Atheists sue to stop Christian mentoring

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
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Atheists sue to stop
Christian mentoring
'Our Constitution was very purposefully written to be a godless document'
© 2004 WorldNetDaily.com

The Wisconsin-based atheist group Freedom From Religion Foundation is suing to cut off federal funding to a Christian child-mentoring program that helps troubled kids.

Last year, the federal government awarded a $225,000 contract, part of $9 million awarded to 52 Arizona groups, to Phoenix-based MentorKids USA, according to the Madison, Wisc.-based Capital Times.

The lawsuit, presided over by U.S. Judge John Shabaz, is demanding a summary judgment that federal funding of the program cease until the government "has a demonstrated plan in place to comply with its constitutional obligations," reports the Wisconsin paper.

Citing the First Amendment, the atheist foundation said, "Mentoring to convert is not a suitable social service to be provided by the government," said the report.

MentorKids USA was launched in 1997 by Orville Krieger, in partnership with Charles Colson's Prison Fellowship, "to address the needs of at-risk youth in the Phoenix, Arizona, metropolitan area by matching caring Christian adults with youth ages 8-17 who showed warning signs of becoming criminal offenders," says the Christian organization's website.

Originally called Phoenix MatchPoint, the group changed its name last January to MentorKids USA. It has a long and successful track record in mentoring children in trouble with the law, who have dysfunctional family backgrounds, have been physically or sexually abused or who are involved with drug or alcohol abuse. To date, MentorKids USA has helped over 500 kids.

In the program, mentors commit time each week to be a friend and role model for an at-risk youth. The mentors "offer concrete expressions of unconditional love and support to the mentee," says the group's website, "and the two participate in activities designed to build friendship, trust, and constructive values."

Some of the Freedom From Religion Foundation's "legal accomplishments," according to its website, include:

Winning the first federal lawsuit challenging direct funding by the government of a faith-based agency

Overturning a state Good Friday holiday

Winning a lawsuit barring direct taxpayer subsidy of religious schools

Removing Ten Commandments monuments and crosses from public land

Halting the Post Office from issuing religious cancellations

Ending 51 years years of illegal bible instruction in public schools
According to its website, the non-profit foundation was incorporated in Wisconsin in 1978 and is "a national membership association of freethinkers: atheists, agnostics and skeptics of any pedigree."

Why is it concerned with what it calls "state/church entanglement?"

"First Amendment violations are accelerating," says the group's website. "The religious right is campaigning to raid the public till and advance religion at taxpayer expense, attacking our secular public schools, the rights of nonbelievers, and the Establishment Clause.

"The Foundation recognizes that the United States was first among nations to adopt a secular Constitution. The founders who wrote the U.S. Constitution wanted citizens to be free to support the church of their choice, or no religion at all. Our Constitution was very purposefully written to be a godless document, whose only references to religion are exclusionary.

"It is vital to buttress the Jeffersonian 'wall of separation between church and state' which has served our nation so well."

But William Rehnquist, current chief justice of the United States Supreme Court, says this view put forth by the Freedom From Religion Foundation, the ACLU and similar groups is a fiction and mockery of the true meaning of the First Amendment.

The Establishment Clause, explained Rehnquist in a 1985 opinion, "forbade establishment of a national religion, and forbade preference among religious sects or denominations. ? The Establishment Clause did not require government neutrality between religion and irreligion nor did it prohibit the Federal Government from providing nondiscriminatory aid to religion. There is simply no historical foundation for the proposition that the Framers intended to build the 'wall of separation' [between church and state]."

It's too bad the idealogues are using their twisted and perverted interpretation of the First Amendment to hinder troubled children from getting the assistance that they desperately need.
 

AFB

Lifer
Jan 10, 2004
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If thier intetion is to convert, no, but otherwise I don't see a problem.

Edit: WorldNetDaily. makes Fox look like the people's paper.
 

eigen

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Nov 19, 2003
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"We believe that all people are lost sinners and cannot see the Kingdom of God except through the new birth. Justification is by grace through faith in Christ alone.

We believe in one holy, universal and apostolic Church. Its calling is to worship God and witness concerning its Head, Jesus Christ, preaching the Gospel among all nations and demonstrating its commitment by compassionate service to the needs of human beings and promoting righteousness and justice."

"We believe that Jesus Christ will personally and visibly return in glory to raise the dead and bring salvation and judgment to completion. God will fully manifest His kingdom when He establishes a new heaven and new earth, in which He will be glorified forever, and exclude all evil, suffering, and death.
"

http://www.mentorkidsusa.org/about-us.html
 

eigen

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2003
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If you are gonna take federal funds you cant pick and choose based on religous prefrence.

http://www.mentorkidsusa.org/faq.html

7. Why do you only accept Christian mentors?

As a faith-based organization, MentorKids USA is a ministry to kids and their families. The most valuable aspect of what we have to offer is the love of Jesus Christ. While we believe that other mentoring programs have great merit, it is important to us that our mentors are equipped to share the good news of who Jesus is and how He can provide a future and a hope for anyone.

 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
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We believe in...demonstrating its (the churches) commitment by compassionate service to the needs of human beings

Great! They're practicing what they preach by serving troubled children by "offer(ing) concrete expressions of unconditional love and support..."
 

eigen

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2003
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Originally posted by: Riprorin
We believe in...demonstrating its (the churches) commitment by compassionate service to the needs of human beings

Great! They're practicing what they preach by serving troubled children by "offer(ing) concrete expressions of unconditional love and support..."


You ignored my above post .Where they flatly state if you are not christian they will not let you volunteer.
Why should my tax dollars go to something that I cannot even help with.
You dont want your taxes going to NEA art that is blashpemous, or welfare queens...etc....I dont want mine going to religous groups promoting agendas that are not mine.It is not a hard concept ..do not force me at gunpoint to pay for things i do not believe in.I support your right not too...do you support mine?
 

Riprorin

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Apr 25, 2000
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I'm glad to see that you have the good sense not to argue that it's a First Amendment issue.
 

eigen

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2003
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Originally posted by: Riprorin
I'm glad to see that you have the good sense not to argue that it's a First Amendment issue.

Respond to my post.Should they be able to use federal dollars or not.
Its not a First amendment issue its a civil rights one.
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
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Originally posted by: Riprorin
We believe in...demonstrating its (the churches) commitment by compassionate service to the needs of human beings

Great! They're practicing what they preach by serving troubled children by "offer(ing) concrete expressions of unconditional love and support..."


Their offering of services is based on the recipient accepting indoctrination into the Chrisian Army.

Is that fair and righteous
 

TuxDave

Lifer
Oct 8, 2002
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Originally posted by: eigen
If you are gonna take federal funds you cant pick and choose based on religous prefrence.

http://www.mentorkidsusa.org/faq.html

7. Why do you only accept Christian mentors?

As a faith-based organization, MentorKids USA is a ministry to kids and their families. The most valuable aspect of what we have to offer is the love of Jesus Christ. While we believe that other mentoring programs have great merit, it is important to us that our mentors are equipped to share the good news of who Jesus is and how He can provide a future and a hope for anyone.

oooooh... damn, that's not good. Good point.
 

eigen

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2003
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Originally posted by: Riprorin
How is it a civil rights issue?

The 1972 expansion to the civil right bill, only allowed for religous groups receiving federal funding to discriminate based on religon only for paid employees not volunteers.which is clearly what they are doing.
 

jagec

Lifer
Apr 30, 2004
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Originally posted by: dahunan
Originally posted by: Riprorin
We believe in...demonstrating its (the churches) commitment by compassionate service to the needs of human beings

Great! They're practicing what they preach by serving troubled children by "offer(ing) concrete expressions of unconditional love and support..."


Their offering of services is based on the recipient accepting indoctrination into the Chrisian Army.

Is that fair and righteous

The mentors have to be Christian, but the kids don't...it's iffy whether they should get federal funding though.
 

Gaard

Diamond Member
Feb 17, 2002
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Originally posted by: eigen
Originally posted by: Riprorin
I'm glad to see that you have the good sense not to argue that it's a First Amendment issue.

Respond to my post.Should they be able to use federal dollars or not.

What's your answer, Rip?
 

dahunan

Lifer
Jan 10, 2002
18,191
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Originally posted by: Gaard
Originally posted by: eigen
Originally posted by: Riprorin
I'm glad to see that you have the good sense not to argue that it's a First Amendment issue.

Respond to my post.Should they be able to use federal dollars or not.

What's your answer, Rip?

[Rip]"There is no Federal Govt without GOD" - so sure they should be albe to""[/Rip]
 

imported_Condor

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Sep 22, 2004
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See, President Clinton was years ahead of himself. He had Minister Jessee Jackson mentoring him every two weeks during his administration.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
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www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: Gaard
Originally posted by: eigen
Originally posted by: Riprorin
I'm glad to see that you have the good sense not to argue that it's a First Amendment issue.

Respond to my post.Should they be able to use federal dollars or not.

What's your answer, Rip?

He won't answer. He's thrilled about the expamsion of the Christain Army even though it trashes the Constitution and Amendments. Especially bein part of the Fealess Liar agenda.
 

Drift3r

Guest
Jun 3, 2003
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Originally posted by: Condor
See, President Clinton was years ahead of himself. He had Minister Jessee Jackson mentoring him every two weeks during his administration.


Was Jesse being paid to mentor using tax payer money ? If so then Clinton was WRONG !! If Jessie was doing it for free on his own time then it's not a problem.
 

Forsythe

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May 2, 2004
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Say Rip, if someone was doing the exactly same thing, and they were muslims, wouldn't you be yellnig out on them "creating terrorists hell-bent on destroying america"?¨

I think it's wrong, because indoctrinating a child is not good, they're stypid, they have a right to choose, and that is not what this is doing.
And don't say they're not trying to convert them. If their webbie is that far out and sickening, they damned well are!
 

Riprorin

Banned
Apr 25, 2000
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He won't answer. He's thrilled about the expamsion of the Christain Army even though it trashes the Constitution and Amendments. Especially bein part of the Fealess Liar agenda

Please explain how it "trashes the Constitution and Amendments".
 

eigen

Diamond Member
Nov 19, 2003
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Originally posted by: Riprorin
He won't answer. He's thrilled about the expamsion of the Christain Army even though it trashes the Constitution and Amendments. Especially bein part of the Fealess Liar agenda

Please explain how it "trashes the Constitution and Amendments".

Should they get to use federal dollars or not. Please ignore Dmcowen He is the retarded brother of this board and he allows people to sidestep the issue.Federal money: approve or disapprove?If you approve then they HAVE to allow non-christians to volunteer.If they dont then they get no dough.
 

dmcowen674

No Lifer
Oct 13, 1999
54,889
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www.alienbabeltech.com
Originally posted by: eigen
Originally posted by: Riprorin
He won't answer. He's thrilled about the expamsion of the Christain Army even though it trashes the Constitution and Amendments. Especially bein part of the Fealess Liar agenda

Please explain how it "trashes the Constitution and Amendments".

Should they get to use federal dollars or not. Please ignore Dmcowen He is the retarded brother of this board and he allows people to sidestep the issue.Federal money: approve or disapprove?If you approve then they HAVE to allow non-christians to volunteer.If they dont then they get no dough.

OK, I am retarded but how do I personally "allow" the FLL's to "sidestep" the issues??? :confused:

Oh and how it "trashes the Constitution and Amendments", come on, because it has been rendered null and void by the FLL Agenda of course, surely have to realize that by now, you folks voted for it.
 

imported_Condor

Diamond Member
Sep 22, 2004
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The question is whether Jessee has ever done anything for free. He has to pay for those suits! It may be tough to trace the dollars, but I would bet they flowed.