ATI once again beat by Nvidia.. now two generations behind!

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
All of your responses were "cherry picked" from each of Rollo's links. I Added some more from each site to put things into context. You cant just take a few words from a few sentences to prove any point. I don't know why you did that. Nobody should take your responses here in this post seriously and even ignore my "fixed for ya's" and go read what is actually behind each link Rollo posted. Funny you say to read before you post, because when people click those links to actually read the articles and the reviewers comments on noise, they will see how you sort of "left stuff out"

rofl ... you both are now really stretchin it. One of you (Rollo) has a really weak argument here because he was the one who said the loudness wasnt a factor while gaming. (in defense of 5800U) Double standards ..

You complained about the "whine". None of those prove your case.

And I'm still waiting for those countless (non-existant) reviews which highlighted this whine. :laugh:

<typo>

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

only in your mind

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo
rofl ... you both are now really stretchin it. One of you (Rollo) has a really weak argument here because he was the one who said the loudness wasnt a factor while gaming. (in defense of 5800U) Double standards ..

You complained about the "whine". None of those prove your case.

And I'm still waiting for those countless (non-existant) reviews which highlighted this whine. :laugh:

<typo>

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

Did I say "wrrrr" sound isnt significant over a "shhhhhh" ? Please dont put words in my mouth. Thanks.

Point is the same reviewer went on to say that both cards arent loud and its basically a non-issue. What should I conclude? :laugh:

The stretching part comes where Rollo goes off on a tangent that he himself contested once to be a moot point. ("You cant hear it while gaming"). In your case, you are not backing up your statement, in case you forgot here you go ...

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Corporate Thug
what about Rollos comments quote about the 5800U i posted? double standard or no?

Well, he said the 5800U was totally silent in 2D, the fan does not spin at all. In 3D, it's very noticeable. But he did not say it had a high pitched whine like the XT definately has.
Like I said before, I can handle air noise, but high pitched whine I might not be able to.

Now you are just getting argumentative.

You and Rollo have not even owned the X1800 XT to assert us that it has a whine which is even worse than that of the dustbusters'. If in reality it was anything close to as you both are suggesting, we would have already noise, sound comparisions and what not. Dont you think?

I haven't suggested it. Countless review sites have! I am merely repeating. Stating the X1800XT has a high pitched whine. So, are they all wrong? Tell me what you think.

Wonder where all those reviews suddenly vanished ... ATI must have wiped them off from the face of interweb ?

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

only in your mind

Appopin, I must say you have undergone the most unbelivable transformation over the last few months. You went from level headed, neutral and objective and did a 180. So what happened? Thought it was time for a change in your life to spice it up a bit? What gives? My God, you didn't even use a smiley in this post. Highly unusal. Feeling alright? :beer:

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo
rofl ... you both are now really stretchin it. One of you (Rollo) has a really weak argument here because he was the one who said the loudness wasnt a factor while gaming. (in defense of 5800U) Double standards ..

You complained about the "whine". None of those prove your case.

And I'm still waiting for those countless (non-existant) reviews which highlighted this whine. :laugh:

<typo>

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

Did I say "wrrrr" sound isnt significant over a "shhhhhh" ? Please dont put words in my mouth. Thanks.

Point is the same reviewer went on to say that both cards arent loud and its basically a non-issue. What should I conclude? :laugh:

The stretching part comes where Rollo goes off on a tangent that he himself contested once to be a moot point. ("You cant hear it while gaming"). In your case, you are not backing up your statement, in case you forgot here you go ...

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: crazydingo

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Corporate Thug
what about Rollos comments quote about the 5800U i posted? double standard or no?

Well, he said the 5800U was totally silent in 2D, the fan does not spin at all. In 3D, it's very noticeable. But he did not say it had a high pitched whine like the XT definately has.
Like I said before, I can handle air noise, but high pitched whine I might not be able to.

Now you are just getting argumentative.

You and Rollo have not even owned the X1800 XT to assert us that it has a whine which is even worse than that of the dustbusters'. If in reality it was anything close to as you both are suggesting, we would have already noise, sound comparisions and what not. Dont you think?

I haven't suggested it. Countless review sites have! I am merely repeating. Stating the X1800XT has a high pitched whine. So, are they all wrong? Tell me what you think.

Wonder where all those reviews suddenly vanished ... ATI must have wiped them off from the face of interweb ?

Every review site with the exception of B3D said the X1800XT was louder. Whether or not they said it whined may have been an overspeculation on my part after reading a few that said it. Including the wrrrrr comment. However, none of this justifies your cherry picking comments. How about commenting on that? While we wait for Mr. Kubicki.

 

[crazydingo]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Every review site with the exception of B3D said the X1800XT was louder. Whether or not they said it whined may have been an overspeculation on my part after reading a few that said it. Including the wrrrrr comment. However, none of this justifies your cherry picking comments. How about commenting on that? While we wait for Mr. Kubicki.

I cherry picked those comments (in same cases conclusions) because they were irrelevant to my argument with you (& Rollo).

And I'm still waiting for those countless (non-existant) reviews that mention this whine. :laugh: You not providing them is quite telling, isnt it?

<edit>

Going off now. Enjoy your weekend guys, dont waste it here. See you in this topic on Monday.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

only in your mind

Appopin, I must say you have undergone the most unbelivable transformation over the last few months. You went from level headed, neutral and objective and did a 180. So what happened? Thought it was time for a change in your life to spice it up a bit? What gives? My God, you didn't even use a smiley in this post. Highly unusal. Feeling alright? :beer:

you [and much of this forum] became [even more rabid] nVidia fanboys . . .

i simply became "louder" to provide the balance and objectivity you now lack.

and it's "apoppin"
[small 'a' . . . the 'double p' is after the 'o' . . . like a' poppin' ]

feel great . . . rarely better
:thumbsup:

and

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Every review site with the exception of B3D said the X1800XT was louder. Whether or not they said it whined may have been an overspeculation on my part after reading a few that said it. Including the wrrrrr comment. However, none of this justifies your cherry picking comments. How about commenting on that? While we wait for Mr. Kubicki.

He'll [probably] be back on Monday . . . when this forum will get better [some] moderation, coincidently.

and the "louder" was NOT like NV30's Dustbuster vs. r9700P.
:roll:

 

[cronic]

anybody who can take a step back and look at the video card buisness over the last 18 months would have to come to the conclusion that Nvidia is on top of the market. Weither or not that remains going foward is anybodys guess, but come on guys while ati fanboys go on and on about the "next gen" r5---, nvidia has product on shelves for sale in quantity. I realize that we can go get a 1800xt now if we want it,but its November 2005 for gods sake. If I waited on ati next gen I would still be using a 9800xt. If ati does ever get back on top I will be more than happy to spend my money on there product again, but in the last 18 months they haven't so nvidia has gotton alot of my cash. Just my .02

 

[Corporate Thug]

seriously guys, we are arguing over a moot point. i know about 4-5 real hardcore gamers who own or would own a piece of equipment like the 7 series or the x1800 series. NONE OF THEM CARE ABOUT WHICH ONE IS SLIGHTLY QUIETER

 

[Regs]

Originally posted by: cronic
anybody who can take a step back and look at the video card buisness over the last 18 months would have to come to the conclusion that Nvidia is on top of the market. Weither or not that remains going foward is anybodys guess, but come on guys while ati fanboys go on and on about the "next gen" r5---, nvidia has product on shelves for sale in quantity. I realize that we can go get a 1800xt now if we want it,but its November 2005 for gods sake. If I waited on ati next gen I would still be using a 9800xt. If ati does ever get back on top I will be more than happy to spend my money on there product again, but in the last 18 months they haven't so nvidia has gotton alot of my cash. Just my .02

No one can argue that Nvidia right now is dominitating the Desk-Top segment. Just like how ATi is dominating the mobile market right now.

Nvidia is doing what it does best in their league. Winning over OEMs and customers. Hopefully now they can also win over developers and software companies to give enough reason for some specific targeted customers to upgrade.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: solofly
B3D's owner is an Ati fanboy in case you guys didn't know.

He is, but he's a damn nice guy and very knowledgeable about this stuff. I used to have a blast debating Dave on 3dfx Gamers when I was "Fred Sanford".

Frankly, we need guys like Dave who have inside connections at ATI and can give us the scoop on what they're up to.

IMO, you read his stuff like you do mine these days: we each have our preferences and our reasons for having them. (although I'm about 1/10000th as "in the loop" as Dave as I'm just a gamer at the edge of nowhere who's lucky enough to have a buddy in the industry)

If I were Dave and getting alpha hardware and news 6 months in advance from ATI I'd probably post things like "The 6800U 2slot, the 7800GTX single slot, and the 7800GTX Quadro cooled all have exactly the same dB output!" as well.

He's differentiated his site by being the man of ATI, nothing wrong with that.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Hacp

Originally posted by: apoppin
strange how the legitimate threads get locked and flamebait crap like this keeps going.

ATI isn't behind . . . they are 'even' with nVidia's 7800GTX with the x1800xt and and yet to answer the 'ultra' with the xtpe . . . with r580 due in January, i'd say it's nVidia's turn to be "behind".
:roll:

maybe rollo finally became a mod?

naw . . . everytime he jumps into a legitimate thread with FUD - flames are the response and it gets locked . . .

notice the video mod seems to have a 9-5 [hit-or-miss] job here; M-Sat
hmmm

Ouch. I hope he's not working M-Sat unless he has his own company and is sacrificing for an early retirement?

 

[Hacp]

Originally posted by: cronic
anybody who can take a step back and look at the video card buisness over the last 18 months would have to come to the conclusion that Nvidia is on top of the market. Weither or not that remains going foward is anybodys guess, but come on guys while ati fanboys go on and on about the "next gen" r5---, nvidia has product on shelves for sale in quantity. I realize that we can go get a 1800xt now if we want it,but its November 2005 for gods sake. If I waited on ati next gen I would still be using a 9800xt. If ati does ever get back on top I will be more than happy to spend my money on there product again, but in the last 18 months they haven't so nvidia has gotton alot of my cash. Just my .02

Nvidia is on the top of the market right now, as It is catering to all three pricepoints, and to a certain extent, a niche market. They have the 6600 DDR2 for the low-mid end, the 6800GS for the mid-high end, and the 7800GT for the high end, while they have a niche product in the 7800GTX 512 for the extreme gamer without a budget. The only card that is competative with Nvidia right now is the Connect3D X800GTO that has like a 95% chance to unlock pipes. And thats not even an ATI sanctioned card.

Nvidia is NOT 2 generations ahead. They aren't even one generation ahead. But Nvidia has the better price points right now.

 

[Ackmed]

If you dont believe his finding rollo, why not go make a thread over there asking about it? Im sure he will answer you publicly. I await your thread over there.

Originally posted by: Rollo
Ouch. I hope he's not working M-Sat unless he has his own company and is sacrificing for an early retirement?

Maybe he just doesnt have the time, doing other things. I didnt even turn on my PC Friday.

Originally posted by: apoppin

and the "louder" was NOT like NV30's Dustbuster vs. r9700P.
:roll:

Which is exactly the point I made. And why I said comparing the 7800 GTX and X1800XT to the 5800U and 9700 Pro is, at best, silly. Its not even close how much louder the 5800U was to the 9700 Pro.

 

[5150Joker]

Two generations behind? That's a pretty bold statement. If that were the case, then ATi's closest competitor to an nVidia high end card should be at least 2-3x slower. If it isn't then this thread is worthless flamebait. Anyway, I've decided I'm going to see if I can get someone to trade me an XT for my GTX + $100. Been wanting to try something different for awhile now.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Ackmed
If you dont believe his finding rollo, why not go make a thread over there asking about it? Im sure he will answer you publicly. I await your thread over there.

You got it chief, although I like Wavey Dave and don't really like the idea of "calling him out" on his own site.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

So a "wrrrrrr" sound isn't significant, over a "shhhhhhh" sound? I beg to differ.
Nothing is getting stretched here bro. Every snippit you took from each review did not reflect the true findings of each reviewer. That in itself should be considered biased.

only in your mind

Appopin, I must say you have undergone the most unbelivable transformation over the last few months. You went from level headed, neutral and objective and did a 180. So what happened? Thought it was time for a change in your life to spice it up a bit? What gives? My God, you didn't even use a smiley in this post. Highly unusal. Feeling alright? :beer:

you [and much of this forum] became [even more rabid] nVidia fanboys . . .

i simply became "louder" to provide the balance and objectivity you now lack.

and it's "apoppin"
[small 'a' . . . the 'double p' is after the 'o' . . . like a' poppin' ]

feel great . . . rarely better
:thumbsup:

and

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
Every review site with the exception of B3D said the X1800XT was louder. Whether or not they said it whined may have been an overspeculation on my part after reading a few that said it. Including the wrrrrr comment. However, none of this justifies your cherry picking comments. How about commenting on that? While we wait for Mr. Kubicki.

He'll [probably] be back on Monday . . . when this forum will get better [some] moderation, coincidently.

and the "louder" was NOT like NV30's Dustbuster vs. r9700P.
:roll:

I believe I have more objectivity than you lately. But, when you're right, you're right. All this means is that you don't really know any better than I do except for what you read/hear.

 

[Keysplayr]

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: cronic
anybody who can take a step back and look at the video card buisness over the last 18 months would have to come to the conclusion that Nvidia is on top of the market. Weither or not that remains going foward is anybodys guess, but come on guys while ati fanboys go on and on about the "next gen" r5---, nvidia has product on shelves for sale in quantity. I realize that we can go get a 1800xt now if we want it,but its November 2005 for gods sake. If I waited on ati next gen I would still be using a 9800xt. If ati does ever get back on top I will be more than happy to spend my money on there product again, but in the last 18 months they haven't so nvidia has gotton alot of my cash. Just my .02

No one can argue that Nvidia right now is dominitating the Desk-Top segment. Just like how ATi is dominating the mobile market right now.

Nvidia is doing what it does best in their league. Winning over OEMs and customers. Hopefully now they can also win over developers and software companies to give enough reason for some specific targeted customers to upgrade.

What is ATI dominating the mobile market with?

 

[buzzsaw13]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: cronic
anybody who can take a step back and look at the video card buisness over the last 18 months would have to come to the conclusion that Nvidia is on top of the market. Weither or not that remains going foward is anybodys guess, but come on guys while ati fanboys go on and on about the "next gen" r5---, nvidia has product on shelves for sale in quantity. I realize that we can go get a 1800xt now if we want it,but its November 2005 for gods sake. If I waited on ati next gen I would still be using a 9800xt. If ati does ever get back on top I will be more than happy to spend my money on there product again, but in the last 18 months they haven't so nvidia has gotton alot of my cash. Just my .02

No one can argue that Nvidia right now is dominitating the Desk-Top segment. Just like how ATi is dominating the mobile market right now.

Nvidia is doing what it does best in their league. Winning over OEMs and customers. Hopefully now they can also win over developers and software companies to give enough reason for some specific targeted customers to upgrade.

What is ATI dominating the mobile market with?

According to their site the best mobile gpu theyve got is the X800XT mobile, which would get stomped by the 7800GTX go.

 

[5150Joker]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003

Originally posted by: Regs

Originally posted by: cronic
anybody who can take a step back and look at the video card buisness over the last 18 months would have to come to the conclusion that Nvidia is on top of the market. Weither or not that remains going foward is anybodys guess, but come on guys while ati fanboys go on and on about the "next gen" r5---, nvidia has product on shelves for sale in quantity. I realize that we can go get a 1800xt now if we want it,but its November 2005 for gods sake. If I waited on ati next gen I would still be using a 9800xt. If ati does ever get back on top I will be more than happy to spend my money on there product again, but in the last 18 months they haven't so nvidia has gotton alot of my cash. Just my .02

No one can argue that Nvidia right now is dominitating the Desk-Top segment. Just like how ATi is dominating the mobile market right now.

Nvidia is doing what it does best in their league. Winning over OEMs and customers. Hopefully now they can also win over developers and software companies to give enough reason for some specific targeted customers to upgrade.

What is ATI dominating the mobile market with?

Probably just volume sales. Performance wise they're pretty far behind now.

 

[fierydemise]

Just to get an opinion on noise from a real user, I PMed bjc112 and heres what he said

Not much louder than my x850xt ( which I thought was relatively quiet ) Yet louder than my 6800GT.

I have only heard the fan changelevels a few times.. AFter gaming for an hour or so, I will hear it step up to the next level (maybe 2500rpms ) and its not bad..

HOWEVER, if you used the manual setting, cranked it up o 5000rpms.. The SOB is LOUD!

Overall though, not bad at all.. Nothing that would personally cause me to bitch, and my machine is rather quiet!

Bryan!

 

[us3rnotfound]

woah easy tiger, you're very emotional right now

 

[solofly]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: solofly
B3D's owner is an Ati fanboy in case you guys didn't know.

He is, but he's a damn nice guy and very knowledgeable about this stuff. I used to have a blast debating Dave on 3dfx Gamers when I was "Fred Sanford".

Frankly, we need guys like Dave who have inside connections at ATI and can give us the scoop on what they're up to.

IMO, you read his stuff like you do mine these days: we each have our preferences and our reasons for having them. (although I'm about 1/10000th as "in the loop" as Dave as I'm just a gamer at the edge of nowhere who's lucky enough to have a buddy in the industry)

If I were Dave and getting alpha hardware and news 6 months in advance from ATI I'd probably post things like "The 6800U 2slot, the 7800GTX single slot, and the 7800GTX Quadro cooled all have exactly the same dB output!" as well.

He's differentiated his site by being the man of ATI, nothing wrong with that.

Dave maybe a nice guy, I just wouldn't take what's written on that site seriously and that's all.

 

[nRollo]

I take Dave with a grain of salt. There is good info with the bad on his site, if he had no bias he'd be a stellar reviewer.

I suppose we all have some.

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: keysplayr2003
I believe I have more objectivity than you lately. But, when you're right, you're right. All this means is that you don't really know any better than I do except for what you read/hear.

i knew you'd understand . . . and of course you feel you're more objective [now] than me.
knowledge . . . for sure . . . of course not.
:thumbsup: