Being assertive when new co-worker says "All hunters are murderers"

[darthsidious]

Originally posted by: ric1287

Originally posted by: darthsidious

Originally posted by: ric1287
what i hate, is that you dont see meat rallies. Normal people dont throw steaks at veggie restaurant windows, they dont try and push meat on anyone. Yet the hippy veggie dorks feel the need to "spread the word".

shut up. nobody cares.

BS on that. I'm vegetarian, and I can't count the number of times people have tried to push me to eat meat. Once, people in my dorm collected $150 and a guy offered to shave half his head off. In addition to this, I'm constantly treated to stream of "Oh, what's that crap/grass you're eating/ You're a goddamm pussy vegetarian" type comments. Most of the time I ignore them, as these people are mostly my friends. And yet I've never tried to convert someone to vegetarianism. So, yeah, meat eaters definately push meat onto vegetarians. It's like they feel I'm deprived of a huge part of life, and they'd like to force it on me.

i meant in an organized way. There are no meat clubs or rallies. Individuals maybe, but ive never seen a "meat club" on campus.

Just to prove you wrong, here's a club from my school called MIT Beef. You get the idea

But seriously, I get the point; there is no "PETA" like organization for meat eaters. I put it down to meat eaters being the majority of people - vs the minority of radical vegetarians who feel the need to form a minority advocacy group.

 

[Juno]

people hunt animals to eat.
vegetarians cut plants to eat.

both are murderers, what is the difference?

 

[alrocky]

Originally posted by: KarenMarie
Humans were made to be vegetarians. It was not until they started eating meat that their brains progressed and they advanced to the thinking, reasoning, inventing species that they now are.

That almost sounds like you're calling vegetarians stupid.

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Orginally posted by: JEDI So what's the assertive thing to say?

See above. Or: Wouldn't that mean all the carnivores in nature are murders too?

---

There are a number of popular myths about vegetarianism that have no scientific basis in fact. One of these myths is that man is naturally a vegetarian because our bodies resemble plant eaters, not carnivores. In fact we are omnivores, capable of either eating meat or plant foods. The following addresses the unscientific theory of man being only a plant eater.

 

[jagec]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
murder is pre-meditated killing, what is wrong about his definition?

People don't hunt Soylent Green, that sh!t comes pre-packaged.

 

[JEDI]

Originally posted by: MagicConch
I think you were right re: trying to change the conversation. That dude is completely committed to that idea probably, there is nothing you can say that will have any effect on him. Don't take the bait.

but if u wanted to be assertive and disagree with him w/o attacking him for being a moron, what would you say?

 

[ForumMaster]

Originally posted by: Aimster
He is correct.

That's right what you gonna do about it?
People who eat meat are horrible people as well.

The same goes for milk drinkers.

All of you are going to the hell

well look who's talking...and yes i detect the sarcasm

humans are omnivores. we need to eat both meat and vegetables. our bodies need certain amino acids that we can only get from meat. not eating meat is unhealthy.

besides, you could easily get him stuck in a corner with what Platypus said. after all, you're killing the plant when you eat it. so how is that not murder?

 

[imported_Mike]

Originally posted by: mugs
All you have to say is "for every animal you DON'T eat, I eat three."

LMAO

 

[torpid]

Originally posted by: ForumMaster

Originally posted by: Aimster
He is correct.

That's right what you gonna do about it?
People who eat meat are horrible people as well.

The same goes for milk drinkers.

All of you are going to the hell

well look who's talking...and yes i detect the sarcasm

humans are omnivores. we need to eat both meat and vegetables. our bodies need certain amino acids that we can only get from meat. not eating meat is unhealthy.

besides, you could easily get him stuck in a corner with what Platypus said. after all, you're killing the plant when you eat it. so how is that not murder?

That is why we have science. Our bodies need nutrients that in the wild come from meat maybe. But we are an advanced civilization capable of reproducing these nutrients without meat through various other foods and careful formulations / recipes.

Plants do not feel pain as far as we know... they do not have feelings or a central nervous system. The distinction is not whether it is a living organism, but whether it is a sentient one.

I love meat products and all, but some of these counter arguments are off if you ask me.

I support hunting because it is far more humane than most farms that raise animals to turn into meat. The animals being hunted are living in a natural habitat and are not pumped full of rBGH or the like. So the meat could in theory be healthier as well. It is also a far more "natural" way of things to have to hunt your own prey.

 

[slsmnaz]

I would point him to the antelope head on my wall for proof that I disagreed.

 

[Sukhoi]

Do what I did in my college dorm. Order an Omaha Steaks catalog for the guy. Conveniently have the roommate get the mail, realize the purpose of the catalog, and tape pictures of steaks and burgers all over the room.

 

[sixone]

Originally posted by: JeffreyLebowski
If god didn't want us to eat animals he wouldn't have made them out of meat. He would of made them out of poop.

ROFL

 

[Zysoclaplem]

All hunters who kill living things are in essence murderers. I don't agree with killing as a sport but killing to stay alive is the way of nature.

 

[Aikouka]

Tell him that you're a druid and that cabbage he partook in earlier did not appreciate it much.

 

[torpid]

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem
All hunters who kill living things are in essence murderers. I don't agree with killing as a sport but killing to stay alive is the way of nature.

Not really. Killing things unnecessarily or for the thrill of it is also the way of nature. A predator won't pass up easy prey generally, regardless of whether it is satiated.

If you eat meat either you can hunt the prey like you would in nature, or you can sit on your couch and watch tv while someone else butchers an animal for you. For some reason the former sounds more ethical to me.

 

[Zysoclaplem]

Originally posted by: torpid

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem
All hunters who kill living things are in essence murderers. I don't agree with killing as a sport but killing to stay alive is the way of nature.

Not really. Killing things unnecessarily or for the thrill of it is also the way of nature. A predator won't pass up easy prey generally, regardless of whether it is satiated.

If you eat meat either you can hunt the prey like you would in nature, or you can sit on your couch and watch tv while someone else butchers an animal for you. For some reason the former sounds more ethical to me.

I have never heard of animals killing for fun aka sport. That is the way of humans. Animals kill for food and to protect themselves, their babies, and their pack or whatever they travel in.
Once again I have never heard of an animal killing for fun.

 

[vi edit]

I like vegetarians. They are great on a cheesburger.

 

[BUTCH1]

I believe there is room for all god's creatures.....right next to the mashed potatoes!!!!!!!!!

 

[JulesMaximus]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Well, since 3 hours has brought no decent factual responses...here goes. Ask him if he prefers that a large portion of the deer population in this country die from disease and starvation, because that's what will happen if the is no hunting allowed. Deer largely have no natural predators on this continent anymore and if their population is left unchecked they will die, suffering, in huge numbers of disease and starvation.

Hunting is a necessary part of conservation and wildlife management and your co-worker is an ill informed idiot. Besides, the fees hunters pay for licensing and deer tags every year more than pay for the agencies that enforce and manage the wildlife in this country and the meat is used to feed people ranging from the poor to those who like to eat natural food. It's a win win situation...well, except for those who've watched Bambie too many times.

So, nobody wants a decent answer then?

 

[Gibsons]

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem

Originally posted by: torpid

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem
All hunters who kill living things are in essence murderers. I don't agree with killing as a sport but killing to stay alive is the way of nature.

Not really. Killing things unnecessarily or for the thrill of it is also the way of nature. A predator won't pass up easy prey generally, regardless of whether it is satiated.

If you eat meat either you can hunt the prey like you would in nature, or you can sit on your couch and watch tv while someone else butchers an animal for you. For some reason the former sounds more ethical to me.

I have never heard of animals killing for fun aka sport. That is the way of humans. Animals kill for food and to protect themselves, their babies, and their pack or whatever they travel in.
Once again I have never heard of an animal killing for fun.

It happens. Leopard seals, cats...

 

[Zysoclaplem]

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Well, since 3 hours has brought no decent factual responses...here goes. Ask him if he prefers that a large portion of the deer population in this country die from disease and starvation, because that's what will happen if the is no hunting allowed. Deer largely have no natural predators on this continent anymore and if their population is left unchecked they will die, suffering, in huge numbers of disease and starvation.

Hunting is a necessary part of conservation and wildlife management and your co-worker is an ill informed idiot. Besides, the fees hunters pay for licensing and deer tags every year more than pay for the agencies that enforce and manage the wildlife in this country and the meat is used to feed people ranging from the poor to those who like to eat natural food. It's a win win situation...well, except for those who've watched Bambie too many times.

So, nobody wants a decent answer then?

What is a deer's natural predator?

 

[slsmnaz]

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Well, since 3 hours has brought no decent factual responses...here goes. Ask him if he prefers that a large portion of the deer population in this country die from disease and starvation, because that's what will happen if the is no hunting allowed. Deer largely have no natural predators on this continent anymore and if their population is left unchecked they will die, suffering, in huge numbers of disease and starvation.

Hunting is a necessary part of conservation and wildlife management and your co-worker is an ill informed idiot. Besides, the fees hunters pay for licensing and deer tags every year more than pay for the agencies that enforce and manage the wildlife in this country and the meat is used to feed people ranging from the poor to those who like to eat natural food. It's a win win situation...well, except for those who've watched Bambie too many times.

So, nobody wants a decent answer then?

What is a deer's natural predator?

Me

In actuality there are very few animals that hunt them. Coyotes are about the only thing I regularly see chasing them.

 

[DougK62]

If it was a co-worker and we were at work I wouldn't do much. I'd probably just roll my eyes in an obvious manner and walk away.

 

[halik]

Originally posted by: Pepsi90919
murder is pre-meditated killing, what is wrong about his definition?

so lions, eagles and all other carnivores are murderers ?

 

[Zysoclaplem]

Originally posted by: Gibsons

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem

Originally posted by: torpid

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem
All hunters who kill living things are in essence murderers. I don't agree with killing as a sport but killing to stay alive is the way of nature.

Not really. Killing things unnecessarily or for the thrill of it is also the way of nature. A predator won't pass up easy prey generally, regardless of whether it is satiated.

If you eat meat either you can hunt the prey like you would in nature, or you can sit on your couch and watch tv while someone else butchers an animal for you. For some reason the former sounds more ethical to me.

I have never heard of animals killing for fun aka sport. That is the way of humans. Animals kill for food and to protect themselves, their babies, and their pack or whatever they travel in.
Once again I have never heard of an animal killing for fun.

It happens. Leopard seals, cats...

Curiosity does not equal intent. We know exactly what we are doing when we put a bullet or arrow anything else through a living creature. We are ending it's life. And we know exactly what we do when we put it's head on a wall like some trophy. If you want to hunt, hunt.
If it thrills you to kill things, fine. Just don't waste the life you just ended. It was not put there to provide you with a days worth of entertainment.

 

[Zysoclaplem]

Originally posted by: slsmnaz

Originally posted by: Zysoclaplem

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus

Originally posted by: JulesMaximus
Well, since 3 hours has brought no decent factual responses...here goes. Ask him if he prefers that a large portion of the deer population in this country die from disease and starvation, because that's what will happen if the is no hunting allowed. Deer largely have no natural predators on this continent anymore and if their population is left unchecked they will die, suffering, in huge numbers of disease and starvation.

Hunting is a necessary part of conservation and wildlife management and your co-worker is an ill informed idiot. Besides, the fees hunters pay for licensing and deer tags every year more than pay for the agencies that enforce and manage the wildlife in this country and the meat is used to feed people ranging from the poor to those who like to eat natural food. It's a win win situation...well, except for those who've watched Bambie too many times.

So, nobody wants a decent answer then?

What is a deer's natural predator?

Me

In actuality there are very few animals that hunt them. Coyotes are about the only thing I regularly see chasing them.

Where are all the coyotes? Why is the deer population out of control? Why did this come about. Nature has it's checks and balances and would keep the population in control, unless something interfered.