can't help but think that has a significant cost. For certain kinds of doctor, the yearly cost of malpractice insurance is up in the 100k range for each doctor.

 

[Hayabusa Rider]

So you're saying health care shouldn't be complicated as it is presently? Yeah taking health insurance companies out of the mix would make health care in the USA more simplistic and easier to manage by an entity like the government, since they do manage health care for military personnel.

A couple questions.

What is health care and how long have you been dealing with government agencies in providing health care?

 

[potluv]

Bahahahahaha. Hahahahaha. No, seriously, what are you smoking? Have you ever BEEN in the military? It's institutionalized inefficiency at it's best. $250 crutches? How about a $3000 paper shredder? It won't even shred CDs. Only paper.

Blame the inside contractor deals, corrupt politics. Senator awards contracts to their brother-in-law who gouges the fuck out of the government, the American way.

 

[potluv]

A couple questions.

What is health care and how long have you been dealing with government agencies in providing health care?

I have a question for you to answer first before I make any decisions to answer yours... why are you trying to derail the topic into what I know about health care?

 

[zsdersw]

Thank you! Of course people will always cite Medicare's 2% administrative costs or whatever, but this 2% fails to account for a lot of costs that health insurance companies deal with, so the 2% is in reality much higher...

It's more than 2% but it's not as high as private insurance.

... But that's not really the point. I asked what could be done to reduce private health insurer's administrative costs. The gist of what he posted is that their administrative costs are ok; that there's not much that can be done.

Bullsh!t, I say. Inter-state competition, tort reform, and other efficiencies can bring those costs down.

 

[blackangst1]

For starters, wtf man. You better have a damn good reason why you need blood tests every few months. Are you a porn star or something?

Is a type 1 diabetic with hypothyroidism a good enough reason for you?