Asking Ryan Smith of AT if a special examination could be done?

[Keysplayr]

You're really trying hard to make this into a big deal, aren't you?

It already IS a big deal if it proves that TR and H are accurate. I'm just trying to get some investigations going. I hope you don't have a problem with that.

EDITED for clarity.

 

[Final8ty]

 

[Hitman928]

It already IS a big deal. I'm just trying to get some investigations going. I hope you don't have a problem with that.

Lol, read my post again (I've added an additional section as well) and you'll know the answer to that, I think I made my feelings pretty clear.

Final8ty pretty much sums up the thread at this point.

 

[Keysplayr]

Lol, read my post again (I've added an additional section as well) and you'll know the answer to that, I think I made my feelings pretty clear.

Final8ty pretty much sums up the thread at this point.

Yeah, he doesn't show much interest in this issue.

Ok, emailed Hardware Canucks editor.

 

[Final8ty]

Yeah, he doesn't show much interest in this issue.

I do have interest in it, but until i see any results i simply don't care any more and neither am i going to waste any more time taking about it.

 

[Keysplayr]

I do have interest in it, but until i see any results i simply don't care any more and neither am i going to waste any more time taking about it.

I thought you left? Hung your hat and everything?
Seriously though, that is fine. I'll PM you with any updates.

 

[Final8ty]

I thought you left? Hung your hat and everything?
Seriously though, that is fine. I'll PM you with any updates.

I can read the thread myself thanks.

 

[3DVagabond]

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/video-cards/58304-hd7950-vs-gtx660ti.html

We aren't the only ones guys. Word is pretty much widespread. Now it's all a matter of all these review sites tackling the investigation. I'm sending an email to hardware canucks editor and I'd advise all who are for this investigation, follow up the email to them. Especially if you're an actual member there.
This probably goes for any other forum you guys subscribe to, so, if you want it done, there needs to be active requests for it.

There's one poster at HWCanucks who posted about this. Below is SKYMTL's response

I think the conclusion in this is straightforward:

Can you benchmark an "experience"? NO!

A bit cryptic, but seems like his experience doesn't match up with the benchmarks.

 

[Keysplayr]

I completely disagree. of course an experience can be conveyed as you have seen on both TR and H. just because you refuse to accept or believe doesnt mean everyone has their head in the sand.

 

[cmdrdredd]

*-*
The whole argument of, "if you can't see it, then it's irrelevant" needs to be shot down and never come again. If you couldn't see the FPS being produced and were perfectly happy with 15FPS, then there wouldn't be much purpose to review graphics cards other than their boxes are pretty and the HSF is cool looking! The standards have been raised...if microstutter doesn't bother you, then you're not perceptive enough to see it, you're in denial, your eyes and brain aren't trained to recognize it, or you just don't care. Either way, you're out of this discussion.
*-*

Wow someone gets it. If we never looked at the FPS counter and played the game without any hitching we would never know we were only getting 50fps or whatever number.

Remember the time that NO card was getting more than 25fps average on Ultra in Crysis? The game ran smoothly, but at 25fps. So what did I do? Ran it at 25fps and turned fraps off and not once was my experience ruined.

I've gotten picky now that I have SLI, but only to a point. I want good framerates but I don't sacrifice graphic quality settings to have it. So I turn off FPS counters, turn everything up to max and start from there. Anything feel off I start bu reducing AA and then check online for possible fixes if that doesn't smooth out the game for me.

More arrogant BS from someone who is telling everyone they are too stupid to notice they have stutter. Not one single person on this entire thread has stated they get 15 FPS and are happy with it. So feel free to create a strawman argument so you can knock it down with ease.

How can you assume that because I (or any other person) said they notice no stutter that we are just not noticing it. What if, shock horror, we are actually correct.

If someone tests two seperated GPUs, a GTX 680 and a HD 7970 but notices no stutter with either. Why is their opinion to be discounted? Why are the to be told they have no place in this discussion?

Have you tested both current gen AMD and Nvidia GPUs in games? Do you notice any stutter? I care not one jot about the opinion of someone who has tested neither but implies a chart has more truth to it than the honest opinion of someone who has physically tested the cards in question.

1) reference crysis back in 2007. That game never went above 30fps on ultra even with a $600 GPU at the time. Nobody cried about the fps then because the game was properly coded so that even that low of a framerate produced smooth gameplay.

2) Nobody in this thread telling you single GPU solutions stutter to the point it's distracting. Sure a few people might have mentioned it. This is more of a problem with SLI vs X-Fire. I have followed every post and more than once people have said that single card solutions are about the same with one that I remember just a page back mentioning single card microstutter being seen.

3) It matters not what you see or don't see. You don't see the unemployment rate in front of your eyes but with that fancy chart on the TV you can see the trend of the job market right? It's the same thing. Turn off the FPS counter and you don't see the FPS but that chart in the benchmarks will tell you how a particular GPU handles a specific game.

When you say things like "I don't see it so it doesn't exist" it's like saying you have never seen a Snow Leopard so it's all fake.

 

[Rvenger]

I do have interest in it, but until i see any results i simply don't care any more and neither am i going to waste any more time taking about it.

+1


I notice the older I get, the less I care about issues such as zomg my card stutters in skyrim without vsync. This issue is really getting boring since there is no concrete evidence of a consistency of microstutter amongst other game titles. I can load up Heaven on the old 304.79 NVidia drivers and watch textures flicker all day if I want too.

 

[pandemonium]

More arrogant BS from someone who is telling everyone they are too stupid to notice they have stutter. Not one single person on this entire thread has stated they get 15 FPS and are happy with it. So feel free to create a strawman argument so you can knock it down with ease.

How can you assume that because I (or any other person) said they notice no stutter that we are just not noticing it. What if, shock horror, we are actually correct.

If someone tests two seperated GPUs, a GTX 680 and a HD 7970 but notices no stutter with either. Why is their opinion to be discounted? Why are the to be told they have no place in this discussion?

Have you tested both current gen AMD and Nvidia GPUs in games? Do you notice any stutter? I care not one jot about the opinion of someone who has tested neither but implies a chart has more truth to it than the honest opinion of someone who has physically tested the cards in question.

That's not what I said at all. Get your head on straight then read it again. It was a simple analogy; one which went over your head. Just because you don't see something doesn't make it untrue. That was my point.

Also, objective analysis > personal experiences. Or do you believe every anecdotal story you hear about random events from some stranger? You're on the completely wrong side of the argument to have any bearing in trying to perceive what's factual and not just perceived.

 

[ICDP]

That's not what I said at all. Get your head on straight then read it again. It was a simple analogy; one which went over your head. Just because you don't see something doesn't make it untrue. That was my point.

Also, objective analysis > personal experiences. Or do you believe every anecdotal story you hear about random events from some stranger? You're on the completely wrong side of the argument to have any bearing in trying to perceive what's factual and not just perceived.

Your problem is that it isn't just my subjective opinion, it is data from other sites as well. For example [H] did a performance review of AC3 and not once did they mention excessive unplayable stutter on the HD 79x0 cards. Also they get 20% extra performance out of a 7950 in the game compared to TR at similar settings. So stop with the BS we are all wrong, unless you think [H] and other review sites are also wrong and cannot be objective.

 

[pandemonium]

Your problem is that it isn't just my subjective opinion, it is data from other sites as well. For example [H] did a performance review of AC3 and not once did they mention excessive unplayable stutter on the HD 79x0 cards. Also they get 20% extra performance out of a 7950 in the game compared to TR at similar settings. So stop with the BS we are all wrong, unless you think [H] and other review sites are also wrong and cannot be objective.

You're hanging your legitimacy of advocating ignorance of microstutter being objectively analyzed with the fact that a [H]ard review of one game didn't mention issues experiencing it while using a single HD7950?

I have no problems with if you [or anyone else] don't experience microstutter. That's great! That means you can enjoy your games more than any of us who do. However, those of us that do experience it want to know how to avoid it - at the hardware purchasing level - if at all possible. That's what this thread is about; regardless if a hidden nVidia promotion scheme going on (I'm not saying there is and I couldn't care less if that is the case).

What is it that you're so ferverous about, exactly? Because you've completely lost me (and probably everyone else here) aside from trying to prove the differences between AMD and nVidia hardware and which is superior.

I think you're making way too many assumptions about where people stand and drawing lines for some holy side-war.

 

[VulgarDisplay]

You don't need to be an AMD fanboy to want to stop any unproven FUD about their brand. The company is in enough trouble as it is. The only people who pay the price if AMD suffers another driver perception fiasco like they did in the past is consumers. Their GPU business is about the only thing going for the company so if people stop buying them because of rumors AMD then goes down the toilet faster.

Then we all get to enjoy $900 nvidia mid range single GPU's for eternity. Hooray...

 

[Jaydip]

That is precisely why we need a objective analysis and I trust AT will do it justice.

 

[Dribble]

You don't need to be an AMD fanboy to want to stop any unproven FUD about their brand. The company is in enough trouble as it is. The only people who pay the price if AMD suffers another driver perception fiasco like they did in the past is consumers. Their GPU business is about the only thing going for the company so if people stop buying them because of rumors AMD then goes down the toilet faster.

Then we all get to enjoy $900 nvidia mid range single GPU's for eternity. Hooray...

So basically you'll do nearly anything to defend AMD and keep them in business including overlooking problems they have with their drivers. That is at least more truthful then many in this thread.

 

[Lonbjerg]

So basically you'll do nearly anything to defend AMD and keep them in business including overlooking problems they have with their drivers. That is at least more truthful then many in this thread.

More truthfull.... but not no more sane, logical...or intelligent.
So because AMD cannot run a buisness....they need "special" treament...according to "special" people...really?

 

[3DVagabond]

You don't need to be an AMD fanboy to want to stop any unproven FUD about their brand. The company is in enough trouble as it is. The only people who pay the price if AMD suffers another driver perception fiasco like they did in the past is consumers. Their GPU business is about the only thing going for the company so if people stop buying them because of rumors AMD then goes down the toilet faster.

Then we all get to enjoy $900 nvidia mid range single GPU's for eternity. Hooray...

^^^This is what he said and somehow you guys read...

So basically you'll do nearly anything to defend AMD and keep them in business including overlooking problems they have with their drivers.

So because AMD cannot run a buisness....they need "special" treament...

Are both of you really that bad at reading comprehension?

 

[Lonbjerg]

^^^This is what he said and somehow you guys read...





Are both of you really that bad at reading comprehension?

Are you deliberatly trying to make me mad?
Or are you just dishonest?

 

[3DVagabond]

Are you deliberatly trying to make me mad?
Or are you just dishonest?

Nope.

 

[Keysplayr]

Are you deliberatly trying to make me mad?
Or are you just dishonest?

We read between the lines. It's easy to see what VD inferred.
3DVagabond can read between the lines to, but only for posts with opposing views.
Must think we're schtoopid or something. ::shrugs::

 

[Lonbjerg]

Nope.

I beg to differ.
Ah well..of to ignore with you...you consider factfinding a waste of time...then you are a waste of time for me.

 

[BrightCandle]

Just because AMD is in trouble does not mean we should buy their broken kit. It does in fact mean the opposite. They are (potentially) cheating on fps in anyway they think nobody can notice to win benchmarks they really shouldn't be winning without the cheat.

I just hope AMD takes this seriously, because they still havent fixed the majority of the bugs i raised in january, one of which is microstutter. They have known about the problem for 10 months and let it fester. Let's hope they turn their dreadful customer support around.

 

[blackened23]

Are you deliberatly trying to make me mad?
Or are you just dishonest?